We Can’t Escape Politics When Being Skirted Is Political

[ziggy_encaoua]

How much some would like think they’re ‘apolitical’ round these parts they can’t escape being political if seen public skirted.

This is because part of our cause is for ‘gender equality’ & how much someone might deny that being skirted in public is ‘political’ as the issue of ‘gender equality’ is politicized.

[crfriend]

How much some would like think they’re ‘apolitical’ round these parts they can’t escape being political if seen public skirted.

Whether we have strong political beliefs or not is really, I suspect, rather immaterial to what we decide to wear. In point of fact, I think the "need" or desire to politicise everything is more corrosive than not when it comes to fashion because we run the risk of being more offensive to people if we run around with a political chip on our shoulders all the time.

It's "bad enough" that we look (and in looking, act) differently from the mainstream. Why compound that by needlessly offending the sensibilities of others based on what our political leanings are?

While one of our basic tenets is equality of the sexes/genders, that, in and of itself, is a societal issue not a political one. This is a case where the second is usurping the first for its own ends. I wonder how a trained sociologist would approach this matter.

[Departed Member]

It's "bad enough" that we look (and in looking, act) differently from the mainstream. Why compound that by needlessly offending the sensibilities of others based on what our political leanings are?

There seems to be a major difference between what is perceived as 'political' in the USA and the UK here. By and large, folk in the UK do not get 'offended' by another's 'political 'viewpoint - unless it is way, way too far 'over the edge'. The dead hand of 'political correctness' descended upon the UK in the mid-Eighties (from the USA?), and peaked around 2000. One indirect by-product was 'fashion-cloning', i.e., everyone 'should' look the same. A Socialist Utopia, by any other name(?). The fight-back against 'political correctness' is now more than a ground swell. Most of this stems from the ordinary, working people of the UK, regardless of which party they may choose (or not!) to vote for. There's no doubt this relaxation will help our 'cause' here. But we've one h*ll of a journey, if we are to even approach the 'fashion freedoms' of the Seventies. And, yes, Ziggy is right - it really is political!

[Bob]

Like other advocacy groups, SkirtCafe is non-partisan and focuses only on a narrow set of political issues. If someone would like to discuss current candidates and highlight their positions on men's fashion and gender issues, that would be a good contribution to this forum. However, I haven't seen that yet. Random political discussion is not part of SkirtCafe.

Ron Paul has nothing to do with wearing skirts, nor does he have anything to do with politics for someone living in the UK.

Ziggy, your actions have become disruptive:
1. You live in the UK, Ron Paul is an American candidate. That is strange, like you're just trying to bait American management.
2. You put up Ron Paul in your signature immediately after we made it clear that politics is not part of SkirtCafe. The timing seemed to be an attempt to test us to see if we really are serious about the "no politics" rule.
3. Other than the political message, which goes against SkirtCafe policy, your signature now takes up far too much screen real estate on the typical user's browser. It's like always pushing your way up to the front of the line, screaming to everyone "look at me!"
4. You have ignored members' suggestions that you put political messages on your own website. We have never restricted your practice of mentioning your own website and providing links to it from SkirtCafe, even prominent banner-ad links in your signature. Why is that not enough for you?
5. You continue to push the issue of politics in multiple different threads, even after we have clarified SkirtCafe's position on the subject multiple times. It's like you're trying every way you can to drive a wedge into this community and make management look stupid.

I am saying this publicly because your actions on the matter of politics continue to be public, and they affect everyone in this community. We have made the rules clear, and there is plenty of support in this community for those rules. And SkirtCafe IS a community, it's not a one-man-show. Please do not continue to goad SkirtCafe management as you have been doing for the past few days.

As usual, this thread is open to comments from members at large...

[ziggy_encaoua]

I wonder how a trained sociologist would approach this matter.

I've a degree in social science so I guess I'm a socialogist however I've not time to answer right now

[ziggy_encaoua]

L
I am saying this publicly because your actions on the matter of politics continue to be public, and they affect everyone in this community. We have made the rules clear, and there is plenty of support in this community for those rules. And SkirtCafe IS a community, it's not a one-man-show. Please do not continue to goad SkirtCafe management as you have been doing for the past few days.

Well stop restricting a fundamental human right of free expression

[Bob]

Freedom of speech is a fundamental human right. In cyberspace, we all have the fundamental human right to create websites and say whatever we want on them. No one at SkirtCafe is restricting that right, nor would that even be possible. Defiant-angel.com is alive and well, and I have also made it clear that links to that website are welcome on SkirtCafe.

However, there is no human right of going onto someone else's website and putting stuff there that is not welcome. Political discussion is not welcome on SkirtCafe, and that policy is supported by the majority of the membership.

This is not so different from the physical public sphere. You can hang signs on your own house that say whatever you like; and if your neighbor doesn't like it, that's their tough luck. But if you put signs up on other peoples' houses, that is vandalism. It's also vandalism if you spray-paint political messages on the Boy Scout building down the street --- although again, you are always welcome to start your own organization and promote whatever messages you like on its buildings. There is no human right to put your messages on the property of other people or organizations.

[JRMILLER]

Bob,
Here, here! The purpose of this site is clear, if I want politics, I can find it elsewhere. I don't want or expect it here!

[HockeySkirt]

Edit : I just wrote basically exactly the same as Bob, but he wrote it more elegantly.

So I'll just say "I agree Bob".

[HockeySkirt]

Personally, I like a forum with around 10%-20% off topic posts. Enough to get a rounded view of the individuals involved, but not enough to be distracting.

In 2003 and early 2004, there were times when 80-90% of the discussion was about politics and religion. People left, and some cited this bickering as one of the key reasons. Those topics were banned, and the forum improved immensely.

Some of the individual concerned moved to the fledgling X-Marks and tried to do the same there (religion in particular), until Hank banned it likewise in 2004.

So Bob is not introducing anything new here -- it's been in place for almost 4 years. He is just continuing with the already established forum management wisdom.

Ed

[Milfmog]

Sorry Ziggy, I'm with Bob on this one. Simply put, this is Bob's bit of cyberspace and Bob gets to define how he wants it to be. You have a chunk of cyberspace of your own and may write what you wish there but abusing Bob's space is just rude.

Let's keep this fashion freedom based board on topic and away from the bad feeling that politics and religion invariably produce in the virtual world.

Have fun,


Ian (a political animal, but NOT here).

[sapphire]

I think we need to define "politics" Governmental politics, as yet, has no place in this forum.

Stumping for a governmental political candidate for office has no place in this forum.

However, discussing the politics of fashion and the fashion industry does have a place, although beware, its deep dark and nasty place and , frankly, not one of us is truly qualified to go there yet.

Put simply, unless Ron Paul campaigns in a skirt, and his platform includes fashion freedom I find the banner ad for him offesnsive and out of place.

[Sasquatch]

I agree with Diana. The casual inferrence to matters political hasn't really ever been an issue here, but I don't think this forum is an appropriate soapbox for anyone's vitriole - or propaganda.

Ziggy, you frequently remind me of an old Billy Joel song from Turnstiles (1976, when I was in high school, probably well before your time), called Angry Young Man. Give it a listen sometime.

I don't know what the conditions of your life are, but I hope someday that you'll find peace within, and can let go of the rage. Life is too short to spend it in anger, when there is comraderie, friendship, and love to be had.

My two cents. Sasq

[Since1982]

Threads like this need humor/humour every now and again.

Here's my attempt at hum-or/our...

If you want a place for excessive political bickering, I suggest you use AOL (America On Line) member Chat rooms. I, having been a Chat room Host at AOL for 7 years, can say with certainty that there are at least 10,000 political chat rooms there. People argue and fight 24/7 with each other and have Hosts in the rooms to keep the rudeness and nasty verbalisms to a minority. Those that get nasty get their chat privilege stopped for anything from 1 hour to life. Depending on the things said, (racism etc.) The member can be excluded from his/her AOL membership completely.

On the humorous side, IF the members just stay friendly, they can argue for weeks on the same subject.