Bespoke skirts for men

[skirted84]

Don't know if this has been posted or even if Chris is in the Cafe. Anyway its a great article about the need for skirts actually tailored for men.
https://daraford.com/author/darastringham/

Yes the cost is prohibitive for most and the pipe dream would be to have these as off the rack as womens skirts and dresses. And by extension having suit jackets to match, dresses etc. as upper body proportions are even further apart.

Clear example of proper fitting giving such benefit.

[STEVIE]

Clear example of proper fitting giving such benefit.

Absolutely, but at a price?
My thought, would a male and female bespoke skirt cost the same?
If not, why not, the making of one to suit an individual must be comparable.
It would be useful to have a figure to go on.
Steve.

[Ray]

I am aware of this, and am seriously contemplating it. Yes, expensive - but what an experience!

[robehickman]

This is a point I have raised on this forum several times before and has largely been either ignored, or stated by other members 'just cross the isle' (meaning 'wear woman's skirts'). Honestly I think that most, if not all of the 'men in skirts look weird' issue is due to this attitude.

There are important factors that are not obvious:

• Mismatch between garment shape and body shape.
• Visual conflict between fabric types and skin texture.
• Conflict between fabric colour and skin tone (this matters more than you may think, look up some videos of colour analysis sessions.)
• Incoherency in the outfit as a whole (a big problem is that ready to wear men's top garments are too long and poorly fitting to pair well with skirts.)

To have skirts (and dresses) that are fully harmonious with male body shapes, it is important to actually start designing and producing skirts for men, as well as formulating guidance for how to put together complete outfits that actually work as a whole.

If you can't afford to get custom tailoring, then learning how to sew and pattern draft is actually not very hard, and an enjoyable process. There is an enormous amount of information available for free on the internet, most targeted at women, but its easy to adapt.

Some general design principles I've noticed:

• Skirted men can very easily end up looking top-heavy due to men tending to have wide shoulders. It can be helpful to make the skirt's width at the hem about the same as the wearer's shoulder's.
• Pleats pair well with the male body shape, in my opinion especially large, deep ones in small numbers.
• If at all possible, avoid adding bulk at the hips, as it easily ends up making the whole outfit look 'dumpy' (depending on individual body proportions obviously, but men typically have more visual mass in their torsos.)
• Wide hips is not a characteristic people look for in men, and I think that we should avoid drawing attention to the hips period. Bright fabric short skirts I think do not look right due to this, the same for anything short and 'frilly'.
• Skirts that are either knee length or ankle length seem to work well.
• The form of the garment should follow the form of the body pretty tightly.
• Learn where your waist is, it is higher than where most trousers sit.
• It can help to create an uninterrupted visual line from the shoulders to the hem.
• Getting rid of the horizontal line formed between the top and bottom garment can notably improve visual harmony and reduce the 'dumpy' look. That can be done either with curved hem tops, or combining the skirt and top into a 'dress'.

[crfriend]

Skirted men can very easily end up looking top-heavy due to men tending to have wide shoulders. It can be helpful to make the skirt's width at the hem about the same as the wearer's shoulder's.

This is perfectly normal and ought the be embraced as one puts together outfits. Men are simply top-heavy when compared to modern women. I've found over the years that cultivating styles from other times can be quite productive as well, and make liberal use of waistcoats as "partial bodices" to skirted rigs.

Also worthwhile noting is that it's perfectly possible to employ the "intersecting cones" look and have a narrow waist and very wide long hems.

Pleats pair well with the male body shape, in my opinion especially large, deep ones in small numbers.

So do elements like godet insert and interesting flare shapes.

If at all possible, avoid adding bulk at the hips, as it easily ends up making the whole outfit look 'dumpy' (depending on individual body proportions obviously, but men typically have more visual mass in their torsos.)

Indeed, because that just tends to make us look fatter than we really are.

Skirts that are either knee length or ankle length seem to work well.

I've found that over the years I can rock anything from a 17" mini to a 42" floor-sweeper with aplomb and have them look good on me.

The form of the garment should follow the form of the body pretty tightly.

Only if you're really interested in the "body-con" look, which very few can properly pull off.

As far as completely blending the top and the bottom, accentuating it can also work wonders. Look to do this with colour and fit/flare.

[Grok]

The form of the garment should follow the form of the body pretty tightly.

Only if you're really interested in the "body-con" look, which very few can properly pull off.

I think that you will find that, generally, those who can pull off the body-con look tend to be quite young, and towards the more attractive end of the looks scale.

What if someone has an aging body, or was not endowed with good looks in the first place?

[STEVIE]

What if someone has an aging body, or was not endowed with good looks in the first place?

Well Grok, that pretty well covers the majority of the human population.
My take is simple, I wear what suits "ME" in any sense.
If the onlooker thinks I look good, bad or indifferent, I have learned not to care.

Honestly I think that most, if not all of the 'men in skirts look weird' issue is due to this attitude.

And I honestly believe that to that, to a lot of people, men in skirts are weird full stop.
The sartorial elegance of the guy will not make the slightest difference.

Steve.

[Mouse]

I love the line in the piece, where the designer says on Chris changing into a skirt....

The change in his energy and posture was immediate – he instantly radiated and looked more himself in the skirt than in the jeans. The shift in his energy and sense of self was palpable, it felt like dialling up the light with a dimmer switch.

I think my family saw a similar thing in me, when I found public skirt wearing.

[robehickman]

Honestly I think that most, if not all of the 'men in skirts look weird' issue is due to this attitude.

And I honestly believe that to that, to a lot of people, men in skirts are weird full stop.
The sartorial elegance of the guy will not make the slightest difference.

I do not agree with this statement at all with regards to the UK. The country is very culturally mixed. Many man of other cultures wear 'dresses' normally, I see such people all the time in Bristol and nobody cares in the slightest. Also a few days ago I also saw a man in a dress on an e-scooter in Bristol, as well as another in a black utility kilt in the same day - nobody cared. In all these cases the garments looked coherent with the person wearing them.

The problem is not skirted garments as a general concept, but having something that looks coherent with the person. Any attempt of a man to dress like a woman, in most cases, will not look coherent because the body shapes are very different, or garments draw the eye to the wrong thing.

Women can generally dress like men without so much visual conflict because you can hide curves with straight garments. You can not create curves where there are none.

[Grok]

Yes the cost is prohibitive for most

I can imagine someone splurging for a bespoke garment, if he has a very strong interest in a particular design...that he can't find.

[Grok]

[*]Getting rid of the horizontal line formed between the top and bottom garment can notably improve visual harmony and reduce the 'dumpy' look. That can be done either with curved hem tops, or combining the skirt and top into a 'dress'.[/*]
[/list]

Some dress styles could almost be described as very long shirts. No distinct bodice, no distinct skirt, and no distinct waist. I recall somebody once posting that something like this can have a column like silhouette. Particularly if it is long.

[STEVIE]

The country is very culturally mixed. Many man of other cultures wear 'dresses' normally, I see such people all the time in Bristol and nobody cares in the slightest

Nobody cared because "culturally" these are not dresses designed as feminine garments in any sense of the word.
Would any of these men be likely to wear what is considered feminine from any culture, including their own?
Please note RH, many people all over the world, not just Scots, do not perceive the kilt as a skirt!
Finally, that skirt cost £400 plus, fine Chris is happy and it is his money to spend as he chooses.
This is effectively a promotional piece for Dara and Chris is still a guy in a skirt, end of!
The attitude of judgement rests in the judge, do not mistake silence for acceptance.
Steve.

[Barleymower]

The country is very culturally mixed. Many man of other cultures wear 'dresses' normally, I see such people all the time in Bristol and nobody cares in the slightest

Nobody cared because "culturally" these are not dresses designed as feminine garments in any sense of the word.
Would any of these men be likely to wear what is considered feminine from any culture, including their own?
Please note RH, many people all over the world, not just Scots, do not perceive the kilt as a skirt!
Finally, that skirt cost £400 plus, fine Chris is happy and it is his money to spend as he chooses.
This is effectively a promotional piece for Dara and Chris is still a guy in a skirt, end of!
The attitude of judgement rests in the judge, do not mistake silence for acceptance.
Steve.

I see thinks slightly differently. Yes it is true that silence is no signifier of acceptance. It is a case though of
"Put up or Shut up"
If somebody has something to say about what I'm wearing then say it, unless they are too chicken **** to speak their mind.
Wearing garments from the other side of the aisle has nasty attempt at robbing a mans, manhood. It gives people the opportunity to snigger and say "do you want to be a girl".
I think in the words of Johnny Cash:
My name is Sue, how do you do? Now you are gonna die!
If i'm greeted with silence, I take that as tacit acceptance. If anybody has a criticism of what I'm wearing feel free to open a discussion.

[STEVIE]

If i'm greeted with silence, I take that as tacit acceptance. If anybody has a criticism of what I'm wearing feel free to open a discussion.

That's fine until you discover that the silence wasn't quite as golden as you had imagined it was.
Getting back to all the connotations of crossing the aisle or splashing out on a bespoke skirt for a guy, that doesn't matter either.
The skirt Chris is wearing does not look fundamentally different from one that he could have got from Marks and Spencer, Next or John Lewis.
Hell, Harrods, Selfridges or Harvey Nichols could have probably supplied something well within that budget.
in the eye of the beholder a skirt is just that and it is going to be a long long time before it is not seen as women's wear.
Something else, I wonder how many "average" women would spend that amount on a skirt, I'd bet not many.
Guten Abent!
Steve.

[Barleymower]

Steve dont get me wrong. I dont see silence as amything other than silence. If people choose to say nothing then i choose to take their silence as i choose! I am saying we are not reliant on others approval. What they think is not relevant. They probably have their facts wrong anyway.
Male fashion freedom will come when attitudes to men become realistic rather than idealistic. People are literally judging the book by the cover. Which we know is fundamentally wrong.

And yes Chris's skirt could been bought for £5 in primark and made no difference to the casual observer.