Yesterday!

[DALederle]

Yesterday was Dec. 7,2010. That's 69 years since the Pearl Harbor attacks on the USA. That was 911 before there was a 911. I found myself watching pictures, yesterday, of the VFW and other veteran's groups celebrating the still living vets from that time of our history. And I realised, with a shock, that the people I grew up with from those years have all but disappeared. All my aunts and uncles and friends parents and my parents, etc. are gone now.
I have clear memories, growing up of being around the people from WWII. My parents were very active in the VFW and my mother went on in the Auxillery to be a state office holder. So I saw all these people as very dynnamic, active, healthy people. They were the "doers" of their time. The high school coaches and teachers. The little leagues coaches. The people we, as children, looked up to and often wanted to emulate.
They weren't perfect and they made their share of mistakes. But most of them had a sense of honesty and morality about them that our current leaders seem to lack. These were people that went through some of toughest times in US, or the world's, history. They survived the Great Depression and the ravages of WWII and came through it with a purpose. To make things better in their lifetimes. For us who are left.
I feel sad when I think that, in many ways, there goals and vision has been shunted aside in our modern society. The ME and NOW generation whose greed seems to know no end.
Thomas Jeffereson once warned us that once a society who can vote itself bread and circus' then it would stop working and that would mean the downfall of the culture that it had built. I pray that this isn't so but fear that it is!
Dennis A. Lederle

[Mugs-n-such]

There's a book that touches on that subject called "Slouching Towards Gomorrah". I was reading it, but seemed to have misplaced it, or I'd tell you the author. If I can't find it soon I may have to buy another one from amazon.com. Is it too much of an exaggeration to say our government is turning into the kind of government that the WWII veterans fought to defeat in Europe and Japan? Uh oh, I'm getting into verboten politics...

[DALederle]

Okay, I goofed. I wasn't really trying to bring up politics! That subject is a never ending, tail chasing event that has no resolution.
I was just trying to voice a sense of sadness over the coming loss of "The Greatest Generation" is all. Wether men or women these people are leaving our lives forever, as we will to, shortly. (At least in my case, I believe that.) THey gave us so much back then and made the future possible.
What we have done with it is another matter.
Maybe that shouldn't be discussed here, though.

Dennis A. Lederle

p.s. I give anything in the world to have an extra hour or two to talk once more with my parents and be able to ask some questions about what really happened in my life and why they did what they did.

[Mugs-n-such]

I suppose we're kinda skating on thin ice but the mods haven't slapped our wrists (yet). Anyway, I can echo your sentiment that when I was fresh out of high school my grandmother used to try and tell me about her relatives and my ancestors and I was only very mildly interested. Now I wish I had taken notes, and even pursued in asking questions. What is the saying, "youth is wasted on the young"? In my case, maybe (at least partly) so...

[sapphire]

Well, I never got the "whole" story, but then again what parent, aunts, uncles, grandparents ever tell the "whole" Story.

But I do feel blessed that I was told lots of stories. Mom was a Marine. Joe and Bob were Navy and Ralph was Army. THere were planty of stories, some highly unusal, that they brought home with them. There were also the stories from the Depression, stories from early life in Puerto Rico, the stories of my Spanish Grandfather figthing against the US in the Spanish American War. Then there were the stories of the bootlegging and smuggling, life in the NYC slums and going to college against all the odds.

And on the other side of the equation there were the stories of evading the German draft, running away from Russia, having a speakeasy, being a bookie and the emotionally abandoned little boy who grew up to be my Dad and desipte his best attempts to the opposite being awarded patnent.

I feel all the more rich for having heard all the stories.

And still the stories keep coming. My 84 year old Aunt Carmen (baby of the family) keeps sending WWII pix and stories to go along with them.

So blessed to have all th estories.

[Mugs-n-such]

That (to me) is fascinating, Sapphire. You know I had inherited a box full of WWII pictures from my dad, and I sold them. Now I wish I had kept them. Some of the WWII pictures now, I mean original pictures of course, are probably getting to be worth quite a lot. My dad served in the Army in Britain and in North Africa. He was a sheet-metal worker (don't know the proper term) for the P-51 Mustangs. I guess he patched up the bullet holes and what not. As far as I can recall, he never talked much about his service, I asked him once if he had been in combat. He said no, but he had seen the German fighters strafing some of the other fighter bases from afar. WWII may be interesting to read about, but I think it would have been horrible to have participated in it. For many, civilians and soldiers alike, the war ended with an early death or life disability.
Well, I don't mean to preach. For some reason my paternal grandmother was about the only one who spoke of family history, neither my mom nor my dad seemed to tell us kids much about it. Dad probably did more than Mom. It sounds like you have quite a history of military service in your family, Sapphire. Good for you! And even glad someone avoided the German draft if it meant serving under Hitler!

[crfriend]

As far as I can recall, [my father] never talked much about his service, I asked him once if he had been in combat.

That's not terribly surprising, for likely most of the folks who served in the "Second" World War really looked at it as something that needed to be done, just did it, and that was that. I suspect that many, if not most, of them were rather reticent to talk about it right afterwards, and many took their memories to the grave with them. My grandfather served with some distinction in WWII in the US Army Medical Corps in both the European and Pacific theaters, and I never got consistent recollections or answers from him; I suspect he just didn't want to talk about it. This pains me to some extent today even given the abuse I endured by his words as his brain was being eaten by Alzheimer's disease.

For some reason my paternal grandmother was about the only one who spoke of family history, neither my mom nor my dad seemed to tell us kids much about it. Dad probably did more than Mom.

You're lucky. My family has a deep history of not telling anybody about anything; I've learned more telling details about my own history from family friends than I have from family members! This is not amusing to me at all. I have a copy of my grandfather's (unpublished) memoirs, but still have precious little hard information about anything regarding my biological mother's family (my paternal grandmother having done all the "heavy lifting" save childbirth with me) -- and none of the older members of my family are willing to talk about any of it.

[Since1982]

Yesterday, when I was 25, (added words)
All my troubles seemed so far away,
Now it looks as though they're here to stay,
Oh, I believe in yesterday.

Suddenly,
I'm not half the man I used to be,
There's a shadow hanging over me,
Oh, yesterday came suddenly.

Why she
Had to go I don't know, she wouldn't say.
I said,
Something wrong, now I long for yesterday.

Yesterday,
Love was such an easy game to play,
Now I need a place to hide away,
Oh, I believe in yesterday.

(Mm-mm-mm-mm-mm-mm-mm.)
MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE TOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

[DALederle]

Modern psycho-therapy is an out growth of post WWII trauma from returning vets. It was created to handle all the case of then was called "shell shock" but is now called "post traumatic stress syndrome" and is now recognised to take place in many of life stressful conditions.
That is probably why so many WWII vets didn't talk much about it. They didn't know how to talk about it without sounding like they were complaining. That was a time when we were all told to "suck it up" anytime something happened to you. "Suck it up" and "get back in there" were favorite phrases used by high school coaches I played for. No one thought anything about it. We assumed the coach knew what he was doing. And yes, there were cases of children getting really hurt but if it didn't happen in your local school you didn't hear about it. There wasn't the mass media instant news back then.
I remeber one time I was on a bowling team with a VFW league. I was concidered an Associate Member, since I wasn't a veteran. Of course most of the people knew my Mom and Dad. And since I was a 183-187 average bowler (for those who don't bowl that is an above average average to carry) I was team captain. The six best bowlers were team captains, so thaht two or more of the best bowlers didn't get on the same team. Parity, before the NFL came up with the idea.
At any rate my team-mates, all very good men to be around. treated me exactly as their equal, even though I had never been in the military. Something I always felt proud of because of the respect I had for them, not out of my own ego.
One Friday night they got to talking about their war experiences. It was after the passing of one of the members. I had covered the funeral as a reporter and seen all the men from the VFW there that day.
At any rate, as they began to talk I realised that I was the captain of a team of heros. Everyone had a Purple Heart(injured in action) and at least a silver star (second highest USA military award) and two had The Congressional Medal of Honor (the highest award by the USA). I was floored, to say the least. I also kept my mouth shut and let them talk. This was not a conversation I had any business adding to. After a while they began to tell humorus stories and started to ask me what I would do? This once again surprised me, that they would want my oppion on anything, even the jokes they played.
All I can say is that I wished I had a photographic memeory so I could write down every word they said that night. It was a surprise revelation to me.
I hope someone gathered up their stories!

Dennis A. Lederle

[Mugs-n-such]

For some reason my paternal grandmother was about the only one who spoke of family history, neither my mom nor my dad seemed to tell us kids much about it. Dad probably did more than Mom.

You're lucky. My family has a deep history of not telling anybody about anything; I've learned more telling details about my own history from family friends than I have from family members! This is not amusing to me at all. I have a copy of my grandfather's (unpublished) memoirs, but still have precious little hard information about anything regarding my biological mother's family (my paternal grandmother having done all the "heavy lifting" save childbirth with me) -- and none of the older members of my family are willing to talk about any of it.

I hope this doesn't sound too selfish or crude but it's nice to know that I'm not the only one who has had problems relating to his family.
(Regarding DALederle's previous post) This would apply I think to some of what crfriend was saying too: I think I've read that normally combat veterans don't like to talk about their combat experiences unless it's with someone else who has been in combat. That makes your group, I think, all the more remarkable. May God give rest to their souls! (I realize many of them may still be alive in which case: May God bless them!)

[Since1982]

My Dad back in around 1948 paid for a full heredity scan to find out the entemology of both his and my Mom's last names. Even Aunt Schtoopi wanted to know. (us kids referred to her as Aunt Stupid..) She was born in Norway and the name meant something, we just never knew what. Turned out on my Dad's side, there were a lot of Norweigan and British Isles ancestors, and on my Mom's side, the ancestors came from France, Germany and Denmark. Our French forebears did some nighttime interaction with the Cherokee so I have a small percentage of that too.

Back in the 40's that much heredity searching cost a lot and took a long time. Closest I can come to where I am is 5% Welsh, 5% Scottish, 5% Cherokee, 15% French, 20% English, 20% German, 30% Norweigan for a total of 100% Heintz 7 Varieties.

[Mugs-n-such]

My Dad back in around 1948 paid for a full heredity scan to find out the entemology of both his and my Mom's last names. Even Aunt Schtoopi wanted to know. (us kids referred to her as Aunt Stupid..) She was born in Norway and the name meant something, we just never knew what. Turned out on my Dad's side, there were a lot of Norweigan and British Isles ancestors, and on my Mom's side, the ancestors came from France, Germany and Denmark. Our French forebears did some nighttime interaction with the Cherokee so I have a small percentage of that too.

Back in the 40's that much heredity searching cost a lot and took a long time. Closest I can come to where I am is 5% Welsh, 5% Scottish, 5% Cherokee, 15% French, 20% English, 20% German, 30% Norweigan for a total of 100% Heintz 7 Varieties.

Let's face it, Skip, you're a mongrel like 99.9% of the rest of us. I wonder if even the American Indians and other "pure" races are mongrels of something that went before...however, I am impressed with the research that was done. I sure couldn't give a percentage like that of my blood though I know it has Irish and Scottish and German and who knows what all else...not necessarily in that order though.
Btw (sorry, the pedant is coming out) I thought it was etymology. I thought entomology (sp?) is the study of insects. OK, I'm being a bit of a *deleted* I admit it but because you have corrected me I thought I'd return the favor!
*thinking Skip has a sense of fairness and/or humor*

[DALederle]

Skip:
EVERYBODY is a mongrel! Show me a person who knows he is a purebred and I'll show you a fool! If he were a purebred then he probably would be a fool or idiot, too!
I am 60% German, 10% Scot, 10% English,10% Welch, 10% Cherokee(or Comanchee, our family genealogists, my sister hasn't nailed down which tribe yet). I imagine that there are very few purebloods amongst the Americn Aborignes and among the African Ammericans. I know some Native Americans that prefer to be called Indians and feel proud of that name.
Curious that the people who used to called Negro don't like that term any more. But that is their progrative after all.
So we all are "duke's" mixtures in the long run.
The big question is does anyone care? Should anyone care?
My father's last name comes from Baron's in the Northern France, Southern Germany area. I could claim the title of Baron Lederle and embaress all the rest of them. My mother's Grandfather was the Royal Architecht to Kaiser Wilhelm the First. My great grandfather was a Littleton, from England, near Sherwood Forest (and the name mean "Little John" so you be the judge, since I'm 6'4" lol). Another great grandfather was a Furgeson, from Scotland. And they all got together and ended up with me and my sister!

Happy Grandfathers Day! (Whenever that is!)

Dennis A. Lederle

[Since1982]

Thanks Mugs, I always get those 2 mixed up.

Etymology - Definition Etymology is the study of the origins of words. Some words have been derived from other languages, possibly in a changed form (the source words are called ...
www.wordiq.com/definition/Etymology/

I'm too proud to look before I leap. Entomology is the study of Insects.

[sapphire]

Grampa Barney ran way from Germany way before Hitler. Grampa landed on Ellis Island in 1900 at age 16. Granma Anna's family ran away from Russia and landed on Ellis Island in 1913. I'm sure that their last name "Rosenstein" had something to do with it, despite the fact that they were Baptist.

THe Puerto Rican side was a fine mash up of mostly Spanish, some Welsh, some French and some Native American. Who cares? They were a blast! A great Family to grow up with.

Folks who try to figure out my background from my appearance have guessed English or Irish and then there are those who SWEAR that I'm from the Midwest.

Go figure