Men's fear of skirts

[Barleymower]

I think all men are afraid of women on another level. Many men in 2025 are distancing themselves from any feminine characteristics, they need to be as opposite as possible to women. It explains why many men recoil in horror at the thought of wearing a skirt. The video doesn't mention skirts btw. Which is why I have posted in "off topic".
The video below from Connor Beaton provides a lot of insight into men's behaviour.
https://youtu.be/VcJaadJ9NRo?si=qchWwq-bGdn2tTAl

[Mouse]

I think all men are afraid of women on another level. Many men in 2025 are distancing themselves from any feminine characteristics, they need to be as opposite as possible to women. It explains why many men recoil in horror at the thought of wearing a skirt. The video doesn't mention skirts btw. Which is why I have posted in "off topic".
The video below from Connor Beaton provides a lot of insight into men's behaviour.
https://youtu.be/VcJaadJ9NRo?si=qchWwq-bGdn2tTAl

I know in my own life that what kept me from displaying feminine characteristics was the heavy 1960s christian message against being gay, which still comes from part of my family. This collided inside my brain with my love of women and the things they wear.

I found the video quite hard going since I get lost in some of his terminology. The one point I did take was when he said "the long haired guys with the guitar have it sorted", I don't have a guitar, but I am still married after 33 years, to a woman that I am not afraid of!!

[crfriend]

I know in my own life that what kept me from displaying feminine characteristics was the heavy 1960s christian message against being gay, which still comes from part of my family. This collided inside my brain with my love of women and the things they wear.

Calling somebody homosexual in so-called western "civilisation" is the utmost possible slur going -- and everybody is fully aware of that from the most pathetic school-yard bully to our own families. This, in fact, is what caused the final rift between my grandfather and I when his advancing senility removed the last of his filters and he outright accused me of being queer because of my long hair -- in spite of knowing full well I was courting my future wife at the time. I turned on my heel, walked away, and the next time I saw him he was in a box. That game is poisonous; don't play it because there are no winners.

The one point I did take was when he said "the long haired guys with the guitar have it sorted", I don't have a guitar, but I am still married after 33 years, to a woman that I am not afraid of!!

If one is afraid of his partner then one is not paired off correctly; the trust between the two has to be absolute because things in life can get really "interesting" (read, dangerous) very quickly and the two have to function instinctively as a team. Recall that there are no rehearsals for life, and one does not get a retry at it. If there's fear, there's a lack of trust, and without trust it's better to simply walk away.

[Barleymower]

Yes he does use a lot of Technical language but I did not allow that to stop me having a think about what was said and applying it to MIS:

1. Minute 4.45. He says that women are the gate keepers of sex. There's no surprise here. I think we all have noticed this. he does say though, a man in some ways defines his masculinity through his success with women. I'm not convinced by this, a man will know he is a man whether or not he attracts a mate. Although if a man tries and is unsuccessful over and over, it will affect him mentally and he may not see himself as masculine as the men he sees with girl after girl.

2. Minute 9.40. Men who lack internal power will seek affirmation from a women. That is he will ask her "am I enough"? I think this plays into the fact that women can just "be" but men have to prove their manhood. It's not a question for other men either. he is asking the women "am I man enough for you?".

These two things I think effect MIS significantly. You have to be supremely sure of yourself to wear a skirt or dress (in the modern world). You are saying to the women "look beyond the skirt and see the man".

3. Minute 12.53. Women's emotional power in dominance, manipulation and coercion. Women have emotional powers men don't have or don't use. This can be a big handicap for MIS if the women in his life says no.

4. Self-worth in opposition to women. Many men define their manliness by being the exact opposite to women. These men are the most problematic to MIS because these men seek refuge in being butch and manly.

5. Minute 18.45. Ancient civilisations trained men in combat, but alongside swordsmanship they had to learn to dance, to read poetry, write music and of course men and women both wore dresses and skirts. They we much more rounded than the men of today.

My overall feeling is that men and women of today have lost their way. I think that skirts could be a worthwhile future for everyone bringing men and women closer together. But like Grok said: Not in this lifetime.

[crfriend]

1. He says that women are the gate keepers of sex. There's no surprise here.

This was never an issue for me as I came to the conclusion -- before puberty -- that I would never sire progeny as I'd glimpsed what the future would likely hold -- and I was not wrong in that. Thus, that matter was never of any real importance.

2. Men who lack internal power will seek affirmation from a women.

Anybody that requires that sort of affirmation is on a fool's errand. There are many ways to gauge how one is doing in the world without requiring the input of others (who are as likely to undermine one as not). There are fairly trivial ways to do this.

Worse, needing external affirmation is tantamount to relinquishing any control over one's own life. I was pushed deeply suicidal a number of years ago when I allowed that to happen and only recovered when I realised I was on a fool's errand. That, I can tell you, was a very, very dark place indeed, and I barely escaped.

3. Women's emotional power in dominance, manipulation and coercion. Women have emotional powers men don't have or don't use.

Women are grand-masters at psy-ops (psychological operations) and deploy those tools with sometimes lethal accuracy. Don't fall victim; walk away from the perpetrator.

4. Self-worth in opposition to women. Many men define their manliness by being the exact opposite to women.

Why? On the face of it this makes precious little sense. In the grand scheme of things men and women are "horns on the same bull".

5. Ancient civilisations trained men in combat, but alongside swordsmanship they had to learn to dance, to read poetry, write music and of course men and women both wore dresses and skirts. They we much more rounded than the men of today.

You'll get no argument from me on those points. It's vital to be well-rounded. I cannot tell people enough how important music and music theory was to my career in computing -- especially at the hardware level. All of the arts are important to us as whole individuals and creatures!

My overall feeling is that men and women of today have lost their way. I think that skirts could be a worthwhile future for everyone bringing men and women closer together. But like Grok said: Not in this lifetime.

Those are accurate statements, all.

[Barleymower]

In ŕeply Carl:

Many of the men here are no longer dating becuase we've left it to the younger age group or married etc, but the desire to attract a mate is strong and most guys (me included) didn't want to jeapodise our chances.

Seeking the affirmation of others is very foolish but it happens. Finding a mate is a dark art and so validation is in the back of mens minds.

Women do have a vast array of methods to argue their point. The best way avoid getting caught up in that tangled web is to agree.

I'm happy to have rid myself of the societal things that define a man. It's utter ********. It's almost like I'm remembering what it means to be be a man, which is odd becuase i'm doing it in the epitome of femininity. An example: while looking for a suitable venue for the next meet, I was propped up outside 'Five Guys' studying the map. Out of the corner of my eye I saw a girl wide eyed and open mouth when she saw me. She wasnt laughing just surprised.

[crfriend]

Many of the men here are no longer dating becuase we've left it to the younger age group or married etc, but the desire to attract a mate is strong and most guys (me included) didn't want to jeapodise our chances.

Indeed my reasoning on that count is unusual and very personal, but I very deliberately opted to forego the entire "mating dance" as I could not stand the thought of bringing a child into what this world has become and to suffer the hatred of the little one for having done so. I can imagine no hatred that would hurt more than the hatred of one's own child.

Seeking the affirmation of others is very foolish but it happens. Finding a mate is a dark art and so validation is in the back of mens minds.

I'm not saying it isn't nice to know that one is liked and respected in his world; that's actually quite comforting. I got a good dose of that last night during and after dinner when it became apparent how many people were actually quite concerned for me when I "went missing" when I was in hospital last month. However, I do not seek that sort of attention; if it arrives on my doorstep I'll accept it and feel good, but it's not essential to my day-to-day function as I have lots of internal validators to keep me happy.

Women do have a vast array of methods to argue their point. The best way avoid getting caught up in that tangled web is to agree.

They also have an array of tools at their disposal that men usually refuse to use because they're dishonourable -- like "head games" and psy-ops against their partners. Crap like that is why successful men tend to take on "trophy wives"; the priors' behaviour can get so catty and destructive that it's easier -- and safer -- to get out than persevere.

I'm happy to have rid myself of the societal things that define a man. It's utter ********. It's almost like I'm remembering what it means to be be a man, which is odd because i'm doing it in the epitome of femininity. An example: while looking for a suitable venue for the next meet, I was propped up outside 'Five Guys' studying the map. Out of the corner of my eye I saw a girl wide eyed and open mouth when she saw me. She wasnt laughing just surprised.

"What it means to be a man" has been constantly "evolving" (read, "decaying") for a half-century now, and just being born with an X-Y chromosomal makeup can put one in the dire straits of bankruptcy and even prison where I live; the rad-fems have taken over and have completely subjugated the male population. In the process, we lost all the good, decent, and honourable things that once we had. It's no wonder things are close to terminally broken.

[Barleymower]

Carl i've no wish to argue but I really dont see the wows of men to be in any way the fault of women. They have their faults, so do men and we are in this together.

[crfriend]

Carl i've no wish to argue but I really dont see the wows of men to be in any way the fault of women. They have their faults, so do men and we are in this together.

It's not an argument at all, so no worries!

Men's woes are not directly the "fault of women" but rather of the complex dynamic that separates the two. As women expanded "their space" into that which was traditionally male, men reacted by withdrawing from that space. Thus, we are complicit in our subjugation. Had we held our ground it wouldn't have happened, but that's a topic for a different day. It's also entirely likely different depending on where one lives and what the local culture is -- and I tend to write from experience in my local environment (which is pretty lousy at the moment).

That "we're in this together" is as true a statement as there is -- because we are. One cannot survive without the other. I just wish there was more cooperation and understanding between the two, and an abandonment of the myth of the "Marlboro Man" and a casting aside of machismo (on the part of BOTH sexes) because it's a perversion of masculinity.