The desert at night

[moonshadow]

On a road trip last week, for the first time in my life, I was able to experience something I had never done before... the desert at night.

I couldn't stay long (we were ill prepared to spend too long in the desert, our hotel was in Phoenix Arizona and we were already about two hours out and getting hungry and tired).

This seems strange to say, but for the first time in my life, I saw (faintly) the band of the "Mikly Way". Something an old east coast dweller like myself could only see in photos. The reasons are obvious, light pollution for one, but I imagine the humid air also plays a part. I could still see the glow of Phoenix over the horizon and the moon was almost a quarter waxing so I'm sure that was hindering my star gazing somewhat, but I still saw more than I ever had before.

I stood there somewhat in awe, then pulled out my phone and fiddled with the advanced settings to get a night photo to come out (see below). The photo is cool, but really doesn't do the experience justice.

I also experienced something I wasn't expecting... something I've NEVER experienced in a NATURAL setting...

SILENCE.

Dead silence. The kind of silence where all you hear is your own heart beating. You never really realize how noisy the world is until you go somewhere truly QUIET. The experience was almost spiritual.

My half hour in the middle of the Arizona desert in the middle of the night was a highlight of my trip. Since I've come to the western U.S. I have learned that I really enjoy the desert. There's just something about it that seems to move my soul.

Another strange phenomenon comes over me when I take these trips from Montana to Arizona and everywhere in between. I get the strange sensation over and over again that I've been to these places before. It's not a "Déjà vu", no, not quite that clear of a memory, it almost seems to be from a past life. Now I'm not trying to be one of "those guys" that claims ESP and all of that, but I am saying there seems to be an eerie familiarity with many of these areas, from the desert bluffs to the pine forests. It needs to be noted, that prior to 2023, I had never traveled west of the Mississippi River.

I suppose it could be the "Hollywood effect" as most of our movies and media are produced and set in the western U.S., but I don't think so, it seems deeper than that.... - I know my way around (for the most part). One glance at a map and I've got it from there. I don't know... it's just a satisfying place to be. Perhaps it's the solitude. The world has really been getting me down these last couple of years, hope for the future is vanishing, people are more and more obnoxious, AI is taking over and making everything fake, society is VERY grumpy right now, everyone just seems pissed off all of the time... but out in the desert, it's just me, the ground below, and those stars. For a moment, all was right. And then... like the passing of the eye of a hurricane, we depart back to "reality". I'm glad I got to have this experience. I get the feeling there may come a day when they'll take this from us too. Enjoy it while you can.

Anyway... haven't posted in a while and just through I'd toss something at the group... hope life's been treating everyone well.

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[Barleymower]

AI is taking over and making everything fake, society is VERY grumpy right now, everyone just seems pissed off all of the time... but out in the desert, it's just me, the ground below, and those stars. For a moment, all was right. And then... like the passing of the eye of a hurricane, we depart back to "reality".

Without wishing to compete with your ezperience which is yours.

I have seen the arch of the Milky Way from a campisite in Devon, far enough to not be spoiled by light from nearby towns, it was amazing.

Their wealth, control and Internet won't last. Nothing lasts, everything changes and somehow stays the same. Knowing that is very grounding, for me at least.

[Ray]

There’s something awe-inspiring about a desert overnight.

I stayed overnight in a (posh) tent in Wadi Rum, Jordan (think Star Wars rise of Skywalker, Dune, The Martian - all filmed there) in 2024, and the sky was blazing with stars. Again, an absolute silence. Hugely memorable.

[moonshadow]

Since I've come to the western U.S., I've learned of something new, something we never had back east. "Bureau of Land Management Land" (BLM Land)

Millions of acres of public land, especially in states like Nevada, Utah, Arizona, etc. It's peppered around Oregon too. Washington has a little bit here and there, but most is National Forest, which is also public but generally is a *little* more restrictive than BLM land. National Forest land also seems to be more mountainous which makes boondocking a travel trailer a little more difficult.

Basically on BLM land you can set up camp, for free (usually) for up to 14 days, after which you have to move so far away (rules vary by location, a good round about figure is around 50 miles). This is dispersed camping, so there are no amenities. I've learned this is a way of life for a LOT of people. They are not the stereotypical "homeless" that we think about, no, they are usually van lifers and full time RV'ers. It's quite a community.

Not to sidetrack the topic, but these van lifers and full time RV'ers kinda have a similar problem as the "men in skirts" community. Whereas "the law" tends to treat them as "homeless" (they're not, this is a lifestyle choice, many make an honest living, pay bills, keep valid insurance and registration, etc). But because they are not housed in a traditional manner, lawmakers treat them as homeless and not productive members of society. Something I disagree with. They are still buying food, buying gas, paying for insurance, vehicle maintenance, and paying taxes on every bit of that... but I digress.

Anyway, the homeless crisis is casting shade on vanlifers and the very lifestyle is threatened by ever tightening restrictions on living without a fixed address, much in the same way we often get grouped in with the LGBTQ group, when lawmakers attack them, we also get caught in the crossfire. It's unfortunate. And yes, I realize there are trans people who are also "men in skirts" and may loosely identify with the MIS movement, just as there are actual homeless people living in cars and vans not out of choice but due to unfortunate life circumstances. Yes, there is crossover in both worlds.

Anyway, "van life" or "RV life" is something my wife and I have considered in our golden years as a means to retirement. While I can never afford to purchase a house in Washington (nor would I want to with the crazy taxes they levy on real estate), there are ample other areas of the U.S. where housing (and real estate taxes) are much more affordable. I can easily afford a modest home in any number of states, most of them in the U.S. southeast and midwest. Purchase the property with cash, and spend our retirement years trotting from state to state in our RV, traveling in the northern parts in the summer and migrating south in the winter.

I will admit, there is a part of me that is tempted to do this now, but I know such notions are foolish. I'd need some way to make a living. It is NOT a "free" lifestyle by any means. Even if you were to simply camp on public lands forever, you'd still have to always be on the move. Twice a month you'd have to relocate at least 50 miles away, that costs fuel and maintenance on the tow vehicle. There's still auto insurance, and it's foolish to think a 2013 Silverado will last the rest of my life, eventually I'd need a newer tow vehicle, and possibly a new trailer, and between those two is a solid $100k easy. Where's that money going to come from? Plus there are the ordinary expenses we all have, such as food, health care.. (well us in the U.S. at least), and entertainment.

Oh well... maybe someday.

[moonshadow]

I have to say... in my travels, I've been quite taken with Utah. We drove right down the middle of it from Idaho to Arizona. Fun fact... the Macabi skirt I was wearing was designed and marketed in... Utah of all places. I got a few friendly comments all along the way.

I also really liked the scenery. It has a good location, not too far from anything, basically right smack in the middle. With about the same distance to Washington as Texas, it really expands the amount of places one could explore on a 9 day vacation trip.

One thing I really appreciated about Utah was the various signs along the interstate encouraging drowsy drivers to pull over and rest. No other state I've ever visited does this. In fact, many have passed laws making napping in your car ILLEGAL (again, mostly due to the homeless problem). My first impression of the "vibe of the area" was that you are allowed to be a human and not just a commodity.

I wonder if this is because of the heavy influence the LDS church has in the state, or is it in spite of it. Of course, passing through is one thing... living there is another.

Still, a little more time in Utah may be worthwhile.

[denimini]

Thanks for the reminder. Something I take for granted and see every night I go out for a pee. One of the joys of clear skies, low humidity and away from city lights.

[moonshadow]

Thanks for the reminder. Something I take for granted and see every night I go out for a pee. One of the joys of clear skies, low humidity and away from city lights.

I can imagine Australia being one mighty cool place to be, especially your section of it.

As for me, I have a fun fantasy about getting near my retirement years, maybe buying a few acres of land somewhere surrounded by public lands, somewhere in the middle of the Nevada desert, setting up an old raggedy travel trailer, a basic generator and a water supply tank. Hanging out there day after day, night after night... going into town every so often with my long grey hair, long grey beard and a walking stick, buying my coffee and hardware, complaining about "the kids these days" to the other crotchety old men in town, returning to my trailer with my graveyard of old food machines I'm tinkering with for local mom and pop establishments, maybe a HAM radio apparatus for the night time, an old shot gun at the ready and a Gadsden flag well weathered by years in the desert air.

Yeah... that's my jam.... a crazy old desert coot (in a skirt).

Sidenote, clicked on my little hand held short wave the other night... pretty sure I was picking up Australia,though can't be sure as it faded out before I could get a location and call sign. But the accents were spot on.

[6ft3Aussie]

I have to say... in my travels, I've been quite taken with Utah. We drove right down the middle of it from Idaho to Arizona. Fun fact... the Macabi skirt I was wearing was designed and marketed in... Utah of all places. I got a few friendly comments all along the way.

I also really liked the scenery. It has a good location, not too far from anything, basically right smack in the middle. With about the same distance to Washington as Texas, it really expands the amount of places one could explore on a 9 day vacation trip.

One thing I really appreciated about Utah was the various signs along the interstate encouraging drowsy drivers to pull over and rest. No other state I've ever visited does this. In fact, many have passed laws making napping in your car ILLEGAL (again, mostly due to the homeless problem). My first impression of the "vibe of the area" was that you are allowed to be a human and not just a commodity.

I wonder if this is because of the heavy influence the LDS church has in the state, or is it in spite of it. Of course, passing through is one thing... living there is another.

Still, a little more time in Utah may be worthwhile.

Moonshadow,

Yes Utah is a beautiful place, and southern Idaho reminded me very much of Canterbury in New Zealand where I grew up, broad valleys and fertile agricultural land, and similar temperature. Interesting fact, at latitude 43N, southern Idaho was strikingly similar to Canterbury, NZ, at latitude 43S. We went up as far as the Shoshone Falls on the Snake River.
Back over into Utah, Salt Lake City with those 10000 ft mountains all around sure is spectacular, as is the ski resort town of Park City. Another stunning area there is Bryce Canyon in southern Utah, high up, the car park was at 8300 ft elevation, that's higher than Australia's highest mountain.
The rugged barrenness of Arizona is spectacular, and in a very different way, we travelled up and down the I15 heading north out of Vegas. Good roads, and stunning scenery, and great that you've been able to see that area of your country.
Down in Arizona, the Grand Canyon is spectacular, multiplied on a scale that has to be seen at least once in your lifetime.

Every country has great scenery, and every country has different scenery.

One thing about Australia, especially where Deninimini is would be the vast flat land, the amazing orange sunburnt earth in contrast with the olive green scrubby trees, that lights up brilliantly just after sunrise and around sunset. The outback is a magical and extremely vast area with very low population. And yes I've been to places where you're probably 500km away from the nearest mobile phone tower.

And as for shortwave radio, interesting, but it's unlikely that you'd be hearing Australia, unless you're hearing very weak signals from some of the low powered (up to around 1kW) privately operated stations around the 120m, 90 and 60m shortwave bands, in your evening, you might hear Radio New Zealand on 17675, that's very strong here in our afternoon. The accent is different to the Aussie accent, in the same way the Canadian accent if different to the US accents.

[Ozdelights]

I'm glad you got to experience that. I, like Denmini, forget how lucky I am to now live where clear moonless nights give fantastic views. The first time I saw it was amazing.

Barry

[moonshadow]

Thanks for the feedback.

The desert might be among my favorite places to spend time. A sentiment I wasn't expecting as growing up I never was much interested in desert culture, and frankly it seemed boring (as a kid).

However as I've gotten older, I've come to appreciate the rugged beauty and isolation of the landscape. I wish there was more public BLM desert land near where I live. If I were closer I'd spend a good portion of my life there for sure.

[Mouse]

I have no experience of desert, but I do follow a car nut on YouTube who lives in Park City, Utah. One of his catch phrases, when taking us through the Utah scenery, is "Views on views". The drone shots of his drives are very impressive and he seems to have endless wilderness to work with.
https://www.youtube.com/@TheStradman/featured

[Seb]

Driving through the US southwest is one of my better memories, drove from DFW to Flagstaff passing Albaqurque and then down through Phoenix and Toucson to Sierra Vista and back to DFW again but through El Paso and the Carlsbad mountains.

Saw plenty of night skies and sunsets, there is a special beauty to these landscapes. I would love to go to the Atacama or Sahara just for the night sky.

I'm blessed by being rural enough to see the milky way from my back lawn when the moon is new (and there are no clouds to block the view).

[crfriend]

I still remember the beautiful arc of the Milky Way stretching from horizon to horizon from atop the Continental Divide in Colorado one time in the 1990s when Diana was still with me. She'd never seen it (I had), and we even got a satellite transit, which, again she'd never witnessed but I had. It was black, and I mean darkroom black as we were miles from the nearest outpost of civilisation. It was .. amazing.

Second prize goes to the time I was stopped on a Chicago-to-Denver train trip somewhere in the plains and saw sunrise first crack the horizon. The entire sky turned this spectacular magenta colour, and silhouetted the irrigation equipment perfectly. That, too, was a sublime moment. One feels rather alone in such settings.

Moon: Nice shot of Orion there several posts back!

[Dust]

I grew up rural enough to see the Milky Way from my front yard. Then we moved. Fast forward a couple years, and I was sitting in a high school science class with about 20 students. The teacher asked how many of us had ever seen the Milky Way, and mine was one of only two hands that went up. Other kids were looking at each other like "what the heck is he talking about?" Part of me wanted to cry, but after that I understood just how lucky I had been...

[FranTastic444]

One of our favourite parts of getting to holiday in the English Lake District each year was that we got to see the Milky Way on clear nights.

♫ I saw two shooting stars last night
I wished on them but they were only satellites
Is it wrong to wish on space hardware
I wish, I wish, I wish you'd care ♫

Where we live now in semi-rural Southern MA, the sky doesn't get dark enough to see the Milky Way, but it is prime satellite fall-by spotting territory. Once your eyes have got accustomed to the dark and you know what you are looking for, it is possible to see some satellites that are so dim / tiny that they can only be observed by looking at them from slightly off center (dead ahead makes them disappear due to the position of your optic nerve). In 2025, there are so many pieces of hardware falling around the earth that they can be seen every few minutes. Many of the satellites follow either a North to South track or, at my latitude at least, a NW to NE track - but you do also get some satellites that plough their own furrow. Those that travel away from the sun will fade to black (as they enter the shadow of the earth). Of course, the daddy of them all is ISS, which is so much brighter than any other satellite.

For anyone interested, sites such as Heavens Above will provide details of satellites that can be viewed from your location for a given night. Just select your location here and then click on this link here to get daily predictions for brighter satellites The smaller (or more negative) then number under the Brightness (magnitude) column, the brighter the object should appear.

As an aside, we were sat out in the yard on Friday night, watching the stars come out to play and then spotting satellites. As we sat there, our necks craned upwards, we saw a most unusual meteorite event. Normally when we see them, they are very rapid streaks across the sky that last a fraction of a second. This one was somewhat slower and as it descended it broke up into several smaller pieces, each creating a separate fragment of a meteor. Both my wife and I saw this event - a great sight!

If we can pull of our dream of getting an Airstream, we want to spend a lot of time out West on BLM land and in the type of settings as outlined by Moon in earlier posts on this thread. I really want to try out the photography techniques as laid out on this website.