"men wearing skirts"

[Jim2]

I sometimes go looking for new web pages with something about men wearing skirts. In doing so today, I came across a page where a woman was asking for advice about wearing a skirt at a brewery she was going to visit. I found it interesting that she addressed her question as follows:

A question for women (or men wearing skirts..).

Just seems that the idea of men wearing skirts is getting more and more accepted, or perhaps I should say accepted as a possibility. I found it here http://forum.virtualtourist.com/London- ... -tour.html.

[JeffB1959]

Hmm! Rather interesting to say the least. I would say that men wearing skirts is no longer the joke or perversion the public once envisioned it as being. Because men like me take skirt wearing seriously, doing their best to look appropriate for whatever surroundings they happen to be in, people no longer have a reason to view what we do as kinky or strange. And yes, perhaps a level of acceptance of what we do has indeed settled in for us.

[TheSkirtedMan]

I still think in certain locations men in skirts is difficult, but on the whole and generally I would agree these days men in skirts is more accepting. My wife and I recently went to a theater in a new city for us and we were warned that in the latter years it had become a bit of a problem Friday/Saturday nights. I still went skirted but aware of my surroundings. I got two wolf whistles!

Apart from the small minority that look/stare, often talked about on this forum, and they will do that to any body or thing that is different to them, I do not have any problems and do go all over in clothing still labeled as womens wear. Plenty of photos on my site. Dentists, Doctors, Hospital, Theaters etc.

I openly go to cashiers in the still labelled womens wear departments with skirts and tops and now have two online accounts at the two main places I purchase and post comments about the items. Always accepted. I now get loyalty discounts just like my wife gets on her account and for my purchases when I used her account!

On the whole I do think slowly but surely men in skirts is becoming a positive talking point as you refer to in the link above.

[skirtyscot]

Although the men in skirts bit is in parenthesis, it doesn't seem like she added as any sort of joke. More that she considered it a realistic possibility that there are some of us out there. That's good.

[moonshadow]

Im not sure if its acceptance, or that most people just don't care. Aside from being somewhat of a novelty I suppose. We do live in an age of wild people. From rainbow colored spiked hair to ear piercings you could fit a 50cent piece in... frankly a man in a skirt, may look tame by comparison. Unusual? Yes. But there's so much more bizarre things to gawk at.

[dillon]

Im not sure if its acceptance, or that most people just don't care. Aside from being somewhat of a novelty I suppose. We do live in an age of wild people. From rainbow colored spiked hair to ear piercings you could fit a 50cent piece in... frankly a man in a skirt, may look tame by comparison. Unusual? Yes. But there's so much more bizarre things to gawk at.

In as much as style and fashion, even spiked multicolor hair and a tattooed pierced body, represent to the unthinking masses an association with a group or belief structure, it may be that a man dressed relatively normally, aside from wearing a skirt or other adornments usually associated with women, may be even more threatening to someone's sense of understanding. Such a man, borrowing things associated with femininity yet not imitating a woman, challenges the ability of the thoughtless masses to instantly classify or pigeonhole him. It forces people to think, and for many, that can be a frightening experience.

As for gawking, I occasionally see someone with so many facial piercings that I am reminded of some aged giant catfish of the sort we have in the Cape Fear River, which can weigh upward of sixty pounds, and may have a mouth ornamented with years worth of fishing tackle piercing those great fish lips.

[Jim2]

Although the men in skirts bit is in parenthesis, it doesn't seem like she added as any sort of joke. More that she considered it a realistic possibility that there are some of us out there. That's good.

Yes, that's what I thought, too. It's why I decided to note it here.

[crfriend]

In as much as style and fashion, even spiked multicolor hair and a tattooed pierced body, represent to the unthinking masses an association with a group or belief structure, it may be that a man dressed relatively normally, aside from wearing a skirt or other adornments usually associated with women, may be even more threatening to someone's sense of understanding. Such a man, borrowing things associated with femininity yet not imitating a woman, challenges the ability of the thoughtless masses to instantly classify or pigeonhole him. It forces people to think, and for many, that can be a frightening experience.

This may be one facet that's in play -- we present precisely an image that must be actively considered if one is not to reject it immediately and outright -- and that can be scary, for the masses are not used to actually using their brains. This becomes extremely -- existentially -- dangerous when one deals with either society as a whole, or even worse, the State. Individuals are unlikely to offer trouble in one-to-one surroundings; they can even be rather pleasant once the ice is broken. However, dealing with a gang or a government is exponentially worse; both are unthinking and the latter is utterly unaccountable for its actions - and both are inherently violent in their approach.

As far as piercings and tattoos go, I'm not a big fan of either; nor am I a fan of other surgical "body-modification" procedures (forked tongues, &.). I see tattoos on an otherwise attractive young woman and think, "She's really pretty, but it's too bad about that big scar." This may be my conservative side showing, but I'm not really a fan of the same on guys. This is not to say that I would oppose someone getting a tattoo; that's their inalienable right. However, it does cause a small bit of judgement on my part at the outset.

I like the "catfish" comment! How apropo.

[Tor]

Tattoos and piercings? I have to admit to a certain measure of revulsion on seeing them. Especially large tattoos on highly visible places and less common piercings. While I might think the person foolish for getting such, like Carl said, it is my prerogative only to choose to have less to do with them and perhaps offer advice. As I would generally appreciate not being offered such unasked advice, I'm apt to extend similar courtesy unless there is reason otherwise, and quietly have somewhat less to do with folk who have already done the deed.

...This becomes extremely -- existentially -- dangerous when one deals with either society as a whole, or even worse, the State. ... However, dealing with a gang or a government is exponentially worse; both are unthinking and the latter is utterly unaccountable for its actions - and both are inherently violent in their approach.

If there is any place where the "Transgender Movement" can be unequivocably said to have helped us, it probably is in dealing with those folk, often called "State Agents" or such, who are given a moral pass by far to many people for actions that would be decried by [nearly] all if done by anyone else, or even those same people when not wearing the "State Agent Hat". Specifically, I think that personal expression is a place where, thanks to transgender folk, even most "State Agents" fear to tread upon in a way that wouldn't have before.

In too many places I see that whole lot of folk grouped together trying to swing the pendulum too far and take what isn't properly right to demand (something I fear may at some point be to their great cost). That isn't to say we shouldn't enjoy what we can pluck from their coattails, to mangle a metaphor, even as we (some of us?) decry their excess claim.

[dillon]

As for tattoos, I don't care for facial tats. And usually not for large tats. I did happen to see a heavily tattooed woman, a very attractive woman, and found that the colorful art she wore was, well, rather erotic. That's a rare reaction for me, but hers was quite well drawn and planned. I think part of the problem is that many people who expose tattooed skin are the sort of people who look better when heavily dressed. But if it makes them happy, who am I to object?

[skirtyscot]

... the sort of people who look better when heavily dressed...

You win the prize for best euphemism of the week!

[Pdxfashionpioneer]

My personal experience says that people are more accepting.
This summer has been particularly hot in Portland OR and those long sleeveless dresses that have become so popular also looked very cool. Cool enough that I decided to take the plunge. I bought my first such dress at Costco. For those of you who aren't familiar with Costco, on the way out the front door a member of their staff checks your receipt against a glance into your shopping cart. The young woman who checked out mine told me, I'd "look great in it." She followed that up with reassurance that she was just kidding. I believe subconciously she got it and was expressing her support. It took me awhile to wear it to the grocery store, late at night and was pleased to see that most people didn't give me a first glance, let alone a second. The store staff was universally kind and appropriate.
Next I bought a shirtdress on line from Target and decided I would wear it all day, including going to the curbside mailbox just to force myself past my inhibitions. I ran into a neighbor with a toddler and we had an extended conversation. She was as natural as could be despite my nervousness.
During the summer I held a temporary job in a downtown office with a great view of row of food carts. At least once a day I sighted a man in a skirt. And noone seemed to take particular notice.
When I got to the point where I felt like taking the full plunge I thought church might be a good starting point, it's a very open-minded, open-hearted congregation. Because I was afraid some of the members might take the attitude of "not in my church" or "please, not in front of my kids," I talked to our pastor about it first. Her advice was "just do it." I had in mind that maybe I should give a guest sermon on it and take a poll, when I tried to suggest that she cut me off mid-sentence to say, "Just do it." Which was her response to my 3rd attempt at equivocation. I was ecstatic!
The next Sunday I put on a brand-new sweaterdress and high (stacked) heels and drove off to church. In the parking lot, I hesitated to get out of my SUV. I took 2 deep breaths and before I could take a third I decided that another deep breath wasn't going to change anything. Instead of just handing me a bulletin the greeter, a married woman I barely knew, gave me a warm hug. As did the 2nd. The third, an older lady, hugged me so tightly and so long you'd have thought she waited her whole life to see a man come to church in a dress.
I have yet to receive a single rude comment. I've been going to church in dresses ever since and generally spend the weekend in skirts or dresses. It took a couple months of going in public this way for me to get a "hairy eyeball" look from an adult and only one or two hesitations from retail clerks. If anything they've been kinder and nicer than when I'm in trousers.
I haven't gone to work this way or told my 100 year-old mother about my expansion of my wardrobe, but everything in its time. For us, outer space isn't the final frontier. Or maybe it will be ...

[moonshadow]

When I got to the point where I felt like taking the full plunge I thought church might be a good starting point, it's a very open-minded, open-hearted congregation. Because I was afraid some of the members might take the attitude of "not in my church" or "please, not in front of my kids," I talked to our pastor about it first. Her advice was "just do it." I had in mind that maybe I should give a guest sermon on it and take a poll, when I tried to suggest that she cut me off mid-sentence to say, "Just do it." Which was her response to my 3rd attempt at equivocation. I was ecstatic!
The next Sunday I put on a brand-new sweaterdress and high (stacked) heels and drove off to church. In the parking lot, I hesitated to get out of my SUV. I took 2 deep breaths and before I could take a third I decided that another deep breath wasn't going to change anything. Instead of just handing me a bulletin the greeter, a married woman I barely knew, gave me a warm hug. As did the 2nd. The third, an older lady, hugged me so tightly and so long you'd have thought she waited her whole life to see a man come to church in a dress.
I have yet to receive a single rude comment. I've been going to church in dresses ever since and generally spend the weekend in skirts or dresses. It took a couple months of going in public this way for me to get a "hairy eyeball" look from an adult and only one or two hesitations from retail clerks. If anything they've been kinder and nicer than when I'm in trousers.
I haven't gone to work this way or told my 100 year-old mother about my expansion of my wardrobe, but everything in its time. For us, outer space isn't the final frontier. Or maybe it will be ...

What a GREAT story! I wasn't surprised about your lack of any issues in the general public, as I live in an extremely conservative area and have no issues in public aside from the occasional gawk (seem to notice is less and less as time goes by), but I REALLY like your story about church and the woman who gave you a hug started to get me choked up (I'm not kidding), it really does my heart and soul well to see such members of society that clearly harbor love in their heart.

Your church seems like a real keeper, you are VERY blessed to belong to such an accepting spiritual family. Points for the female minister too, something we see far too few off around these parts.

May I ask what denomination of church you go to? If it's too personal I understand, however I'd like to give it a few moral points in my head. I've been debating on going to the local Universal Unitarian church in my area but I can't seem to get out of bed early enough. Some people on this board who read my post think that I have some sort of issue with religion, or more to the point, Christianity. I don't. I just don't care for intolerant people. Fashionpioneer's church seems to "get it". If all were like that, there would be no need for heaven, we'd already be there!

Also bravo on the dress! I have to admit, though I have purchased two dresses to date, they have not seen the outside of my house yet. Still working up the nerve to take them out. Skirts aren't a big deal anymore, but for me dresses take a little more gall.

Maybe residence in Portland OR could be in my future! Then again, north eastern North Carolina seemed to handle my skirts pretty well yesterday, and there's a rumor the company I work for may be buying some stores around those parts, and if so my boss has already expressed interest in me moving to the area. I'd like to, but I don't want to come off too eager as I think they should pay my moving expenses this time.

As far as religion, God, and the devil are concerned, on the matter of skirts.... see my signature!

[Caultron]

My personal experience says that people are more accepting...

Great story! And while the details may be different, all of us here have pretty much gone through the same thing.

The only place it's an issue is inside your own head,

[Pdxfashionpioneer]

To be specific, mine is a United Methodist Church. I think it does help that I live in Portland, OR. Both when it has veered toward conservatism and now progressivism the main ethos of the place is live and let live. It also helped that I had somehow established a reputation for being a member of the congregation who had really good things for the church. I haven't figured that one out, but I try to take it as a challenge to not disappoint. Forgive the digression.
One of my guiding principles when looking at dresses is "Is this a style that would be in the Men's Dept. if men commonly wore dresses?" I feel shirtdresses and sweaterdresses almost universally make that cut. My 2nd principle is "Why should women have all the clothing fun?" Specifically, concerning fabrics, colors and prints. I haven't bought any floral print dresses yet, but when I do, it'll either be something like what you'd see on a Hawaiian shirt or something that's a large print that's more of a background like palm fronds than really busy and girlie.
The ultimate test is the mirror test; how do I look in it. That's why even though buying on line is where I started and I expect most of the rest of us have started, one of the reasons I suggest moving on to stores as soon as possible.
The other is that in the US even for women sizes don't mean much. For us men it's even worse, the style and cut make a lot of difference in the fit. By the measurements you'll find on line I should wear a 16 but they're too large. I've found that size 14 dresses and jackets generally work well for me, but I've gotten a size 12 and I'm glad I never bought a suit on line because while I need a 14 jacket anything larger than a 10 skirt falls off me and I even have a sz 8 skirt.
To show you how complicated it gets, I've always thought sheaths were a style that should be in the Men's section. When a designer actually showed a line of men's sheaths a female reviewer that was absolutely the way to go because it showed off the male physique so well. When Penney's had a black, Liz Claiborne sheath in my size on sale for $30 I was sold. I had it delivered to the store so I could easily return it if I had to. It came home. After I snipped the tags off I discovered it bagged around the neckline because - surprise, surprise - I didn't fill it out. Having just started a new nod and feeling rich as Croesus I took, with my work suits, to my tailor for alterations. When I learned the alterations would cost twice as much as the dress itself I asked if I should have just gotten the next size smaller (a 12). After looking me over carefully she said, "No," because the next size down wouldn't fit across my shoulders. I've gotten plenty of compliments on my Liz Claiborne sheath.
When you decide to go to a store for your dresses, let me give you two more suggestions. One, go in a skirt. On a recent Sunday I was shopping in an outlet mall I overhearda gentleman tell another member of his party, "Oh, I thought that was a woman," which is remsrkable because I keep what little is left of my hair close-cropped. In addition, for some reason I feel more comfortable shopping in the Women's department when I'm in a skirt or dress. Not that it matters at all to the store clerks. Including the male clerks.
Which brings me to my 2nd suggestion, when you start getting anxious, which you undoubtedly will no matter what, just remind yourself that not only are you not doing anything wrong, you're doing exactly what people are supposed to be doing there; potentially spending money.