Windows 8 -- Just shoot me now.

[couyalair]

After learning Cobol, but never actually using it), I went on to Basic and began my computer life programming whatever task I had to do, mostly texts with some bitmap illustrations. In those days, home computers came without software.
A little later I was introduced to the early Mac and bought a second-hand one with which I had fun (inserting and retrieving the little disquettes every few minutes!), but the programming has been done for me -- MaWrite and MacPaint, all I needed.

After progressing to the next generation with some hard disc capacity, I spent happy hours building SimCities when not doing translation work, for which I eventually realized that greater capacity was needed. I fancied the attractive blue imac with all the innards showing, but discovered that it had new-fangled usb ports with which none of my peripheric devices would fit. Disgusted at this, I let myself be tempted with a windows machine -- so much cheaper than Macs. I took an instant dislike to it, tried to sell it almost immediately, but resigned my self to my fate and to learning its weirderies, such as having to code the @ sign ( and later, the € sign). I thought of loading Linux, but the changeover looked a bit too complicated for my little brain, and I live and cursed with windows.
My wife decided she needed her own computer about when the first laptop appeared, and I decided to fork out for the Macbook (or ibook, can't remember) for myself and let her have my windows.
And I've never regretted that decision, there seemed to be nothing to learn, it was all quite intuitive. When you've used both systems, there is no comparison.
The windows machine gave up the ghost, of course, and my wife went onto a windows (XP ?) laptop, which ended up being flung to the floor in a fit of impatience with its user-unfriendliness.

Unlike some of you people, I don't need complicated software and I can see no use for the Dashboard or music-arranging programmes. I'd be happier with Apple if, instead of producing more sophisticated machines at ever higher prices, they proposed a basic computer for everyday communication/text work and photo/music storage at reasonable cost.

Martin

[JohnCinskirt]

my solution to windows 8 is simple, I use ubuntu. I gave in and tried using a linux os after having a virus in my system 32 folder that was causing me nothing but problems for months and no way to remove it. I will never buy another windows machine again.

[kingfish]

For your amusement....

[skirted_in_SF]

For your amusement....

I laughed so hard I almost wet myself. Got to stop drinking tea with lunch.

[crfriend]

Well, the bloody saga continues.

Amongst other things that came with the machine, the "Internet Security" suite has managed to completely disable mundane things like e-mail, some web-browsing, and the ability to install terminal-emulation software. Of course, I am fully to blame for all of this and the fact that "critical" messages didn't get out last night.

The upshot seems to be that the world will end and life as we know it will cease to be.

The thing that's really torquing me off, and likely why I won't get any sleep tonight, is that the "uninstaller" for the "Internet Security" suite is an advertising package that refuses to do the uninstall. By Christ I am getting to hate what computers have become.

Like aviation, "What a dream it was; what a nightmare it has become."

My god, I want my NOVA -- or the Interdata 3 -- back. And a simpler time where the post was the post, telephones were telephones, and that was, as they say, that. I hate these damned modern "appliances". The former joy of computing is just gone.

[Sinned]

Like all on this thread Microsoft et al have ruined the experience that was once computing. All of the recent Windows abortions have been ok but over time have exhibited some symptoms of stability. Even the W7 that I am currently using is showing problems of copying photographs out to an external drive. No clear idea what the problem is but the symptom is that the laptop hangs for ages ( and I mean 30 minutes to an hour ) before giving up trying. I'm also getting messages that Windows has stopped ( when it clearly hasn't ) and a popup requesting a login for my Outlook email account which I just close. I'm thinking that when I am able to replace this machine ( whwn I get a job, which may be some time, even for a CompSci graduate ) I will go for a Linux model and run Windows and Office on top of that. Not looked into it for a while so any suggestions for the systems for those of you more knowledgeable?

[Charlie]

Not looked into it for a while so any suggestions for the systems for those of you more knowledgeable?

Like JohnCinskirt I use Ubuntu which is based on linux.The latest stable version is 12.04 which features program icons down the left-hand side of the screen - a wide screen monitor is good for this.
On that I use Firefox for the web, Thunderbird for e-mail and LibreOffice for word processing, spreadsheets etc. There's a huge software repository where you can generally find the application you require and its all open source and free. Plus, because of the way linux works (correct me if I'm wrong), there's no requirement for a virus checker.
You can download Ubuntu and burn it to a CD or a memory stick, then use that to boot a windoze PC into linux. This allows you to try Ubuntu before committing to installing it, although the installer gives you the option to retain windoze and make the PC dual-boot. It's a bit slow because of the CD access time but gives you an idea of what Ubuntu is all about.
For programs that are specific to windoze, there is the Wine emulator. This sits on top of linux; I use it to run Dreamweaver, Quicken and Paint Shop Pro which are all designed for windoze. My PC is dual-boot and also runs XP which I keep for the occasional program that Wine will not run (Wine isn't perfect!).
Charlie

[Milfmog]

Wine isn't perfect!

I have a wife who might argue that point

Have fun,


Ian.

That's right, Carole was reading over my shoulder when I typed that

[Tor]

As for wine not being perfect, depending on what you are doing, it is possible to use virtualbox to run a genuine windows installation simultaneous with a GNU/Linux. I've done this before (though not for me), and there are ways to even integrate the Windows windows into your real window manager - or so I've read. I haven't tried the latter, so I can't vouch for it's effectiveness. I believe this option can work well on most systems with at least two processor cores.

[crfriend]

Well, this latest fire is out and it's all over save the wounds suffered and the crying.

I got the "internet Security" suite uninstalled, and now e-mail and web-surfing work as expected. There are still nasty comments made under The Wife's breath about things that make me cringe as I know I'll be blamed for those as well, but at least life as we know it still goes on and nobody went to jail.

This, however, I stick with:

Like aviation, "What a dream it was; what a nightmare it has become."

That sentiment was first voiced during The War to End All Wars when aviation was in its very infancy. Nowadays, we take that technology for granted and accept its presence, even if we may not necessarily be able to partake of it due to cost-cutting and other factors.

Computing is no different. I still recall working fervently on it in the hopes that it might change the world for the better. in those days it was fun and challenging and there was a drive that one could feel. Now, however, computing has become little more than a vehicle to shove "advertising" at one, a mechanism to be tracked by and large databases amassed about one, and an endless vector for overt attacks of one ilk or another. The joy of the technology is now, perhaps, inextricably gone. This, to me, is a positively massive loss and is now making me question my own drivers from so many years ago that got me into a profession that has stood me well over the years. The complete shattering of a cherished dream seems to be only "collateral damage".

What's next I do not know. But, the passion is passing and it seems that the well is poisoned. Yes, we flew to the moon and back; but we did so in the "heroic age" of computing and technology. Nowadays more folks believe that the moon landings were faked than not and computers have become "appliances" that only sometimes answer to the demands and wishes of their owners.

Things are not improving. The fact that I wound up crying myself to sleep last night over the loss merely points up the dire state of the situation. I need to spend more time in the company of my historical systems and to try to keep them running. What's on offer now just plain sucks.

[skirted_in_SF]

Not looked into it for a while so any suggestions for the systems for those of you more knowledgeable?

Like JohnCinskirt I use Ubuntu which is based on linux.The latest stable version is 12.04 which features program icons down the left-hand side of the screen - a wide screen monitor is good for this.

I bought a new Windows 7 computer several years ago that I immediately installed Linux Mint on. I had had a good experience with Linux (Xandros) on my previous computer and expected the same result. I didn't get it, I never could get that install to be stable. It would lock up anywhere from once a day to three times in five minutes. After a good experience with my new Win7 computer at work I patched the bootloader on my new computer and now normally boot to Windows.

On that I use Firefox for the web, Thunderbird for e-mail and LibreOffice for word processing, spreadsheets etc. There's a huge software repository where you can generally find the application you require and its all open source and free. Plus, because of the way linux works (correct me if I'm wrong), there's no requirement for a virus checker.

I use the same free software (except for Thunderbird) on my Win7 computer.
Linux is pretty much virus free because of the small installed base and more of that base being tech savvy. The Apple OS (which has some of the same roots as Linux) used to be considered virus free for the first reason. I've recently read that isn't as true anymore. Apparently Apple had to release a patch recently to prevent an exploit that was beginning to be used.

[Sinned]

Computing in its general term has lost its magic for me also but I did enjoy the Service Delivery ( troubleshooting or support ) side as there were any number of ways in which software ( and to a lesser extent hardware ) can fail. Outside of the more common fail reasons there were always new faults to tax the grey cells. But due to redundancy I have been out of that area for a few years now and I'm having difficulty getting back into it. I applied for a Helpdesk job whose JD couldn't have matched more if I had written it for me. Did I get an interview - No. The reason I was given for rejection was that there were others that had more experience! I have over 17 years experience all of it in either development or service delivery. How much more experience do they want? Anyway rant over and I'm having to re-evaluate as I don't know what else I can do for the next 7 years. Computers have just become a commodity, like a TV or hi-fi. The ability to program it has gone with the advent of Windows. You used to be able to buy decent compilers for C/C++ but most programming now is Java/HTML for producing web pages. It's tempting.

[kingfish]

Boy am I glad I'm doing stuff in the "optimized embedded system" realm. It is still an environment where 64K is a lot of space, making that darned light blink at the right time is what it is all about, and a text based, and a command driven, interface is still a high capability control channel.

The code on the PC (windows in particular) has gotten so obfuscated that it can take years to get a full understanding of its inner workings. And that is exactly how Microsoft wants it. They don't want people developing their own applications (remember when they were called programs?) They want to sell you theirs, and will do everything they can to encourage just that. And Apple is even more monolithic about it (if not more aggressive). They dictate the style of the user interface. As for Linux, it didn't really take off until a large enough segment of the development world got fed up with these giants and started making stuff using Richard Stallman's "copyleft" (guerrilla development) model.

Back in the early days when I played "Adventure" from the directory ">UDD>MFS>[dad's account]>kingfish", computer systems were just coming into their own as a power tool for driving the information age, and full of wonder. That wonder still exists. That simplicity still exists. It's just that these days, that simplicity is found in things like a $25 arduino. Yeah, the arduino is a toy. But toys, in general, really are nothing more than tools meant to facilitate learning important principles through the play they facilitate.

Of course, I also miss the days when the computer held a wonder all its own.

[crfriend]

Boy am I glad I'm doing stuff in the "optimized embedded system" realm. It is still an environment where 64K is a lot of space, making that darned light blink at the right time is what it is all about, and a text based, and a command driven, interface is still a high capability control channel.

This may be my way out of the madness that general computing has become. It won't help me in dealing with my wife's travails unless I decide to break that link, but may assist with my utter disillusionment with what has become of my dream. Thanks for the hint!

Yes, realtime properly-handled interrupt-driven stuff is good -- and still intimately connected to the "old school" way of doing things. Ah, the power to build your own I/O stuff, write the drivers from scratch, and integrate them into a functioning system. If embedded systems is where the fun is at today, I need to take a look at it.

Of course, I also miss the days when the computer held a wonder all its own.

I still capture this from time to time with my historical collection. It may be that which keeps me alive.

[r.m.anderson]

I bought a Windows 8 laptop recently with loads of goodies: 1TB HD 16G RAM and a super fast Intel chip.
Only bought it this way because the price was right and that is the ONLY way you can get the damn things now.

What is and was so in"APT"propriate was the damn apts on the starting screen.
Not my favorite starting place/point.

I went to Best Buy and consulted with a Geek Squad representative.
Simple solution short of erasing and deleting everything and reloading with a Windows 7 or Ultimate Vista platform
is to press the WINDOWS key and THE LETTER "D" - this takes you to the desktop screen with all the familiar
icons just like you were at Windows 7.

At least this is a suitable solution - but I am thinking perhaps a dual boot to get to all the familiar ins & outs
of the Windows platforms without all the crap and fuss that some jerk at Microsoft thought would be so convenient.
Loading Windows 7 as the Primary with Windows 8 as a Secondary as if I would ever use it again !

Still waiting for the day when I can tell the computer where to go "Beam me up Scotty" priced at a level that
I don't have to be one of 1 % rich folks with an unlimited budget at my disposal.

And another thing "Trying to shut down the machine and exit" !
Why couldn't the jerks just leave the START button at the bottom left of the screen to turn off the damn machine.
No you have to be in some ackward mode and fine the hidden "Settings" button on the right side of screen and
then fiddle around powering off the machine.
Makes one just want to just pulled the AC plug or battery out of the machine and never use it again !
"What were these idiots thinking"?????

"Certainly-Not-A-Skirted-Topic-But-Worthy-Of-My-Condemnation-To-The-N-Degree"!
rma