Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Discussion of fashion elements and looks that are traditionally considered somewhat "femme" but are presented in a masculine context. This is NOT about transvestism or crossdressing.
Barleymower
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by Barleymower »

To add perspective to our cause, I saw Mark Bryan pop up on a Facebook feed. He was wearing a skirt, heels as always, shirt and tank top.
There were approximately 80 comments to follow. 54 very negative comments ranging from not right to injury. There were 18 positive comments in line with freedom and it's just clothes. The rest were fairly neutral.
My perspective is:
1. It's a divisive issue with people being on one side or the other.
2. Positivity exists- we are not alone
3. It does not matter what type of skirt you wear. It's still seen as a skirt.

When will we move beyond the boy in a skirt being news?
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by crfriend »

Coder wrote: Fri Jul 05, 2024 1:53 pmTo me, this is where I land too. I'll wear what I want, so long as it's appropriate for the situation and doesn't deviate from the norm. Granted, the norm today are skinny jeans/leggings and not skirts - but skirts still remain a "normal" choice for women, and they should be for men.
I'll push the boundaries a bit harder insofar as knowing I'm already "deviating from the norm" if I show up in a skirt. My approach is that I'm not going to get even close to the "line" where it turns into drag, but is merely apparel that I decide to adorn myself in.

Yesterday's outfit for (what was perhaps the last) 4th of July celebration in the USA was my blue mini-dress, white lattice-work knee-highs, and my red heels.

Nobody batted an eyelash.
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shadowfax
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by shadowfax »

Barleymower wrote: Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:34 pm Wear whatever you want.
+1
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Mouse
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by Mouse »

Terribly sorry guys, but I reject any rules on heel height.
Daily, a happy man in a skirt...
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by STEVIE »

Barleymower wrote: Fri Jul 05, 2024 2:16 pm When will we move beyond the boy in a skirt being news?
BM, it's not news now, it's tolerated, just not as widely accepted as we'd wish.
Change might happen, or not, as the case may be and no one including all the "influencers" in the world won't make one bit of a difference.
Your comments seem to bear this out and, frankly, I told you so.
Steve.
PS even the A-lister guys in skirts seem to have disappeared back to Trouserland so I can't be surprised at the reactions to Mark Bryan.
PPS, Mouse as for rules, for us there are only the ones we choose to follow ourselves, by donning a skirt, we've already broken a big one anyway.
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by JohnH »

Mouse wrote: Sat Jul 06, 2024 5:40 am Terribly sorry guys, but I reject any rules on heel height.
That 75 mm (3 inch) heel height for me is simply a limitation due to my age as I'm a 72 year old geezer. If I was younger I might go with higher heels.

John
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by yardstick »

Barleymower wrote: Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:34 pm Wear whatever you want.
Exactly, the more people do this the more likely change will happen, albeit a gradual process.
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by JohnH »

I believe what really harms the cause for men in skirts (MIS) are men who pretend they are women and take on made up feminine names rather than the attire itself. When I'm dressed en femme I speak with my normal male voice and go by the name of John.

John
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by STEVIE »

JohnH wrote: Sun Jul 07, 2024 1:57 am I believe what really harms the cause for men in skirts (MIS) are men who pretend they are women and take on made up feminine names rather than the attire itself. When I'm dressed en femme I speak with my normal male voice and go by the name of John.
John
Sorry John,
I just have to disagree, on both counts.
I cannot see how full on femme impersonation harms the cause, nor your own stated actions furthering it.
I will say again no single action will ever have an impact, good or bad, just be thankful that we are tolerated enough to actually choose.
Acceptance of any non conforming men by society in general is a wholly different matter and the actions of one segment has little or no effect on the whole bloody mess.
We just ain't that important!
Steve.
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by Barleymower »

STEVIE wrote: Sun Jul 07, 2024 3:45 am
I cannot see how full on femme impersonation harms the cause, nor your own stated actions furthering it.
Stevie how do you further the cause?
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by Midas »

Barleymower wrote: Sun Jul 07, 2024 8:14 am
STEVIE wrote: Sun Jul 07, 2024 3:45 am
I cannot see how full on femme impersonation harms the cause, nor your own stated actions furthering it.
Stevie how do you further the cause?
I don’t see female impersonation as affecting us at all, as it’s a different thing and in my view has no effect on us.

As for Stevie furthering ‘the cause’ (not an expression I like, as it has political connotations) I think he is a fine ambassador for men in skirts.
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by rivegauche »

I have a foot in both camps here. I am sometimes a man in a skirt and other times I am that guy doing the full female presentation thing with bust, make up and body language. I don't ever identify as a woman so it is just acting so I do not have a foot in the trans camp. It is not the responsibility of one camp to avoid harming the interests of the other - they all have a case. Even Grayson Perry who is so obviously having immense fun with his preposterous dresses gets criticised for not dressing like a real woman - they are sort of missing the point. The only ones I think are harming the wider situation are the people presenting as women politically if not efficiently flaunting their male anatomy in communal changing areas like you get in sports facilities - they are gratuitously causing offence because they can. If you are not harming anyone there should be no boundaries or restrictions. Presenting in a gender other than your own is only deception if someone is being disadvantaged as a result. So the answer to the question is no.
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by STEVIE »

Barleymower wrote: Sun Jul 07, 2024 8:14 am
STEVIE wrote: Sun Jul 07, 2024 3:45 am
I cannot see how full on femme impersonation harms the cause, nor your own stated actions furthering it.
Stevie how do you further the cause?
As I recall the first meeting in Peterborough, led to the London meetings.
Would that have happened without my intervention?
The Herald article, published in March last year happened with a little help from me.
I could go further, but I am surprised by your question.
Steve.
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by Barleymower »

STEVIE wrote: Sun Jul 07, 2024 4:05 pm As I recall the first meeting in Peterborough, led to the London meetings.
Would that have happened without my intervention?
The Herald article, published in March last year happened with a little help from me.
I could go further, but I am surprised by your question.
Steve.
Would that have happened without my intervention?
Answer: No
I could go further, but I am surprised by your question.
Why?

Meetings are good for the sanity of MIS and perhaps family unity. But does not further the cause.

As you have said we just are not that important. We have a new Deputy PM Angela Rayner, maybe she would be interested in us?
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Re: Overly Flamboyant Outfits Detrimental to Mainstreaming MIS?

Post by Coder »

Barleymower wrote: Sun Jul 07, 2024 4:59 pm Meetings are good for the sanity of MIS and perhaps family unity. But does not further the cause.
I think Stevie is suggesting the news articles - describing "regular blokes" - wearing skirted outfits - helps further the cause.
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