Dear God.... (glad I'm going AWOL next week)

[JeffB1959]

https://www.newsweek.com/topless-trans- ... ge-1806151

So glad I'm going to be in the mountains far away from cell service for 9 days next week....

God have mercy on us, and I pray there will be a country to return to....

It has been wisely written "all things in moderation".

I'm willing to concede, some are getting intoxicated on "PRIDE". It's turning into a cult.... a religion, and thus, perhaps time to be separated from state. The only thing separating it from cultish region at this point is a lack of a defined "leader"...

Planting a progress flag between two American flags is courting trouble, and even I would agree, it is disrespectful. I do not endorse this.

Was the Black Power movement in the 1960's and 70's looked upon as a "cult" too? I have zero problem with the Pride movement. I can see parallels between two marginalized groups tired of being oppressed and demanding to be recognized. Gonna disagree with you here.

[pelmut]

Some good news from Lincoln (UK), 5 trans-haters overwhelmed by 200 LGBT supporters.

[Stu]

Some good news from Lincoln (UK), 5 trans-haters overwhelmed by 200 LGBT supporters.

I am not "anti" anybody. I am a believer in live and let live - and you do you.

I do think, however, that many ordinary people are becoming rather bored with the Pride stuff and they tired of having it shoved in their faces. Me included. I have no desire to celebrate someone else's sexuality and I don't expect anyone else to celebrate mine. In my view, LGBT people can and should quietly celebrate the fact that they have achieved equality, acceptance and respect and move on with their lives. If they push too hard against what is now an open door, they will end up flat on their faces.

As for trans people, there was a heartwarming story in The Telegraph over the weekend. This couple have done more for trans people than all the protests and drag acts put together. It would soften the hearts of all but the most intransigent of transphobes.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/family/life ... ns-couple/

[moonshadow]

. If they push too hard against what is now an open door, they will end up flat on their faces.

That's a really good analogy, and I think accurately depicts what is happening today.

I'll have to remember that one...

I think where "pride" is running off the rails is the commercialization of it, it should be pretty obvious by now that retailers are using it as another marketing cash cow.

Schools are also getting carried away, and even I'll admit I sense some efforts in indoctrination similar to what the evangelical right attempts with their "keep God in schools" rhetoric. Hence my religious "cult" reference. Perhaps it's time to keep it out of schools, and let the private household work it out just as they do with religion.

[pelmut]

Some good news from Lincoln (UK), 5 trans-haters overwhelmed by 200 LGBT supporters.

I am not "anti" anybody. I am a believer in live and let live - and you do you.

I do think, however, that many ordinary people are becoming rather bored with the Pride stuff and they tired of having it shoved in their faces.

I think you might have missed the point there:  The reason the LGBT crowd turned out was in response to an organised anti-trans demonstration, nothing to do with Pride.  

As for trans people, there was a heartwarming story in The Telegraph over the weekend. This couple have done more for trans people than all the protests and drag acts put together. It would soften the hearts of all but the most intransigent of transphobes.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/family/life ... ns-couple/

Thanks for spotting that, I would never have expected The Telegraph to publish anything so sympathetic to trans people.

[rode_kater]

I think where "pride" is running off the rails is the commercialization of it, it should be pretty obvious by now that retailers are using it as another marketing cash cow.

Oh no, businesses taking action to maximize their profits! Whatever will they think of next?

Sometimes they get it wrong, them's the breaks.

Schools are also getting carried away, and even I'll admit I sense some efforts in indoctrination similar to what the evangelical right attempts with their "keep God in schools" rhetoric. Hence my religious "cult" reference. Perhaps it's time to keep it out of schools, and let the private household work it out just as they do with religion.

Of course each school does it differently, I'm generally of the opinion to leave these things to the individual teachers rather than legislation from people with no experience in teaching.

But honestly, I think exposing children to these ideas early on is a good thing. Just imagine how many years of therapy you can avoid if a kid in school realises that whatever they're feeling is OK. Those crazy stories where people think boys will turn gay if they wear nail polish? Either the kid is gay or they aren't. Wearing nail polish isn't going to change that.

[jamie001]

I think where "pride" is running off the rails is the commercialization of it, it should be pretty obvious by now that retailers are using it as another marketing cash cow.

Oh no, businesses taking action to maximize their profits! Whatever will they think of next?

Sometimes they get it wrong, them's the breaks.

Schools are also getting carried away, and even I'll admit I sense some efforts in indoctrination similar to what the evangelical right attempts with their "keep God in schools" rhetoric. Hence my religious "cult" reference. Perhaps it's time to keep it out of schools, and let the private household work it out just as they do with religion.

Of course each school does it differently, I'm generally of the opinion to leave these things to the individual teachers rather than legislation from people with no experience in teaching.

But honestly, I think exposing children to these ideas early on is a good thing. Just imagine how many years of therapy you can avoid if a kid in school realises that whatever they're feeling is OK. Those crazy stories where people think boys will turn gay if they wear nail polish? Either the kid is gay or they aren't. Wearing nail polish isn't going to change that.

I believe that children should be exposed to trans folks and gender nonconforming folks in elementary school. Schools should have day when everyone boys and girls wear something considered masculine by society and another day when everyone boys and girls wear something considered feminine whether it is a skirt, heels, or nail polish, it doesn't matter. This type of education will help stop the bullying of trans and gender nonconforming folks that results in many teen suicides per year.

[STEVIE]

But honestly, I think exposing children to these ideas early on is a good thing. Just imagine how many years of therapy you can avoid if a kid in school realises that whatever they're feeling is OK. Those crazy stories where people think boys will turn gay if they wear nail polish? Either the kid is gay or they aren't. Wearing nail polish isn't going to change that.

You hit the nail right on the head there RK.
I am certainly living proof of that and I know there are a few around here with similar stories and we are a minority among minorities.
Living could also be a key word too.
We will never know how much of it not feeling "OK" is a contributory factor to the high suicide rates among males.
Steve.

[ScotL]

But honestly, I think exposing children to these ideas early on is a good thing.

As a father of school age kids, I can tell you today’s kids are absolutely exposed to children who are trans and identify by other genders than just two. This happens regardless of governor’s laws, banned books or a lack of curriculum that teaches it.

Reminds me of china. When I was there, my gmail was disabled through Governmental regulations. But “somehow” everyone I know who lives there still emails me on their gmail account. Nature finds a way…

[moonshadow]

https://youtu.be/oR_RAp73ra0

I'm wondering if kindergarteners are ready to have a serious and honest discussion about the issue? You know... after they learn to write their name... then that afternoon we can teach them that their name was given in error and that they should choose a new name... one that suits their gender characteristics.... then they can learn to write that one too...

The video might not be what they are wanting to hear....

A note unrelated to the video: I rather suspect this is just a means to peddle pills. Interestingly, this is what Karl Marx discusses in his manifesto.

Could the big trans push be just good old capitism seeking a new market? I know about half of the active membership here is very pro-trans, yet ironically this demographic tends to be anti-capitalist...

Why not explore the possibility? Why now? Why all of a sudden is it not good enough to just accept a feminine boy or a masculine girl....? No, redemption is only attainable with little pills that hopefully your insurance covers....

Hmmmmm....

[moonshadow]

Bonus note: there was quite a rant about grammar in off topic... I say maybe we could cut these kids a little slack....there's only so much a mind can absorb in a six hour day, and the most important thing we much teach these children is not how to formulate a sentence, or the multiplication tables, but to be sure they understand that some males are girls and some females are boys...

Come on people! China's about to land on the moon again. The U.S. education system is in shambles, there are bigger fish to fry at the moment...

Sorry, I know I'm going to catch flak for this, but under the circumstances, I think it's time to tap the brakes a little on this whole thing...

[ScotL]

Sorry, I know I'm going to catch flak for this, but under the circumstances, I think it's time to tap the brakes a little on this whole thing...

I find it interesting that the very people who complain the loudest about other people often are the same that complain that the world should be nicer to them.

I wish we could tap the brakes on a lot and discuss with open minds rather than be the judge, jury and executioner to drown out voices we don’t want to think about.

[rode_kater]

https://youtu.be/oR_RAp73ra0

Ah, Sabine's video on the topic, I thought that was a fairly balanced take. Especially the part: anyone claims they know exactly what's going on with transgender people is lying. There is so much we don't know.

I'd also like to add that while the Netherlands may have pioneered modern transgender care, we have never just handed out pills to anyone who wanted them. That appears to be a largely American phenomenon AFAICT.

I'm wondering if kindergarteners are ready to have a serious and honest discussion about the issue? You know... after they learn to write their name... then that afternoon we can teach them that their name was given in error and that they should choose a new name... one that suits their gender characteristics.... then they can learn to write that one too...

Is anyone actually proposing to do this? Really? Transgender children have existed for ages and schools dealt with it, why is now such a big deal? Kindergarten teachers know exactly what the students can and cannot understand, they don't need politicians to tell them.

By the way, giving yourself a name that suits you is hardly a strange phenomenon, after all "moonshadow" is not your real name either.

Could the big trans push be just good old capitism seeking a new market? I know about half of the active membership here is very pro-trans, yet ironically this demographic tends to be anti-capitalist...

If by "pro-trans" you mean "let people choose how they live their lives without undue interference from others" then yes, that's me. I cannot fathom how there can be people who beleive otherwise.

[pelmut]

[...]
If by "pro-trans" you mean "let people choose how they live their lives without undue interference from others" then yes, that's me. I cannot fathom how there can be people who beleive otherwise.

Seconded.

[jamie001]

[...]
If by "pro-trans" you mean "let people choose how they live their lives without undue interference from others" then yes, that's me. I cannot fathom how there can be people who beleive otherwise.

Seconded.

THIRDED