let's list why we like skirts

[crfriend]

The meta-reply to the query of, "What is your reasoning for liking these things?" is a simple and short one: "Because I do. I don't need a reason." Full stop.

There's really no point in belabouring it beyond that. Any "reason" is good enough.

[TSH]

If skirts and dresses actually became mainstream I think I would be a little disgruntled that a little bit of what makes me an individual would be diluted.

I have also thought about that and try and to balance that out of sympathy for more timid souls who would like to wear a skirt or those with a partner who has issues.

I think it'd be a small price to pay for tolerance; possibly even acceptance. But overall, well said, to both of you.

The meta-reply to the query of, "What is your reasoning for liking these things?" is a simple and short one: "Because I do. I don't need a reason." Full stop.

There's really no point in belabouring it beyond that. Any "reason" is good enough.

Gonna use this the next time I get a "Why?". "Why?" questions aren't even real queries. They're just disingenuous probing into someone else without even the respect of trying to understand their perspective.

[pelmut]

...BUT, 99.9% of Cafe' members do not want to look "girly" or "feminine".

How do you know, if you won't let them say they do?

[TSH]

...BUT, 99.9% of Cafe' members do not want to look "girly" or "feminine".

How do you know, if you won't let them say they do?

I see what you're doing, and it's starting to get irritating. "99.9%" is an exaggerated percentage, and no, Al is NOT denying the right for members here to be feminine or to say as such. He's focusing specifically on this one member who keeps badgering on and on about femininity to the point of it being obnoxious, because it's something Jaime's been doing for a long time, now; MUCH of his content here is laced with it. If you really want a more serious estimate, conduct a poll on this forum.

[crfriend]

"Why?" questions aren't even real queries. They're just disingenuous probing into someone else without even the respect of trying to understand their perspective.

It depends on the level of understanding that one is dealing with. Consider a child's question of, "Why is the sky blue?" That's an honest and likely sincere bit of curiosity, and down which path lies introduction to physics and the properties of light. That's quite a bit different from questions about individual tastes, desires, and drives. When I was starting to get pushback and question on my attire from my latest attempt at a romance it wasn't innocent at all -- it was an attempt at control. There's a big difference.

Honest questions deserve honest answers, and sometimes in the realm of whimsy and emotion, "Because I like it!" is a perfectly honest and acceptable (hopefully) answer. Because in those realms, where physical laws do not necessarily apply, such an answer makes perfect sense and needs to be accepted as such. "Why do you like classical music?" Because I do; it appeals to me.

If somebody asks, "Why is the sky blue?" it makes sense to start talking about physics and the properties of different wavelengths of light; if somebody asks, "Why do you wear skirts?" the answer can be anything you feel like answering. 'Nuff said. We do not need to "explain ourselves".

[Fred in Skirts]

...BUT, 99.9% of Cafe' members do not want to look "girly" or "feminine".

How do you know, if you won't let them say they do?

I know I don't read and involve myself in the cafe to be called fembois or what ever that is and that is not the reason I wear skirts either. I do not want to look like or act like a woman nor do most of what I see of the membership here. If jamie001 wants to be a fembois then he can but he has been asked several time to stop pushing this fetish on the rest of us.

[pelmut]

I think we need to be careful that by deprecating the irritating behaviour of repeatedly pushing one point we don't suppress the expression of that point when it is the honest response of some members.  I don't want to read 25 posts about about your ingrowing toenails but that does not mean that anyone with ingrowing toenails must never mention them.

This does not over-rule the general principle that discussions should not stray into areas that are out of bounds on this forum. e.g. I hope it would not be offensive to say that a particular type of skirt makes you feel sexy (women have confided that too), but a detailed exposition of the side effects would be a step too far.

[Jim]

"Why?" questions aren't even real queries. They're just disingenuous probing into someone else without even the respect of trying to understand their perspective.

My answer to "why?" is a little personal, but may be helpful to many, so I will respond.

I dealt with an itchy skin irritation in the groin (no, not a euphemism for "genitals") for many years. I tried many approaches with various degrees of success, to treat it. It only went away after I started letting the area get air almost full-time with skirts. (Being a full-time nudist might have been better, but that's less socially acceptable than men in skirts.) My wife also had been condemned for not following the clothes rules for women, and I want to protest that. Then I started reading about men in skirts online and discovered here and in other places, that high fashion folks said there are no longer men's clothes and women's clothes. I decided I liked that idea and embraced the look.

[new2skirts]

I like the variety of patterns, colours, lengths of skirts, more practical in hot weather, great to add a pop of colour to ones legs with a variety of stockings, an alternative to the usual black / navy / beige / denim drab of trousers. Great to see more fashion houses putting more skirts on the catwalk. It will get more common as time passes

[rode_kater]

If jamie001 wants to be a fembois then he can but he has been asked several time to stop pushing this fetish on the rest of us.

Maybe my memory is just faulty, but when I do a search for "jamie001" and "femboi" i get two matches, the first was 4 days ago. Probably some other language that's triggering. or there are deleted/hidden posts. But for me things like "Skirts help me feel more feminine and enhance my femboi persona." and "including those who were skirts as a male and eschew any hint of femininity to fembois like me that are just being themselves." don't strike me as phrases that are "pushing a fetish". In fact, "femboy" is not a fetish at all, though they have been fetishised by others.

It honestly feels weird that this forum of all places would be exclusionary in how people can describe themselves.

[crfriend]

Maybe my memory is just faulty, but when I do a search for "jamie001" and "femboi" i get two matches, the first was 4 days ago. Probably some other language that's triggering. or there are deleted/hidden posts. But for me things like "Skirts help me feel more feminine and enhance my femboi persona." and "including those who were skirts as a male and eschew any hint of femininity to fembois like me that are just being themselves." don't strike me as phrases that are "pushing a fetish". In fact, "femboy" is not a fetish at all, though they have been fetishised

It's not the fact that he considers himself a girl, but rather the fact that he harps on it -- and that's the behaviour that's getting people's dander up in this case. Most of us here are not "fembois", "girly", or anything of the sort; many of us play hardball and run with the big dogs and are perfectly happy being men, albeit being men in a rather sick world where being a man is reviled.

So, it's the agenda, not the attire. The attire is just the wrapping-paper (as I failed to drive home to my last attempt in a romance) and ultimately means little ("You know, dear, the the adornment comes off at the end of the day."); it's the core being within that's what's important. And no, I do not need to be feminised nor feminine at all to exercise a choice in attire, for that is all it is -- a choice in attire. "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."

[Myopic Bookworm]

for me things like "Skirts help me feel more feminine and enhance my femboi persona." and "including those who were skirts as a male and eschew any hint of femininity to fembois like me that are just being themselves." don't strike me as phrases that are "pushing a fetish". In fact, "femboy" is not a fetish at all, though they have been fetishised

It's not the fact that he considers himself a girl, but rather the fact that he harps on it. .. many of us play hardball and run with the big dogs and are perfectly happy being men

I don't play hardball and I don't much like big dogs. To identify as a femboi is not to consider oneself a girl, but to acknowledge the compatibility of femininity and maleness.

The forum seems, among other things, to be intended to offer validity and affirmation to men in skirts who seek it, whatever their motivation. Some members like to push the "men can be feminine" agenda more than others; some are openly non-binary in their gender expression; some are almost aggressively pro-masculine. And that seems OK to me. I'm happy to give affirmation to anyone brave enough to identify as a femboi (if such a thing had existed when I was younger I'd have been drawn to it myself, but there's not really a category of "femcodger").

Sometimes I just run my eyes down a contribution and pass on to the next one.

[crfriend]

"Femcodger". That's a good one! I need to recall that.

To Jamie's agenda, I rather suspect that most of us here are perfectly happy with XY chromotypes rather than XX chromotypes -- and it's not that that can be changed anyway without killing the individual who "wants to switch". Be happy with what you've got, as the old mantra goes. Whining about it does not help anybody with anything.

Yes, the 99.9% number was a classic out of How to Lie With Statistics, but given my feel for the place I'd be happy with saying 90%. Thus my tendency to focus on the question, and recently in this thread it's been, "What reason do we have for our attire?" -- and to that I'll posit that we do not need a "reason"; "because that rightly ought to be sufficient.

Sadly, experience proves that it's not.

[pelmut]

... but there's not really a category of "femcodger").

It's when gender dysphoria is overtaken by age dysphoria.

[Coder]

I don't play hardball and I don't much like big dogs. To identify as a femboi is not to consider oneself a girl, but to acknowledge the compatibility of femininity and maleness.

Not wanting to wade too deep into this - certain terms/names have connotations, and to me "femboy/femboi" has some seriously negative ones. I simply point you to reddit or TikTok (neither of which I would ever frequent for said terms) in the regular channels - r/Menskirts, r/outfits, etc... when their outfits pop up they are not simply being "feminine" but there is an altogether specific bent to their appearance. I honestly don't think it's *just* about fashion for them - the words they choose, what they post, the poses. It's kinda creepy. I'm sorry to write this and hopefully am not offending anyone - it's just an opinion I have. It's also very regressive in a sense because it takes certain trappings of femininity - the outward appearance - and parades it as if it's intrinsically tied to an internal state of mind.

I dunno - this is a much as I want to say about those terms.