On the topic of chatbots...

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pelmut
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Re: On the topic of chatbots...

Post by pelmut »

crfriend wrote: Sun Jul 16, 2023 6:31 pm [...] Nobody bothers to learn the "why" any longer,
It seems that very few people can distinguish between "How does it work?" and "How do you work it?".  As long as they can work it, they can't be bothered to understand how it works.
There is no such thing as a normal person, only someone you don't know very well yet.
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crfriend
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Re: On the topic of chatbots...

Post by crfriend »

pelmut wrote: Sun Jul 16, 2023 9:54 pm
crfriend wrote: Sun Jul 16, 2023 6:31 pm [...] Nobody bothers to learn the "why" any longer,
It seems that very few people can distinguish between "How does it work?" and "How do you work it?".  As long as they can work it, they can't be bothered to understand how it works.
Understanding how something works is usually pretty easy -- understanding why something works, however, is vastly more useful as it makes reverse-engineering something unfamiliar, but in the same vein, quite trivial. The difference is profound.

Most folks today are perfectly content with looking at the graphics on the "Start Here" page and never move on from there and are thus just "accepting that the magic works" -- and then have precisely no clue what's happening when the magic stops working or produces demonstrably cr@p results. This is how we dumb down a species.

I have spent a lifetime of working hard to boil down "hows" into "whys" -- and then commit the whys to memory so I can forget all the hows (because I can synthesize them later on in life).
Retrocomputing -- It's not just a job, it's an adventure!
pelmut
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Re: On the topic of chatbots...

Post by pelmut »

crfriend wrote: Sun Jul 16, 2023 10:28 pm [...]
I have s[pe]nt a lifetime of working hard to boil down "hows" into "whys" -- and then commit the whys to memory so I can forget all the hows (because I can synthesize them later on in life).
The most useful thing my physics teacher ever taught me was how to generate an equation for a system by observing what happens to the output when one of the inputs is varied.  It saved me a huge amount of work committing equations to memory and allowed me to derive useful equations for solving new problems.  I also found it helpful to make up my own units when the ones I needed didn't exist.
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Re: On the topic of chatbots...

Post by rode_kater »

pelmut wrote: Sun Jul 16, 2023 9:54 pm It seems that very few people can distinguish between "How does it work?" and "How do you work it?".  As long as they can work it, they can't be bothered to understand how it works.
And so, since the calculator, people can't be bothered to do mental arithmetic. Since the typewriter people can't be bothered to handwrite neatly. Since the match nobody can be bothered learning how to start a fire with a flint. Since the supermarket, nobody can be bothered learning which plants in their garden are actually edible. Since the invention of the printing press nobody can be bothered committing stories to memory.

People are lazy. If some technology enabled them to stop doing something, they'll stop doing it. Not sure if that's good or bad, it just is.

(There's a classic Asimov short story about someone reinventing the slide rule after all the computers get stuck in an endless loop fighting a war).
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Re: On the topic of chatbots...

Post by moonshadow »

rode_kater wrote: Tue Jul 18, 2023 11:52 am
pelmut wrote: Sun Jul 16, 2023 9:54 pm It seems that very few people can distinguish between "How does it work?" and "How do you work it?".  As long as they can work it, they can't be bothered to understand how it works.
And so, since the calculator, people can't be bothered to do mental arithmetic. Since the typewriter people can't be bothered to handwrite neatly. Since the match nobody can be bothered learning how to start a fire with a flint. Since the supermarket, nobody can be bothered learning which plants in their garden are actually edible. Since the invention of the printing press nobody can be bothered committing stories to memory.

People are lazy. If some technology enabled them to stop doing something, they'll stop doing it. Not sure if that's good or bad, it just is.

(There's a classic Asimov short story about someone reinventing the slide rule after all the computers get stuck in an endless loop fighting a war).
This somewhat ties into my comment about society in general (on another thread). If none of the items you mentioned came into existence, I can assure you we would all be worse off.

Everybody has strengths and weaknesses.

Eventually, somebody's going to cure cancer, diabetes, HIV, etc... Eventually, somebody's going to solve our energy crisis, end world hunger, etc. Since everybody here already knows how everything works... what are we waiting on? :wink:
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Re: On the topic of chatbots...

Post by Uncle Al »

rode_kater wrote:There's a classic Asimov short story about someone reinventing the slide rule after all the computers get stuck in an endless loop fighting a war
This concept could cover two (2) of Asimov's stories.
1) The Last Question in 1956
or
2) Franchise in 1955

Both stories involve a "Super Computer" named Multivac

Asimov is one of my favorite authors :D
(Along with R. A. Heinlein, Arthur C. Clarke, Orson Scott Card ;) )

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Re: On the topic of chatbots...

Post by Fred in Skirts »

I consider Asimov the Einstein of Science Fiction.
I have read over the course of my 80 years, I believe all of his writings. :roll:
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