Corona Virus

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Sinned
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Re: Corona Virus

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It sounds like we are all part of a "living" experiment during which lots are learned but then in some aspects there is not only still a lot to learn but in certain areas we don't know what we don't know. Well, that's life ( or death ) I suppose.
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Re: Corona Virus

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Sinned wrote:
Thu Sep 02, 2021 10:48 pm
It sounds like we are all part of a "living" experiment during which lots are learned but then in some aspects there is not only still a lot to learn but in certain areas we don't know what we don't know. Well, that's life ( or death ) I suppose.
Some will live, and some will die. Let's hope that "Natural Selection" (one can't say "evolution" nowadays) now favours smarts over brawn.
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Re: Corona Virus

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I suppose that the chances favour more unvaccinated dying than those having full treatment. But the hospital admissions and death statistics show it's just not so clear-cut as that. I work in a higher risk area than some. I am a bit hit and miss about mask wearing [0] but test twice a week, all negative so far.

[0] Like most I don't like a mask and have to lower it frequently to "come up for air" as I feel, at times, that I'm suffocating.
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Re: Corona Virus

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Sinned wrote:
Thu Sep 02, 2021 11:56 pm
I suppose that the chances favour more unvaccinated dying than those having full treatment. But the hospital admissions and death statistics show it's just not so clear-cut as that. I work in a higher risk area than some. I am a bit hit and miss about mask wearing [0] but test twice a week, all negative so far.

[0] Like most I don't like a mask and have to lower it frequently to "come up for air" as I feel, at times, that I'm suffocating.
As areas get closer to 100% vaccinated, vaccinated will make up more of the hospital admissions - just basic math. However, one would hope that the *total number* of admissions would be far lower for that population. The general consensus seems to be that based on age and immune response, immunity wanes. I don’t find this that surprising - the vaccine was against a coronavirus, afterall, and the only protein we target is the spike protein.
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Re: Corona Virus

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Re: Corona Virus

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Coder wrote:
Fri Sep 03, 2021 12:20 am
As areas get closer to 100% vaccinated, vaccinated will make up more of the hospital admissions - just basic math. However, one would hope that the *total number* of admissions would be far lower for that population. The general consensus seems to be that based on age and immune response, immunity wanes. I don’t find this that surprising - the vaccine was against a coronavirus, afterall, and the only protein we target is the spike protein.
Give it up. You cannot counter emotion and belief with reason. It's the same problem we have with out wives and girlfriends with our skirts.
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Re: Corona Virus

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Don't understand your assertion that the number of admissions would be due to the vaccinated. If that were to happen then it would either be due to failure of the vaccine or the vaccine's effectiveness fading over time. They are not necessarily the same thing. Basic maths?? The relationship between the viruses and the vaccines is much more complex than that.
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Re: Corona Virus

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Sinned wrote:
Fri Sep 03, 2021 9:36 pm
Don't understand your assertion that the number of admissions would be due to the vaccinated. If that were to happen then it would either be due to failure of the vaccine or the vaccine's effectiveness fading over time. They are not necessarily the same thing. Basic maths?? The relationship between the viruses and the vaccines is much more complex than that.
I assume you are responding to my comment.

I'm not saying *because* someone is vaccinated they will land in the hospital. I'm just saying, the closer we get to 100% vaccinated population, the number of vaccinated people in the hospital will also approach 100% because the vaccines are not 100% protective and immunity wanes. It will be a very very low number for sure, much lower than if we were all unvaccinated, but unless they develop a different vaccine that's what's going to happen. And since we are talking such massive numbers of people, the number might look scary too if you don't compare it to the total population.
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Re: Corona Virus

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Coder wrote:
Fri Sep 03, 2021 9:58 pm
I'm just saying, the closer we get to 100% vaccinated population, the number of vaccinated people in the hospital will also approach 100% because the vaccines are not 100% protective and immunity wanes.
This is a correct and proper assertion. No vaccine is 100%, any more than anything that humans can do is 100% perfect; however, it's the best we can do at the moment -- and we are getting better at it. Thus, the number of cases will naturally skew somewhat. This is to be expected.

I am aware of the occasional fatal reaction to the vaccine, but that is a natural consequence of any mass programme. The benefit, however, in the reduction of fatal consequences of infection is compelling -- and far beyond the scope of adverse reactions. "Breakthrough" infections are also par for the course in any of these campaigns. Again, nothing humans do is 100% perfect; sometimes it doesn't take. Note, however, the difference in outcomes between admissions and "bad" outcomes for those who have had the vaccine versus those who have not. That alone ought to convince "the hesitant", but since "the hesitant" are operating under belief and emotion nothing will reach them save for a pickup by the coroner's van.

In short, it's not about you, it's about society.
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Re: Corona Virus

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crfriend wrote:
Fri Sep 03, 2021 10:18 pm
In short, it's not about you, it's about society.
So true. Community mindedness is becoming as scarce as common sense.
Anthony, a denim miniskirt wearer in Outback Australia
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Re: Corona Virus

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Re: Corona Virus

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Good they're doing research but I find it amazing they can get sufficient statistical power here. Every year millions of people get heart inflammation for all sorts of reasons and it's mostly young people there too. The power of big numbers, huh?

The important part is no-one died, which still makes it better than the alternative.
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Re: Corona Virus

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It's a pity that this:
The highlights section of the PHO report conclude with a note that “COVID-19 vaccines continue to be recommended and are highly effective at preventing symptomatic infection and severe outcomes from COVID-19 disease, which is also associated with a risk of myocarditis.”
had to appear at the very bottom of the article.

To reiterate: No vaccine is either 100% effective or 100% safe. There are tradeoffs, at the scientific level, at the governmental level, and at the personal level. Teamwork and civic-mindedness are required if we're going to even hope to win this.
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Re: Corona Virus

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rode_kater wrote:
Sat Sep 04, 2021 9:31 am
Good they're doing research but I find it amazing they can get sufficient statistical power here. Every year millions of people get heart inflammation for all sorts of reasons and it's mostly young people there too. The power of big numbers, huh?

The important part is no-one died, which still makes it better than the alternative.
It's a pity that the figures on deceased caused by vaccins are not provided. Just recently a dear friend in perfect health, aged 72, died within two days after receiving the first jab.
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Re: Corona Virus

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by Gusto10 » Sat Sep 04, 2021 2:28 pm

rode_kater wrote: ↑Sat Sep 04, 2021 3:31 am
Gusto10 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 04, 2021 2:05 am
https://torontosun.com/news/provincial/ ... t-problems
Good they're doing research but I find it amazing they can get sufficient statistical power here. Every year millions of people get heart inflammation for all sorts of reasons and it's mostly young people there too. The power of big numbers, huh?

The important part is no-one died, which still makes it better than the alternative.
It's a pity that the figures on deceased caused by vaccins are not provided. Just recently a dear friend in perfect health, aged 72, died within two days after receiving the first jab
Gusto, did he get hit by a car? What are the other factors if any, or was he one of the "0.0017%" that may have succumbed from added impact of an injection?

There is some data on post vaccine deaths that "Might" be attributable to it -- no doubt some are, but again you seem to want to stretch the unlikely the maybe and the "if" factors into being a sound basis for avoiding what is clearly a highly beneficial life saving treatment for the multitude. Here is just one such report from the CDC for stats about 3 months ago.

Reports of death after COVID-19 vaccination are rare. More than 310 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines were administered in the United States from December 14, 2020, through June 14, 2021. During this time, VAERS received 5,343 reports of death (0.0017%) among people who received a COVID-19 vaccine.
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