Questions about english language

[Jim]

What I do find offensive is the way both it and the Flag of St George have been hijacked by racists and tight wing extremists to the extent that the loony left claim flying it is offensive.

The same thing has largely happened in the USA. The far right has essentially hijacked the flag to the point where rational moderates are beginning to find "Old Glory" either as alien as the flag of Idi Amin's Uganda or outright offensive because it no longer represents their nation or them
....

Yes. I'm in a Christian denomination that sees the way the flag is often treated as idolatrous; we don't have flags in our church buildings.

[oldsalt1]

What I do find offensive is the way both it and the Flag of St George have been hijacked by racists and tight wing extremists to the extent that the loony left claim flying it is offensive.

The same thing has largely happened in the USA. The far right has essentially hijacked the flag to the point where rational moderates are beginning to find "Old Glory" either as alien as the flag of Idi Amin's Uganda or outright offensive because it no longer represents their nation or them.

Where did you pull this comment out of . I don't know of any rational moderates who have this opinion.

And Jim maybe you should have a flag in your church.

[crfriend]

Where did you pull this comment out of . I don't know of any rational moderates who have this opinion.

Church of Trump members generally neither hang out with nor mingle with those who think differently than they do. That's why they're unaware of the opposition that comprises more than 50% of the population.

And Jim maybe you should have a flag in your church.

Whose flag?

[Ralph]

Yes. I'm in a Christian denomination that sees the way the flag is often treated as idolatrous; we don't have flags in our church buildings.

I don't mind having the flag as a visual reminder of who we are and where we came from, but reciting the pledge of allegiance is a frustrating experience for me. My allegiance belongs to (in this order) my God, my country, and my community, not to a piece of cloth. That way DOES lie idolatry.

Reciting the pledge is nothing more than loyalty theatre, in the same way that the TSA is security theatre: An ostentatious display of intent to put others' minds at ease without actually accomplishing anything. Do they think terrorists, spies, and traitors will hesitate to recite the pledge while plotting their next attack? So when I recite the pledge I feel like the pharisee who loudly proclaimed "I thank God that I am not like other men!" I hate showboating.

[oldsalt1]

Where did you pull this comment out of . I don't know of any rational moderates who have this opinion.

Church of Trump members generally neither hang out with nor mingle with those who think differently than they do. That's why they're unaware of the opposition that comprises more than 50% of the population.

And Jim maybe you should have a flag in your church.

Whose flag?

First of rational moderates don't make up 50 percent of the population I wish they did. but i would still like to know where he got his figures from

Next Church of trump Members cut the pompous BS who the f--k do you think you are

and finally you know damn well which flag I am talking about

[Ray]

Church has nothing to do with flags.

I personally believe that there are no gods; that the whole religion thing is irrational. However, if we follow the line that there IS a deity of some sort, then s/he surely doesn’t give a damn what flag flies in a place of worship? If the deity is so gracious and munificent, what does a coloured rag of cloth mean? Surely s/he would focus more on those doing good in the world?

Religion is fine; it serves a purpose, giving people comfort. It should have nothing to do with government or country; the reverse also applies. No Country flags in churches.

[Faldaguy]

Have we managed to stray a bit again?

[Spirou003]

That could be possible, yes

[Ray]

This is the thread drift thread!

[Pdxfashionpioneer]

I too feel this has gone far afield from Spirou's questions about the English language.

In fact, they were probably answered before I put my two cents-worth (Spirou, that's an American expression for opinion) in.

Spirou and any of the rest of you who are struggling with English, don't feel badly, plenty of Americans, including Americans who have college degrees, struggle with spelling, punctuation, homonyms and basic grammar. Part of the problem is that English is a mongrel language that has roots in every nation that conquered and held the British Isles, which includes most of the nations of Europe, at least the ones that have a maritime tradition. Not to mention the fact that with first the United Kingdom and then the United States dominating so much of the world, English has become something of a universal language, but with variations in nearly every country where it is spoken as a second language.

In short, don't lose too much sleep over the quality of your English, we all generally understand you just fine.

Spirou, do you feel you have had your questions answered? If he replies affirmatively, can we shut this thread down? If someone wants to discuss/argue about some other topic, would you please start a thread on it, with a clear title (I'll own, as popular as my "... 007!" thread I now feel the title was anything but clear. My apologies to anyone who feels they were sucked in.) so anyone not interested in the ensuing brawl can find another corner of the cafe to enjoy their cappocino?

[Shilo]

Spirou. I think the purpose of language is to communicate ideas. You do this very well even with the occasional grammatical error. I myself speak very poor French. Once I got away from the language teachers at school and realised that it didn’t much matter whether I got all my verb endings and syntax right as long as I was understood, I became more confident in speaking with the natives. Most French people are very accommodating ( apart from Parisians).
You may still trip up over some idiomatic or regional dialect but so do many English people. Just ask and add it to your lexicon

[Spirou003]

Yes, my initial questions were answered with the first messages, indeed! Otherwise I would have asked again to understand better

It's OK for me if I don't master all aspects of english language (including differenciations between US and UK or other regional dialects), but the minimum I would want to have is all basis, what's needed to be able to interact in common situations. I'm quite good at reading as I use online translators only occasionnally except for new themes I never covered (a good example is the story of Moonshadow about Jenn's birthday, I would have needed online translators for almost all sentences), but writing is different, I often need to use it and sometimes I really feel disappointed with proposals from online translators, they look... very suspicious. And for grammar issues, I can actually only change my sentences to avoid them (ok, I'm lazy, I could have looked after some courses online or things like that. Or even simpler, took back my school courses for a good starting point!)
For oral it's a bit worse, I'm almost not aware at all about pronounciation of words. That makes me unable to keep discussing with somebody who doesn't know/expect bad french accent

Well, to say that sometimes I'm still not fine even after using online translators, that's why it's sometimes better to ask real people for such things (I will then probably ask other things in this topic in the future)

[moonshadow]

I'm quite good at reading as I use online translators only occasionnally except for new themes I never covered (a good example is the story of Moonshadow about Jenn's birthday, I would have needed online translators for almost all sentences),

I'm flattered.... I think...

Ah, I write about the same way I speak, a combination of deep Appalachian hillbilly with big city big words mixed in there... every so often I'll even dole out a deep New York Italian accent on a word or two... those come out particularly when I'm pissed about something.

[oldsalt1]

I was going to just let this go but I want to give it one more comment.

There is a large blog on the cafe named I never kid about my job 007

in it there was a very long discussion about being classified and put into a catagory or group. .

the context of the conversations boiled down to how it is labeling people is wrong.

Cr posted a blog naming the Church of Trump it was a clear indication that he considered me a member of this organization His reference to the church of Trump was a definite derogatory statement with implications that people of the congregation were complacent followers with out a mind of their own

I am a President Trump supporter . I do have my disagreements with some of his policies but for the most part I am his supporter.

I consider CR's comments a direct personal attack and coming from a moderator of the cafe I find it highly insulting

I am sure that he is going to reply with some mindless drivel that he didn't mean it to be a direct reference and that I only assumed the connection
but the timing of his posting leave little doubt as to their intention.

And yes CR I know that it is a tough world but the people who make the rules and enforce the rules should be the ones that follow them

[Kirbstone]

This side of the Pond most of us look on aghast at the political scene in the US of A.

Of course Trump needs his supporters and as OS1 stands up to be counted as one that's perfectly OK.

Biden seems to have made a wise choice of running mate, who should improve his electoral presence quite a bit. A close professor friend of ours had the good fortune to meet Biden at a conference fairly recently (before Covid) and spent some time in his company after the conference, during which Biden impressed her what a kindly and caring person he is.

Alas those qualities may not be sufficient to unseat the Incumbent.

Tom