Observations.....

Discussion of fashion elements and looks that are traditionally considered somewhat "femme" but are presented in a masculine context. This is NOT about transvestism or crossdressing.
STEVIE
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 2451
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:01 pm
Location: North East Scotland.

Re: Observations.....

Post by STEVIE »

crfriend wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:47 pm
Not to mention that the majority of women now sport tattoos as well. Try finding one without.
My 28 year old daughter and daughter in law don't and they don't dye their hair either.
I guess they just have other vices that the old man is not privvy to.
Nothing whatsoever relevant to tattoos on men or women but there are certain types of drinking establishment that I would be more wary of than others.
OK I will sound judgemental but run down seedy looking local pubs are more likely to have an insular judgemental clientele regardless of their choice of body decoration.
As a Scot I would also say that the judgemental attitude can become more marked in the more northerly and remote locations.
I would guess that the men that Rivegauche commented on are well known native characters and as such tolerated if not fully accepted.
As long as you are aware and mindful there are still plenty of pleasantly unexpected surprises to be gotten from other folks' reaction be they of the masculine or feminine persuasions.
I'd also absolutely agree with Rivegauche that I have had more conversations with strangers since adopting skirts than I ever had wearing trousers.
Steve.
pelmut
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 1510
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 10:36 am
Location: Somerset, England

Re: Observations.....

Post by pelmut »

crfriend wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:47 pm
Sinned wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:06 pm
rg, you would probably find that the more redneck ones ( men with tattoos ) still wouldn't care!
Not to mention that the majority of women now sport tattoos as well. Try finding one without.
"Let me search you for tattoos" sounds like the sort of chat-up line that could get you into trouble.
There is no such thing as a normal person, only someone you don't know very well yet.
User avatar
Kirbstone
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 4887
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2010 7:55 pm
Location: Ireland

Re: Observations.....

Post by Kirbstone »

'Have some Mediera, m'dear'.....might be a better line.

Tom
Carpe Diem......Seize the Day !
rivegauche
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 228
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 9:05 pm

Re: Observations.....

Post by rivegauche »

Replied to this yesterday but it disappeared. I admit I may have been a bit hasty in making the remark about tattoos. In my defence they were metaphorical not literal. I once entered a local bar (conventionally dressed) and got the sort of universal hostile pause you assume only happens in films. I confess I merely assumed the patrons (all male I think) had tattoos - I didn't hang around long enough to find out. I know some women have tattoos - my last partner had one - a very small one. I was once staying in a hotel in NE Scotland fully dressed as a woman throughout. On the morning I was leaving, I heard motor bikes revving in the car park and decided to postpone my departure until they had left. Instead, more and more came. By the time I really had to leave there must have been more than 100 bikers and their bikes in the car park, and I was blocked in. I make an elegant woman but not a very convincing one, and I had to request a way out from a bunch of leather-clad bikers when wearing a dress and heels. They not only moved aside immediately but guided me out into the crowded car park. They could not have been nicer. I was very aware that I was the one who had made the judgement here and I had been wrong in that judgement. But it doesn't mean you will always be wrong - sometimes judgements are common sense and I simply would not enter an establishment in a skirt where the atmosphere reeked of testosterone - macho people seem to me to be trying to prove something all the time. Insecure people can be hostile to people who do not conform to their prejudices.
STEVIE
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 2451
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:01 pm
Location: North East Scotland.

Re: Observations.....

Post by STEVIE »

There is a grain of truth in The League of Gentlemen, comedic as it is.
Further to Rivegauche's comments on tattoos, I have made a similar prejudgement.
Mine was around a certain type of barber shop that I had been recommended to try.
I resisted for a long time on the supposition that I would be judged for my attire.
Eventually I succumbed and was glad to find that I had been totally wrong.
Those good folks did my hair for some years up to the point of Covid and I haven't had a trim since.
Steve.
User avatar
Fred in Skirts
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 3374
Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2016 6:48 pm
Location: Southeast Corner of Aiken County, SC USA

Re: Observations.....

Post by Fred in Skirts »

We have two biker clubs where I live and it can be very distressful when they come around. But they are not gangsters, but all are well to do business men and women. To look at them you would think the Hell's Angles have come to town. They sport tats and all have beards or mustaches, some look like they have not shaved in weeks, long hair with pony tails etc. The women have tats wear halter tops, (some of leather) and look like tramps and harlots.

But they are all very nice to everyone they meet, so preconceived ideas go out the window. Yet on Monday morning if you were to run in to one of them you would not ever realize who they were on the weekend.
"It is better to be hated for what you are than be loved for what you are not" Andre Gide: 1869 - 1951
Always be yourself because the people that matter don’t mind and the ones that mind don’t matter.
STEVIE
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 2451
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:01 pm
Location: North East Scotland.

Re: Observations.....

Post by STEVIE »

Fred in Skirts wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:10 pm
But they are all very nice to everyone they meet, so preconceived ideas go out the window. Yet on Monday morning if you were to run in to one of them you would not ever realize who they were on the weekend.
Very true Fred and how often have we seen "preconception" reflected around here too?
Steve.
Ray
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 1424
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 7:03 am
Location: West Midlands, England, UK

Re: Observations.....

Post by Ray »

“Hell’s Angles”?

That’s an acute observation. Right? ;-)
Coder
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 804
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2019 4:40 am

Re: Observations.....

Post by Coder »

We were traveling through downtown Jefferson in Texas one year, and there was a biker charity even going on - for a children’s hospital I think. These guys and gals looked scary, but walking amongst them (was antiquing), listening to the conversations, they were nice people. Totally flew in the face of what we thought when you think of bikers. I’m sure there are some bad biker gangs out there... but probably not as many as you think.
Gusto10
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 920
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 12:07 pm

Re: Observations.....

Post by Gusto10 »

Kirbstone wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:16 pm
'Have some Mediera, m'dear'.....might be a better line.

Tom
http://litwithatwist.com/have-some-madeira-my-dear/
User avatar
Kirbstone
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 4887
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2010 7:55 pm
Location: Ireland

Re: Observations.....

Post by Kirbstone »

Well found, Gusto. I was only familiar with original Flanders & Swann recordings, but that one is really quite different, even if he sticks to the original lyric, and a very amusing fine performance. I frequently used it as a party piece, sung 'a-capella', which means unacompanied.

Tom
Carpe Diem......Seize the Day !
User avatar
Sinned
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 5074
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 5:28 pm
Location: York, England

Re: Observations.....

Post by Sinned »

I once saw a short talk by Quita Christison on this subject and one of the points in it was to STOP - See The Other Person. Not to make a judgement based on first impressions. Here's the url for anyone willing to play it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=413_sACCuH8. It is worth a few minutes.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
STEVIE
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 2451
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:01 pm
Location: North East Scotland.

Re: Observations.....

Post by STEVIE »

Sinned wrote:
Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:22 pm
I once saw a short talk by Quita Christison on this subject and one of the points in it was to STOP - See The Other Person. Not to make a judgement based on first impressions. Here's the url for anyone willing to play it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=413_sACCuH8. It is worth a few minutes.
Dennis
Quite excellent actually.
We have a whole training set at work on unconscious bias and that beats it hands down.
Steve.
Post Reply