Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Discussion of fashion elements and looks that are traditionally considered somewhat "femme" but are presented in a masculine context. This is NOT about transvestism or crossdressing.
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crfriend
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by crfriend »

Grok wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 11:26 pm
I wonder about the break down of that 3%-5%. Does this refer to Trannys, or free stylers, or what?
That'll likely be the entire gamut of guys who aren't doing drag or masquerading. For instance, the ones who are completely fed up with the bilge that's being foisted upon us as "choices" in attire, those who happen to like the feel and sensation of "nice" fabrics, and those who just like being a little bit different. Note that there's a lot of overlap in there, so don't try LASERing in on only one aspect.

Note that I personally detest the use of the term "crossdress" simply because it's a lopsided term that applies only to the male of the species, and usually in a pejorative manner. We need to expunge it -- and it's tarted up Latinate twin -- from our vocabulary.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by Grok »

crfriend wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 11:53 pm
the ones who are completely fed up with the bilge that's being foisted upon us as "choices" in attire
Given the drabness/dullness of typical male garb, I can imagine guys free styling out of sheer boredom. :cheers:
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by rode_kater »

crfriend wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 11:53 pm
est the use of the term "crossdress" simply because it's a lopsided term that applies only to the male of the species, and usually in a pejorative manner. We need to expunge it -- and it's tarted up Latinate twin -- from our vocabulary.
Not entirely true, FtM crossdressing does exist, though much harder to find. This involves women actually wanting to pass as men, with binders, the works. These people have it ever harder than us and I think in absolute numbers the amount is tiny.

The word "crossdressing" is useful in the sense that it tells us how far we are. Notably, Dan Levy in the Emmy Award was (AFAICT) not referred to as a crossdresser, this is progress!
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by moonshadow »

rode_kater wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 12:58 pm
FtM crossdressing does exist, though much harder to find.
I disagree by observation. Women often wear men's clothes... often times they are... actually their husbands/boyfriends clothes. This is, by definition, crossdressing, it just doesn't carry the social stigma that m2f crossdressing does.

When a woman is seen lounging around in her boyfriends flannel shirt, it's often celebrated.

10 years ago, a man wearing a skirt was mocked in these same circles, now many cheer it in their own way, such as my sister who thinks "it's awesome".

Is it viewed in the exact same light? No... a woman wearing her boyfriend's flannel is seen as "sexy" and perhaps a little sultry. But a man who wears feminine clothes seems to carry the notion of a type of progressive enlightenment.

I think I've observed a change in society over the last five years, and I don't think it had everything to do with me simply adjusting to skirt wearing... no, people are more receptive these days, save for the few remaining holdouts that are SCREAMING LOUDER THAN EVER!

Why do they protest so much? Because they know... they know all too well they are losing their grip on the world as they knew it.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

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moonshadow wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 3:41 pm
I think I've observed a change in society over the last five years, and I don't think it had everything to do with me simply adjusting to skirt wearing... no, people are more receptive these days, save for the few remaining holdouts that are SCREAMING LOUDER THAN EVER!

Why do they protest so much? Because they know... they know all too well they are losing their grip on the world as they knew it.
I believe you're correct in that many in society have softened their attitudes on the matter; however, you are also bang on the mark that the reactionary element is hardening against it out of fear. Unfortunately, it's the reactionaries that are in power now in the US and have been since 1980. That's the reason that I do not think that one ancient super-rich white guy on the ballot this November is going to be all that much different from the other ancient super-rich white guy on the ballot -- with the possible exception that one of 'em may be housebroken.

I don't know when (or if) it'll finally break open, or which generation is going to take the reins next. I know it's not going to be the Gen-X types (we're already dying off), and likely not the Millennials simply for the reason that those generations have been systematically kept out of power by their parents' generation. What I fervently hope for is that whatever generation assumes power doesn't fall back on the old stale thinking of the crop that's in power now as that's proved to be utterly inadequate for the task at hand.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by pelmut »

moonshadow wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 3:41 pm
...people are more receptive these days, save for the few remaining holdouts that are SCREAMING LOUDER THAN EVER!

Why do they protest so much? Because they know... they know all too well they are losing their grip on the world as they knew it.
Yes.  They've been living a comfortable world where everything was neatly classified by artificial divisions and anyone who didn't fit those divisions was derided, beaten up, imprisoned or killed, so they didn't count.  They didn't have to think about it because, in their view, there was nothing to think about.

Now the truth - that real people don't all fit in those classes - is beginning to be spoken about and, worse still, people who don't fit are begining to stand up and be counted.  Rather than accepting the evidence of their own eyes, that what they were taught was wrong, the noisy bigots are now fighting harder and harder to try to beat reality into conforming with their entrenched ideas so they don't have to bother to think.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by Grok »

moonshadow wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:41 pm

No sir.... Top 40 country from the 90s mostly, and sometimes golden "oldies"...
I am trying to imagine people defiantly listening to this banned music. Actually, I believe in the case of country I think ultra-puritanical types will fail-the music is too popular with too many people.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by Grok »

crfriend wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 4:56 pm


I don't know when (or if) it'll finally break open, or which generation is going to take the reins next.

What I fervently hope for is that whatever generation assumes power doesn't fall back on the old stale thinking of the crop that's in power now as that's proved to be utterly inadequate for the task at hand.
One possibility is a generation that is-at least somewhat-more socially liberal than their elders. As an example, consider the threads where we discussed which skirt will be the next to gain traction. A new generation might accept MIS going mainstream.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

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I suspect big change will be in the making over the next 20-30 years. A big misconception is that gen z and many millennials are "entitled", "lazy", "drop outs" etc...

Wrong. I have worked along side of workers from teenage on up to my age for the last 20 years. The fact if the matter is most of these younger kids work their ass off, often with two jobs, maybe scratching $10 per hour of they're lucky, and doing the best they can with roommates or surviving off of Ramen noodles

These kids don't know the "land of milk and honey" that their parents and sometimes grandparents knew.

The system crafted by the silent and greatest generation has been run into the ground by boomers and some x'ers. I'm among the oldest of millenials, and I already figure that there won't be anything left for me and my generation when the time comes for retirement.

It's too bad the current administration is going to have the high court stocked thusly for many decades to come...

That's okay... guess us kids will just have to overthrow the government 1776 style! :twisted:

Cause I'm gonna tell you right now.. I get to 65 and find out there's nothing left in that pot I've been paying into my whole life.... Imma burna city down! :mrgreen:
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

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moonshadow wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:19 pm
I suspect big change will be in the making over the next 20-30 years. A big misconception is that gen z and many millennials are "entitled", "lazy", "drop outs" etc...
Wrong. The "entitled generation" are those in my parents' generation -- the generation that produced types like Dubya, Dick Cheney, Donnie Trump, and Biden. The Gen-Xers and beyond have worked their arses off, quite probably to no avail save for the profit of the above types. It needs to change -- and change fast before the window of opportunity closes.
The system crafted by the silent and greatest generation has been run into the ground by boomers and some x'ers. I'm among the oldest of millenials, and I already figure that there won't be anything left for me and my generation when the time comes for retirement.
Oddly enough, the "Boomers" aren't as big a shadow as one might think. They're big, but they're not exactly the ruling class at the moment; that belongs to their parents who have benefited most from the advances in health care which are now largely receding due to economic constraints.
Cause I'm gonna tell you right now.. I get to 65 and find out there's nothing left in that pot I've been paying into my whole life.... Imma burna city down! :mrgreen:
That's a common refrain, and I hear it among my generation (very early Gen-X).
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by Grok »

moonshadow wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 3:41 pm

I
10 years ago, a man wearing a skirt was mocked in these same circles, now many cheer it in their own way, such as my sister who thinks "it's awesome".

Is it viewed in the exact same light? No... a woman wearing her boyfriend's flannel is seen as "sexy" and perhaps a little sultry. But a man who wears feminine clothes seems to carry the notion of a type of progressive enlightenment.
I refer people to the discussion in the Centaurs and Mermaids thread.

Even though MIS has been Taboo, it may be relatively easy-for more open minded individuals-to accept. Once past the initial cognitive dissonance, it can be recognized that a variety of skirts look good on men, and can be functional. In which case, the novelty might actually be an asset in getting acceptance.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

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Grok wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:24 pm
I refer people to the discussion in the Centaurs and Mermaids thread.
Note to the programmer: Link to the thread; the syntax is simple. It'll make life easier for the readers.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

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Regarding the comments about attitudes in the US & other places with the move toward reactionary populace tribalist politics and choices of clothing:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... ing-skirt

and MIS are not worried? I'm not gonna fret about my skirts, but I sure as hell do about a whole lot of other more fundamental issues we see arising from the so-called leaders in several nations rights now, and their clans.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

Post by moonshadow »

Faldaguy wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 5:52 pm
Regarding the comments about attitudes in the US & other places with the move toward reactionary populace tribalist politics and choices of clothing:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... ing-skirt

and MIS are not worried? I'm not gonna fret about my skirts, but I sure as hell do about a whole lot of other more fundamental issues we see arising from the so-called leaders in several nations rights now, and their clans.
But this wasn't a matter of assaulting someone for being different or eccentric. It sounds like the guys were just being a general bully. I seems like an isolated incident.

Sure, there is always a risk of physical assault when we wear our chosen clothing in public, but I feel the odds are about the same of being assaulted even if we dressed more normally.

In all of my ramblings around the C.S.A. (conservative states of America), I have to honestly admit I've never felt as though I was in physical danger.

For the most part, right wing bigots ARE law biding citizens, however they are the ones who get laws changed (making it illegal for a guy to wear a skirt).... once the laws favor their world view then they just sit back and let the cops deal with it.

And since right wing bigots VOTE a hell of a lot more than any other political group.... yes.. freedom is in peril!

But getting back to the French boys... I have my doubts they are truly "right wing"... they probably don't really know what that even means... they're just your run of the mill THUGS... just like the ones burning cities down here state side... they don't give a damn about any political ideology.. they just want to raise hell.
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Re: Has the attention on transgendered individuals helped us?

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moonshadow wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:58 pm
[... G]etting back to the French boys... I have my doubts they are truly "right wing"... they probably don't really know what that even means... they're just your run of the mill THUGS...
I suspect that sums it up nicely. There may be very vague religious components to it, but it's basically thug behaviour which should be charged and the miscreants taught a lesson for their deeds.

There was precisely one time where my attire attracted a bit too much attention, and that was down to a combination of alcohol and pain-killers. I extricated myself from the situation before I ever got the full picture because I was "uncomfortable" with it. Only later did I learn what was going on -- which justified my immediate reaction.
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