Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Discussion of fashion elements and looks that are traditionally considered somewhat "femme" but are presented in a masculine context. This is NOT about transvestism or crossdressing.
Stevie D
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Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by Stevie D »

I came across this Youtube video of a Playford dance in Austin TX and was immediately struck by the strong possibility that one of the dancers was a man wearing a flowing Regency-style dress.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6cVw-w6BlQ

The person in question is fairly obvious in the lower left of the frame from 0':20" into the video, wearing a full-length white dress with short sleeves and a scoop neckline. You can follow their progress through the dance for quite a while.

Why do I think this is a man?
- General masculine shape of the head, arms and hands
- Apparent lack of bosom
- Absence of bra strap/band showing through dress fabric on rear shots
- Apparent presence of Adam's Apple on throat
- Receding hair line at temples in male-pattern hair loss
- Men's style shoes/boots
- The dancer stands on the 'man's side' of the set, i.e. to the left of their partner

Whoever it is looks supremely relaxed and comfortable, and completely at ease with the other dancers and vice-versa.
What do you think?
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couyalair
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by couyalair »

What flat-footed dancing !
That video was no advert for country dancing for sure, whatever the sexual components.

To tell the truth, I'm not at all interested in men that try to look like women, though I am quite happy to dance with other men -- if they know how to dance! I don't think this one succeeded in either endeavour.

Martin
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by SkirtRevolution »

I think this is a woman and it is very common for women to dance with other women if there is not enough partners. Although in say this, it is VERY common now for men to wear flowy skirts for Contra Dancing. In fact from what I have seen it has become really popular for men to wear skirts for this kind of dance.
Have a look at this blog which is dedicated to men in skirts for this kind of dance.
http://skirtingintothefuture.blogspot.c ... kirts.html

Heres an example.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... JcmYCbrCIo#!
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by crfriend »

SR, the two video clips in that post are winners. The sound, as one might expect, is positively awful, but the number of blokes in skirts simply having a good time is inspiring!

Thanks for that.
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Stevie D
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by Stevie D »

SkirtRevolution wrote:I think this is a woman and it is very common for women to dance with other women if there is not enough partners. Although in say this, it is VERY common now for men to wear flowy skirts for Contra Dancing. In fact from what I have seen it has become really popular for men to wear skirts for this kind of dance.
Have a look at this blog which is dedicated to men in skirts for this kind of dance.
http://skirtingintothefuture.blogspot.c ... kirts.html

Heres an example.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... JcmYCbrCIo#!
I have to say that I've now revised my opinion and I think that the person in question in my original post is an older woman. A lady friend has pointed out that some women who attend Regency-style dances such as these prefer not to wear bras, as these items of underwear (not yet invented at the time) are not considered 'authentic'.

I am very impressed with the video clips which SR has posted, both with the skirts (and dresses) which some of the men are wearing, and the sheer number of dancers on the floor in the first clip. I don't think I've ever seen so many! The quality of the dancing is very good too.
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couyalair
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by couyalair »

Thanks for the link.
I love country/contra/set dancing, and so rarely get an opportunity, as it's a very anglo-american thing.
We have Scottish country dancing in France, and a very little in Spain, but I've not come across English or American groups.
How I'd love to join in with all those people having such fun, all shapes and sizes, styles and smiles; good musicians too (the sound was not bad at all, I thought -- an excelent violinist!) and some good dancers --how about the young fellow in long blue dress twirling beautifully to the music! or the elegant older gent all in white, a pleasure to watch.

Martin
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by Kirbstone »

The second clip is a great one. That group/society seems to have achieved total dress code freedom, at least in the Summer. Apart from the amazing number of men in long swirly skirts most of the others were wearing shorts. It would be interesting if that dress code freedom were applied to everyday street wear! I expect the donning of swirly skirts by men was just for the dancing in that hall.
Although pleasant to watch and listen to the nice band, it's a form of dancing I don't like to participate in myself. In our ballroom dancing evenings there are set dance sessions, usually kicking off with the 'Gay Gordons' and also Irish set dances, which I personally loathe. That's when I embrace my pint and get into serious conversation with a friend who also doesn't like to prance about among the set-dancers either.

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Charlie
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by Charlie »

I found the second clip really intersting. Apart from the gorgeous skirts the men were wearing, there seemed to be more men than women and so some guys were partnering each other - both skirted!

I also enjoyed the Rory O'more twirls - one of my favourite moves :D

Kirbstone, I'm with you on the Gay Gordons - an awful dance.

Charlie (who wishes he'd been at that dance - in a skirt of course)
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by the_scott_meister »

Not sure exactly what a contra dance is, but the first video looked more like classic square dancing, only without any of the fun. They looked like a real lively bunch of zombies. And I agree with SR, it's common for a woman to take a man's position in the square if there aren't enough, and vice-versa. So I think it's a woman in that position.

Now, for the other videos, like I said, I don't know what a contra dance is, but I did see a few guys rockin' a few skirts (none that I'd wear though, especially for dancing, except for the Scots kilt), but it looks like they're more folk dancing than what I'd call the ol' rough and tumble, shoot-em-up style western square dancing we have here in Arizona. Ours usually end up in gun fights if we don't check our six-shooters at the door first. You know how cowboys are. Ok, I made up that last bit, but you get my drift.

Did I mention that I don't know what a contra dance is?
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by Sarongman »

the_scott_meister wrote: if we don't check our six-shooters at the door first.
Awww, and i thought you were up to date over there and all packed 1911 type 45 autos these days. :bom: Seriously though, Contra dancing is an unknown quantity here in Australia also, though it looked like good exercise at least. Our Woolshed dances are really more like the second video. They used to be held in Woolsheds AKA Shearing sheds until communities in the bush built their halls for functions which were not restricted by shearing times.
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by the_scott_meister »

A .45 auto would be a little easier to hide under your skirt, wouldn't it. But we prefer Desert Eagles out here, which are a bit more difficult to hide, under your skirt or anywhere. Arizona is an open carry state so there's no need to hide it anyway. Bonnie Parker used to hide her .38 Special under her skirt, taped to her inner thigh with medical tape because, presumably, no self-respecting lawman would dare frisk a woman there. It worked out well for her, for a while anyway. Then a self-respecting lawman took it off her corpse after she and Clyde Barrow were killed.

Anyway, enough of the man-talk. I thought that all the wool came from Scotland.

Is a contra dance like a Sadie Hawkins dance where the girls ask the guys, or is it where the guys go as girls and the girls go as guys (in dress anyway)?
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by Charlie »

the_scott_meister wrote:Is a contra dance like a Sadie Hawkins dance where the girls ask the guys, or is it where the guys go as girls and the girls go as guys (in dress anyway)?
The guys can ask the girls, or the girls can ask the guys - it doesn't matter. Also, it is convention to change partner for each dance. As a guy, you can get your hands on lots of lovely young - and not so young - ladies :wink:
Contradance is basically barn dancing but with higher energy and a lot more moves. A good contradance will flow from one move to the next, and can be very satisfying.
Most folk dances, including contra, are based on a 32 bars of music, being split into 4 x 8 bars (measures in the USA?) of music. Some are 40 bars. This takes you through the dance once, then you and your partner move on to the next couple and do the whole thing again, so dances can be, for example, 7 x 32 bars where the tune and the dance is repeated 7 times.
Henty Morganstein (a well respected caller) demonstrates some of the moves in the video clip here (scroll down to find it) http://www.sbcds.org/contradance/whatis/ (site maintained by Gary Shapiro). There is technique, such as using the weight of your partner to move into the next part of the dance.
I've been contra dancing for around 6 years now, and there is always something new to learn!
Contra dances are held regularly in the USA, UK and Denmark - if there are other countries, please advise. The rest of the world doesn't know what fun it is missing!

Regarding the original video clip, this dance is by Colin Hume (a respected British dance caller and writer) in the Playford style.
A 17th century dance master called John Playford (hence the genre) collected and published many of the dances of his time (think Jane Austin). They were dance by the posh types and were somewhat staid and elegant. However, there is a theory that people still liked to enjoy themselves and would mess round on the dance floor, hamming it up and being silly (just a we do today). This has given rise to a band called "The Playford Liberation Front" which seeks to put the life back into Playford and dancers are encouraged to put in extra twirls and generally have fun rather than being formal and stuffy.

Charlie
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by crfriend »

Charlie wrote:Most folk dances, including contra, are based on a 32 bars of music, being split into 4 x 8 bars (measures in the USA?) of music.
"Measure" seems to be the common term in the USA, but musicians certainly use the term "bar" here as well. Non-musicians are likely not to know either term.

Thanks, much, by the way, for the history. It's nice to learn new things.
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by couyalair »

The essential element of contra and country dance is the fun and friendliness, the sociability, the mixing, the meeting new people. It is above all co-operative, non-competitive, inclusive (anyone can join in, if they are willing to learn the basics)
It happens to be done mostly in long lines of couples, and uses traditional jigs, reels and waltzes (rhythms), but although these are pleasant to use, any other style of music could be used with similar results. The important thing is that you are part of a group, never alone, even if you've never met any of the other dancers before.
It has always been an important part of my life, and particularly enjoyable to be able to visit places I've never been to before and join in this activity as easily as if I'd been with old friends.

Geting off topic, but I'm surprised to read that some of you have never encountered contra/country dance. English, Scottish, Irish, American, you don't know what you are missing.

Martin
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Re: Man wearing a dress at a Playford dance?

Post by the_scott_meister »

In the US I think it's more know as a square dance. Although I don't know if there is a technical distinction between that and a country dance. But if it's anything like the regular square dancing I've done it looks like fun.

In a typical southwestern square dance I don't think that any of the men would be wearing skirts. They'd all be dressed as standard cowboys. Now the women's skirts are something. They are really really big, with lots of underskirts, usually of tulel, so that they naturally flare out even when just standing. But from what I've seen they are usually worn by the old ladies. The young ladies would rather wear some jeans.

Thanks for the explanation.
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