BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Clippings from news sources involving fashion freedom and other gender equality issues.
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BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by Coder »

Original: https://www.businessoffashion.com/artic ... consumers/

No Paywall: https://archive.ph/GVUoY

I realize this board isn't about "gender fluidity", but with acceptance of that comes acceptance of MIS.
Fashion leaders can consider creating diverse workforces to help strengthen their understanding of the discourse and ensure companies avoid tokenistic projects which may be perceived as lacking sincerity or authenticity
I think we see these happen from time to time.
Aligning gender-fluid fashion with how consumers conceive of gender is critical. In the past, some brands have responded to changing norms by introducing a third, distinct “unisex” category, often with smaller assortments of oversized, minimalist clothing. A number of commentators have criticised these attempts for being “dull” or “baggy” and lacking in authenticity. While unisex fashion has been around since the 1960s, having a unisex line today may not be precise enough to serve younger generations’ perspectives of a gender spectrum.
We've all lamented "unisex", and this report picked up on that.

Not too sure how many in the fashion industry read this report (The State of Fashion 2023: Resilience in the Face of Uncertainty - by The Business of Fashion and McKinsey & Company) but it seemed to reflect what we are seeing with some retailers, like Adidas.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by Grok »

I wonder how much of this-in practice-will be women raiding from the male side of the aisle.

If males are allowed a little more color in their clothing that will be good, so far as it goes. That is something we have seen before.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

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Grok wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 5:26 pm I wonder how much of this-in practice-will be women raiding from the male side of the aisle.

If males are allowed a little more color in their clothing that will be good, so far as it goes. That is something we have seen before.
At least on paper, I think this means making men's styles more interesting/different. Women already have a wide breadth of choice. The danger of course, is further stratification of people - you fit in your box, I fit in mine, etc... That is, I don't want to see people saying, "Oh, well, as a guy wearing a skirt, you must now be gender fluid" (a term that paper used throughout). I'd rather see opening up both sides of the store and breaking down barriers/distinctions. ClHu - whilst expensive - does this in a very simple way. They don't sell things under a gender label, they just sell clothes.

Today we have the freedom to shop whatever side of the aisle we want, so for me - to tie into another thread on here - it's more akin to "I don't care where I buy my clothes, but seeing skirts in the men's aisle would give me permission". I don't like that need for permission, but I think it would be the only way my family would be OK with me.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by STEVIE »

Coder wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 6:26 pm Today we have the freedom to shop whatever side of the aisle we want, so for me - to tie into another thread on here - it's more akin to "I don't care where I buy my clothes, but seeing skirts in the men's aisle would give me permission". I don't like that need for permission, but I think it would be the only way my family would be OK with me.
Hi Coder
I reckon we all know the problems families can cause and sympathies on this because I believe it will be a long time before you get the "permission granted". I won't say just do it either because I know how mine reacted and continue to react. Not really caring made it easier but it still hurts.
The "Festive Fiasco" could be quite tiresome and certainly not enjoyable in any real sense.
Grok wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 5:26 pm I wonder how much of this-in practice-will be women raiding from the male side of the aisle.
No change there then Grok.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by Grok »

Just let me wear the clothes I like without trying to pigeon hole me. If you must label me, use this one-"person."
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

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Same/old, same/old, Stevie.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by ScotL »

I wonder how much of the negative reaction to “gender fluid” is semantic. If we start with two genders, then by rule each wears clothing assigned to each gender and both don’t cross. But we know women have “raided” men’s clothing forever. And we want to do the same.

But what term do you use to describe the fact that someone from one gender wants to wear the clothing of the other one?

We can kvetch all we want about how there shouldn’t be these archaic gender designations to clothing but they exist. I hope they don’t in the future but in the waning days of 2022, gendered labels on clothing are undeniable.

So “gender fluid” gets invented to explain this phenomenon but truly only because men have started wearing stuff from women. Women have been wearing men’s stuff for years, but no one needed to invent the “gender fluid” term then. Just now due to men.

And I’m sure it’s due to the overhyped macho definition of masculinity.

But regardless, the term is invented and society must label everything. Again kvetch about that until the cows come home but arguing why society does it won’t help. And people always need a phrase that sums up more complicated concepts into succinct terms.

But gender fluid evokes concepts of trans and calls from then”woke” generation. And that bothers many who don’t want to be mislabeled.

But until a better phrase comes along, gender fluid will stick.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by crfriend »

ScotL wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 11:04 amBut what term do you use to describe the fact that someone from one gender wants to wear the clothing of the other one?
"Different tastes". And it is here that most everybody falls over because nobody can see the simple cause of the issue: men have been dressing in boring, shapeless sacks for all of recent history and a few of them are getting sick of having their senses of style so cramped.
But until a better phrase comes along, gender fluid will stick.
Hopefully like water on the inside of a toilet bowl.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by rode_kater »

ScotL wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 11:04 am So “gender fluid” gets invented to explain this phenomenon but truly only because men have started wearing stuff from women. Women have been wearing men’s stuff for years, but no one needed to invent the “gender fluid” term then. Just now due to men.
Gender fluid covers waay more than just clothing. Clothing is part of gender presentation which is just one aspect of the social construct we call "gender". Gender fluid is aiming at the construct of gender as a whole, not just for clothing.

So here they talk about "gender fluid fashion" which is aiming at the impact of gender on fashion. That is the part this forum interested in. It's also one of the more visible parts. But I'm not sure everyone on this forum is on board with attacking all the other aspects of gender as a social construct (although I feel a significant proportion would).
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by crfriend »

rode_kater wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 4:46 pmGender fluid covers waay more than just clothing. Clothing is part of gender presentation which is just one aspect of the social construct we call "gender". Gender fluid is aiming at the construct of gender as a whole, not just for clothing.
Indeed, and that's precisely why automatically branding someone as "gender fluid" based on what might well be a style choice is entirely pernicious. That is why the skirt needs to be "de-gendered" -- to allow anybody to make a style choice without it being a signifier of something else.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

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crfriend wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 12:48 pm
ScotL wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 11:04 amBut what term do you use to describe the fact that someone from one gender wants to wear the clothing of the other one?
"Different tastes". And it is here that most everybody falls over because nobody can see the simple cause of the issue: men have been dressing in boring, shapeless sacks for all of recent history and a few of them are getting sick of having their senses of style so cramped.
But until a better phrase comes along, gender fluid will stick.
Hopefully like water on the inside of a toilet bowl.
The problem with “different tastes” is it doesn’t immediately describe the clothing choice. RK is correct, I should have said gender fluid fashion but different tastes correctly means people may like different things but loses the specificity of the difference in tastes that crosses the imaginary gender lines.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

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rode_kater wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 4:46 pm
ScotL wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 11:04 am So “gender fluid” gets invented to explain this phenomenon but truly only because men have started wearing stuff from women. Women have been wearing men’s stuff for years, but no one needed to invent the “gender fluid” term then. Just now due to men.
Gender fluid covers waay more than just clothing. Clothing is part of gender presentation which is just one aspect of the social construct we call "gender". Gender fluid is aiming at the construct of gender as a whole, not just for clothing.

So here they talk about "gender fluid fashion" which is aiming at the impact of gender on fashion. That is the part this forum interested in. It's also one of the more visible parts. But I'm not sure everyone on this forum is on board with attacking all the other aspects of gender as a social construct (although I feel a significant proportion would).
Good point. I should have said gender fluid fashion but felt that was implied given the focus of this forum. But yes, gender fluid fashion.

Everyone on this cafe is interested in attacking one aspect of the social construct that is gender fluid fashion. We want to be able to be ourselves as we want to wear a skirt sans judgment. So we should be open to letting anyone be themselves allowed to wear/be what they want sans judgment
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by moonshadow »

ScotL wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 2:19 am Everyone on this cafe is interested in attacking one aspect of the social construct that is gender fluid fashion. We want to be able to be ourselves as we want to wear a skirt sans judgment. So we should be open to letting anyone be themselves allowed to wear/be what they want sans judgment
+1
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

Post by rode_kater »

ScotL wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 2:19 am Everyone on this cafe is interested in attacking one aspect of the social construct that is gender fluid fashion. We want to be able to be ourselves as we want to wear a skirt sans judgment. So we should be open to letting anyone be themselves allowed to wear/be what they want sans judgment
So then we're left with the semantic discussion: if you are interested in "gender fluid fashion", does that make you "gender fluid"?

Personally, I don't care either way. If people want to make labels they're going to make labels no matter what I do.
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Re: BOF: The Year Ahead: Gender-Fluid Fashion Hits the High Street

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rode_kater wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 10:42 pm
ScotL wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 2:19 am Everyone on this cafe is interested in attacking one aspect of the social construct that is gender fluid fashion. We want to be able to be ourselves as we want to wear a skirt sans judgment. So we should be open to letting anyone be themselves allowed to wear/be what they want sans judgment
So then we're left with the semantic discussion: if you are interested in "gender fluid fashion", does that make you "gender fluid"?

Personally, I don't care either way. If people want to make labels they're going to make labels no matter what I do.
Sure. But the bigger question is does being labeled “gender fluid” bring about a negative connotation that you want to distance yourself from? If so, why?
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