Closing Window of Opportunity

Clippings from news sources involving fashion freedom and other gender equality issues.
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crfriend
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by crfriend »

TomOfTx wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 5:00 pmShe wanted the capitulation and not compromise, so therefore we are getting divorced.
Sorry it ended badly.

But, there is hope in your tale. All too frequently the "counsellor" takes the woman's point of view and takes sides. That happened to me a number of years ago and it cost me a wonderful collection of antique computer workstations. I should have walked out when what was going on became obvious.
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TomOfTx
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

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It was going her direction initially. Some tough questions by the counselor rooted out the truth. After a few more sessions she stopped going because she wasn’t getting her way. Her crocodile tears were no longer effective! 🤣

I still continue to see this counselor by myself a few times a month.
STEVIE
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by STEVIE »

TomOfTx wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 4:27 pm Compromise is not a one way street. It has to go both ways to keep any relationship strong.
Agreed but the funny thing for me is that my wife has known about my skirts since before we married but never accepted them.
There has never been any question of me seeking permission or being forbidden, the compromise lay in the where and when.
Read my thread "Kith, Kin and Bloody Minded Relations", it may explain my thinking.
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moonshadow
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by moonshadow »

jamie001 wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 3:37 pm I have to say that I don't agree with you 99 percent of women don't like 99 percent of skirt wearing men or other men that display feminine characteristics. I would say it is maybe 80 percent.
I admit my own bias may have crept in there... but I'm not sure I'd go as low as 80%, I mean, here locally that would be 2 out of every 10 women would be interested in a man in a [non-kilted] feminine skirt... In Appalachia? I just don't see it. I think the statistic would likely depend on region and local customs. My county is home to about 25,000 souls. Lets assume half of them are female, assuming 20% of women are open to a skirt wearing feminine man, then that comes out to around 2,500 women. That's roughly the population of the county seat....

No sir, I believe you'd be hard pressed to find ten women in this county that are open to that sort of thing. You might hit 20% willingness in the most liberal locations in the western world, but it would have to be a pretty open minded area by and large.
Successful intelligent business women are many times insulted by chivalry or men suggesting that they need a protector.
Yep, I've heard of that too. But I think these characteristics are down deep in a more subconscious level. Virtually all women shout loud and proud "I don't need no MAAAAAN!", but when it comes right down to it... it is "a real man" they want, and they may not fully understand the evolutionary reasons... but it is what it is.

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crfriend wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 3:34 pm And the folks on the LGBTQWTF "spectrum" can be fully as bigoted as anyone else because they're made of the same stuff as everybody else.
True, I've seen that first hand.
And, they're after special rights and protections which don't apply equally to other members of the population, strictly by virtue of preferences, pop-sci, and attitude. I am all for (and always have been) a level playing field where everyone gets equal protections under the law; we do not need another super-minority with special rights that nobody else has. If we're going to abolish men's-only clubs then we should abolish women's-only clubs. Treat everybody equitably. Don't legislate special rights and privileges that are open only to a few, for down that road lies madness, anarchy, and despair (or at least disgust).
I understand what you're getting at here. Yes, regular ordinary cis-gendered white guys generally have to fend for themselves when it comes to matters of discrimination. And yes, I've seen this group effectively be discriminated against for the purpose of filling some sort of quota.

It's a complicated matter, and no solution is going to please everyone because as you stated, "One cannot legislate acceptance, understanding, nor affection. It Just. Does. Not. Work! Full bloody stop.". The issue is unnecessary discrimination over matters of life necessity. Such things as having a gainful career, finding housing, obtaining financing, etc. It's a tricky needle to thread for sure, and at the end of the day, some people are going to feel left out.

But I do know this for sure, I've never had an issue obtaining housing until I started wearing skirts. A few years back when we were looking for a new place to live, I was open with prospective landlords regarding my choice in clothing. A few never got back to me, one flat out said (albeit politely) "we don't rent to your kind here". I've beaten a dead horse of my 2016 incident at my former employer so I won't rehash it now. Transgender women in particular must be the most discriminated against group of people there is. In many cases I'd argue they don't even qualify as second class citizens.

It would be nice if "tolerance" didn't have to be legislated, but by and large the human species can be a pretty mean spirited and bigoted lot, and it raises the question, where are these outcast to turn to survive in the modern world? I get the angst of the membership here, you all mostly don't identify on the LGBTQ+ list... yes I got it, I'm not arguing that, but my overall point is that transgender women don't consider themselves "a man in a dress", any more than we consider ourselves "trans-women". There must be a balance we can strike somewhere. Because at the end of the day, we're ALL social outcast to an extent, and we share many of the same social struggles.

The questions are, what can we learn from each other, and how can we possibly help one another to thrive in this increasingly hostile, bigoted, and nasty world we live in?

No, women didn't have such a high hill to climb getting masculine gender roles normalized for them. They had a massive world war to basically press the need [for workers at the home factories], and as I indicated in other post, the difference between the masculine women [women in pants] movement and ours isn't likely simply the "patriarchy". (see, I didn't blame that... :wink: ), I'd almost argue that it actually has more to do with the chemistry and psychology of the brain, natural selection, and evolution in general.

The good news, this can be cured, we just need to keep evolving the brain... yeah, good luck with that.
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Grok
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Re: self expression

Post by Grok »

This thread has focused on skirted outfits. Other modes of self-expression may also be at risk.

As an example-nail polish. Among the people I have come across, I have noticed that a few young men are experimenting with nail polish. Nail polish is not my particular interest, but I like the idea that men can have a mode of self-expression that they have previously not enjoyed.

Other possibilities may also be at risk, such as jewelry, purses, etc.....
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Re: self expression

Post by jamie001 »

Grok wrote: Mon Aug 01, 2022 12:27 am This thread has focused on skirted outfits. Other modes of self-expression may also be at risk.

As an example-nail polish. Among the people I have come across, I have noticed that a few young men are experimenting with nail polish. Nail polish is not my particular interest, but I like the idea that men can have a mode of self-expression that they have previously not enjoyed.

Other possibilities may also be at risk, such as jewelry, purses, etc.....
These other modes of self expression such as purses, jewelry, nail polish, women's shoes are part of my everyday presentation as a feminine male. These items are readily accepted. Also, as a software consultant I have visited the largest tech companies and have encountered men in meetings and on the campus of these companies in all modes of presentation including skirts and dresses. They are respected members of these corporations. I addition, some of these men that I have encountered are near retirement age. Usually the barriers to our own self expression exist in our own minds. We are our own worst enemies in this regard. Life is short. Get out there an where what you want to wear and don't give other people control over your fashion choices.
skirted84
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by skirted84 »

Nothing new, and only for the TQ part. Skirts are still the last thing gay cis men would wear. They wear feminine tops, makeup, long hair etc. but skirts much less likely.
Freedomforall
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by Freedomforall »

The battle for women wearing pants began long before World war II. Here is an article detailing nine women being arrested around 1850 for wearing pants.

https://wwbcn.com/9-women-arrested-for-wearing-pants/

Type "women arrested for wearing pants" in the search engine of your choice, if you wish to find more articles like this
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

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crfriend wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 3:34 pm And the folks on the LGBTQWTF "spectrum" can be fully as bigoted as anyone else because they're made of the same stuff as everybody else. And, they're after special rights and protections which don't apply equally to other members of the population,
They want the same rights and protections as everyone else -- but it seems that by spelling out those rights they are seen as asking for something special.

It wasn't all that long ago that police brutality or a mindless violent crime could be partly excused if the victim was thought to be L, G, B or T.  This is the sort of attitude that has driven the need for 'special' protection, which is something we all wish wasn't necessary.
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Barleymower
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by Barleymower »

moonshadow wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 1:11 pm
I imagine finding romance will be difficult for the truly heterosexual [0] skirt wearing man.
And: Ironically wearing skirts put a stop to that for the most part...
And: Now who says wearing skirts will attract other men?? Not by my own statistics.
Moonshadow, I completely agree. Finding romance will be practically impossible for the truly hetero skirted man.
This is a job for the hetero adult man who is in a happy supportive relationship. He has nothing to lose and everything to gain. Either that or the younger man with a group of non-binary /.gender queer girls and boys backing him up. At a young age you can always pass it off as a phase.

The other thing you said: wearing skirts should put a stop to gay men making a pass. When was the last time anyone in the cafe saw a gay man in a skirt? Gay men don't wear skirts.

Getting this over the line is going to take a long time. Probably longer than I have. I'm doing it anyway.
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

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Barleymower wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 8:47 pmGetting this over the line is going to take a long time. Probably longer than I have. I'm doing it anyway.
As am I, but I've always been known as the one who roots for the underdog.

Heck, I was pulling for the shark in Jaws, and I always rooted for the coyote in the Roadrunner cartoons. In other words, I fit in here!

I was in a loving supportive relationship for a good 10 years before it started to spiral down the tubes before ultimately imploding, and I had a nascent romance just recently "detonate on the launch pad" (both of which are public knowledge here), so I understand the dynamic. It's rough for the straight guy in a skirt, and make no bones about that. It's definitely an uphill battle.
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by jamie001 »

I am not sure that I agree with the prevailing opinion here regarding straight males in skirts. I present as a feminine male and have been propositioned by straight women because they find my attitude regarding deviating from the herd and my F*ck the herd mentality mindset attractive. These types of women are also very artsy and intelligent and are the type of women that you as a skirted male would want to have a relationship with. I am in a committed relationship otherwise I would have pursued these opportunities.
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by Barleymower »

I wish I had an answer. There are a spectrum of men here presenting in different ways, all with one thing in common.
I have spent 55 years presenting as a masculine male and could not present in a feminine manner if I wanted too. So I present as masculine. I really wanted to wear a skirt to school. A more understanding world would have said 'no problem, go ahead'. Who knows where that would have led? I probably would not have my kids now. A sobering thought.
That said I have spent 50 years looking on. I did not get further mentally than the party dress and the school skirt. Somehow I'm stuck in 1975 unable to move on.
With that thought in mind let boys, girls, men and women express themselves however they want too.
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

Post by Grok »

TomOfTx wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:21 pm The current generation of women are finding more and more men have no interest in getting married at all. The next generation (teens today) may likely be much more open minded to a man in a skirt based on how many are being exposed to the non-binary lifestyle presently.

I personally wouldn’t recommend marriage to anyone without a very long vetting process.
I understand that David's Bridal has gone out of business. Noticed comments regarding individual stores going out of business, stores that specialized in wedding dresses. Also, the jewelry industry being severely impacted.
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Re: Closing Window of Opportunity

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Grok wrote: Mon Jun 19, 2023 4:46 pm]I understand that David's Bridal has gone out of business. Noticed comments regarding individual stores going out of business, stores that specialized in wedding dresses. Also, the jewelry industry being severely impacted.
Given that most of the females are now more macho than the remaining healthy men, this does not surprise me. The "modern woman" offers precisely nothing to a healthy sensitive highly functioning man. As I've mentioned before, I am insufficiently homosexual to find "modern women" attractive.

The above does not mean that I seek someone submissive and timid -- quite the opposite; I seek a powerful, capable woman I'd be proud of standing with -- just not one festooned with tattoos, swears like a sailor, smokes like a chimney, and is unconcerned with those around her. In order for things to work properly there need to be two sides to the coin -- and it looks like the rad-fems may well have won and obliterated conventional femininity. If this means that humans stop breeding, I'll not shed a tear, nor do I suspect Mother Earth will, either.
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