Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Clippings from news sources involving fashion freedom and other gender equality issues.
Dust
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:03 pm

Re: Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Post by Dust »

Bodycon wrote: Mon Mar 21, 2022 11:52 am Acceptable or not, I suspect it still goes on.
And there you have it. We're working off of suspicion, personal experiences from decades ago, hearsay, general anecdotes, and "common knowledge". And common knowledge is whatever feminist propaganda has been saying.

As the saying goes, "the plural of anecdote is not data." Actual data is hard to come by, and the common knowledge numbers/stats on everything from the prevalence of rape to the gender wage gap are all bogus and long thoroughly discredited, and yet they still make the rounds.

Ask men and boys if they have issues on a survey, they will say "no", because they have been taught their whole lives that they don't. They have been told not to complain, and know from experience that no one will listen, even if they do.

But when asked about actual symptoms of problems, actions taken, and so on, the picture is very different. Men and boys have just as many or more problems as women and girls. And more serious problems. And the statistics for things like suicide back that up (75-80% male in places like the US and UK).

But no one cares. Because "everybody knows" that men are rapists, child molesters, murders, and general monsters. And "everybody knows" that women are perfectly innocent victims of all of society's issues. Except that what "everybody knows" is complete horseshit.

The term "toxic masculinity" is used as part of that feminist propaganda to demonize men. Some may use it innocently to describe what they think is bad behavior more common in men, but that doesn't negate the harm that term contributes to. Language is power. Use their terminology at your own risk.
STEVIE
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 4188
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:01 pm
Location: North East Scotland.

Re: Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Post by STEVIE »

Now I feel really weird because I don't feel like a demon at all.
I obviously don't see the right brand of feminist literature or talk to the correct women.
As rights to a jaundiced view go, I feel I have plenty but, hey, some of my best friends have lady parts.
As for bad behaviour and life problems, they are agender but different is all.
The problems around Men's health, physical and mental are grounded in the lack of open discussions among men exclusively for men.
Not feminism but women simply learnt to support each other in this way and men need to get wise.
Aside from wearing skirts, it is a brave man who just admits to feeling **** scared and overwhelmed by life.
Steve.
Stu
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 1314
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 8:25 am
Location: North Lincolnshire, UK

Re: Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Post by Stu »

Dust wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 1:15 am The term "toxic masculinity" is used as part of that feminist propaganda to demonize men.
Amen
Bodycon
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 273
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 2:25 pm

Re: Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Post by Bodycon »

Dust wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 1:15 am We're working off of suspicion, personal experiences from decades ago, hearsay, general anecdotes, and "common knowledge".

Ask men and boys if they have issues on a survey, they will say "no", because they have been taught their whole lives that they don't.

And common knowledge is whatever feminist propaganda has been saying.
Sorry to labour this, but I find the top two extracts above amusing (in a statistical sense). What you are basically saying is that years of experience, not just mine, but many others', counts for next to nothing; yet you also say that boys will lie when asked a direct question, so that actual statistics from surveys also count for next to nothing. I have to say that even in the simplest terms, what we know from knowledge and experience counts far higher than you give it credit. I also suspect ( 8) ) that todays youngsters are more likely to be open to the more personal questions.

Out of interest I asked a friend to ask his son (just turned 19 and at college) what his experience was.... Identical to mine and his fathers. Lots of flapping about, some bum pinching in lieu of being able to communicate and, yes, a couple of slaps.... :lol: But once he found a way to communicate and get girlfriend everything changed. Even the American Pie film had his theme.

You seem to have a chip on your shoulder with feminists. Remember my point from way back: If toxic masculinity didn't exist, neither would the ammunition for the toxic feminists. Lets work on reducing the former and hence reduce the latter.
User avatar
crfriend
Master Barista
Posts: 14431
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 9:52 pm
Location: New England (U.S.)
Contact:

Re: Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Post by crfriend »

Bodycon wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:48 pmRemember my point from way back: If toxic masculinity didn't exist, neither would the ammunition for the toxic feminists. Lets work on reducing the former and hence reduce the latter.
There is precisely nothing "toxic" about proper masculinity. What's in play here I suspect is the (potentially deliberate) confusion of machismo with masculinity. The latter is honourable and dignified; the former is a sad and sick parody of what it means to be a man. We confuse these at our peril -- and others deliberately confuse the two in order to achieve dominion.
Retrocomputing -- It's not just a job, it's an adventure!
Bodycon
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 273
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 2:25 pm

Re: Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Post by Bodycon »

crfriend wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 11:26 pm
Bodycon wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:48 pmRemember my point from way back: If toxic masculinity didn't exist, neither would the ammunition for the toxic feminists. Lets work on reducing the former and hence reduce the latter.
There is precisely nothing "toxic" about proper masculinity. What's in play here I suspect is the (potentially deliberate) confusion of machismo with masculinity. The latter is honourable and dignified; the former is a sad and sick parody of what it means to be a man. We confuse these at our peril -- and others deliberately confuse the two in order to achieve dominion.
Agree 100%
Sherkhan
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2021 2:51 pm

Re: Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Post by Sherkhan »

Bodycon wrote: Wed Mar 23, 2022 8:23 am
crfriend wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 11:26 pm
Bodycon wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:48 pmRemember my point from way back: If toxic masculinity didn't exist, neither would the ammunition for the toxic feminists. Lets work on reducing the former and hence reduce the latter.
There is precisely nothing "toxic" about proper masculinity. What's in play here I suspect is the (potentially deliberate) confusion of machismo with masculinity. The latter is honourable and dignified; the former is a sad and sick parody of what it means to be a man. We confuse these at our peril -- and others deliberately confuse the two in order to achieve dominion.
Agree 100%
Way too true I am afraid. What matters is what you are comfortable with - not what someone else wants to make you think or feel.
User avatar
Daryl
Member Extraordinaire
Posts: 1219
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:25 am
Location: Toronto Canada

Re: Metro: Sean Penn is wrong – men who wear skirts are brave, not cowards

Post by Daryl »

crfriend wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 11:26 pm
Bodycon wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:48 pmRemember my point from way back: If toxic masculinity didn't exist, neither would the ammunition for the toxic feminists. Lets work on reducing the former and hence reduce the latter.
There is precisely nothing "toxic" about proper masculinity. What's in play here I suspect is the (potentially deliberate) confusion of machismo with masculinity. The latter is honourable and dignified; the former is a sad and sick parody of what it means to be a man. We confuse these at our peril -- and others deliberately confuse the two in order to achieve dominion.
Remove the "proper" and I am in full agreement with you.

There are still some who think that men have something to apologise or atone for collectively. I am not one of them.
Daryl...
Post Reply