Changing Lives

Clippings from news sources involving fashion freedom and other gender equality issues.
STEVIE
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by STEVIE »

Hi Ralph
I understand you now but your use of the word "nutter" made me think you were a Brit.
Certainly not one I'd readily associate with the Southern States.
I beg your pardon Sir!
Steve.
Dust
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by Dust »

Myopic Bookworm wrote: Wed Feb 23, 2022 2:44 pmI for one was a bit disappointed when Eddie Izzard effectively came out as a trans-woman, since it meant that s/he was no longer really acting as an inspiration for cis-men pushing the gender boundaries.
I was disappointed as well. We can agree on that for sure.
Dust
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by Dust »

Drag is, as others have noted, performance theatre. Everyone knows it's a guy and is in on the "joke."

I see it as a characature of women. Over the top on purpose, playing to all the stereotypes. I suppose it could be done in good fun, but I'm not a fan.
Sinned wrote: Wed Feb 23, 2022 9:56 pm My perception is that gays generally don't dress as women, at least the gay men I know don't. Or am I over-simplifying?
Drag got it's start in the gay clubs and bars. My suspicion is that it wasn't originally kind to women, but a mocking reminder of why they preferred other men over women. Perhaps even bit of a "we make better women than women do" jab. Hard to say.

But I remember reading an article about Ru Paul making derisive and angry comments about "trannies" on his show. He was very insistent that drag is a performance, and when the act is over, he's just a guy. A gay man, but one completely sure that he's male.

Regardless of it's intents, drag does play to the stereotypes that make it hard for us as males looking for more clothing options and fashion freedom as men.
Coder wrote: Tue Feb 22, 2022 4:15 am I find drag off-putting and detrimental to “the cause”. For a variety of reasons - not just my prudish nature. I find it revolting, an affront to women and creepy. I think the majority of “normal” people see it as either weird and the worst stereotype of the guy in a skirt or they see it as a lark and it further perpetuates the division of clothing between the sexes.
I do agree it's also probably the source of some of the worst stereotypes of men in skirts. I'm not sure it's always creepy, but often for sure.
rivegauche
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by rivegauche »

I don't think of Lily Savage in the same way as I think of drag queens. Yes it was over the top and a caricature of a certain type of woman but the style actually looked good. Unlike drag there are genuinely women who look something like Lily. My main reason for liking Lily Savage was that the jokes were funny. And they were not sexist against women.

I see that there have been complaints about Ant and Dec, accusing them of "womanfacing" as a gender version of blackfacing. It was not that they were dressed as woman, apparently, but that they were mocking them. I agree. As far as I know no one complained about the Two Ronnies dressing as women for their sketches. It is obviously about the way it is done. Like Lily the Two Ronnies were actually funny. The ones I found extremely offensive were the Rubbish Transvestites in Little Britain, but so much about that show was offensive - and rarely funny.

Yes there have been straight drag queens and even women drag queens (not drag kings). In fact Lorraine Kelly got into drag and she somehow did it without the mockery and looked fantastic. I usually find drag 'humour' crude and cruel but there was a programme a few years ago in the UK where a group f drag queens that included a woman selected someone (male) who had experienced some distress in their life and they put them in drag - they were very kind and caring people but I am not sure the concept worked all that well and the series does not seem to have been recommissioned.

I fear our Skirters that do not watch UK TV will probably not know who any of these people are.
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Myopic Bookworm
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by Myopic Bookworm »

rivegauche wrote: Sat Feb 26, 2022 2:44 pm I don't think of Lily Savage in the same way as I think of drag queens. Yes it was over the top and a caricature of a certain type of woman but the style actually looked good. Unlike drag there are genuinely women who look something like Lily.
Some of the participants in the 3rd season of Ru Paul's Drag Race UK have sometimes, I think, been less "draggy" caricatures and more like actual glamorous female models, especially when given a brief that allows that.

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Sinned
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by Sinned »

I quite enjoyed the film "Priscilla, Queen of the Desert" and some of their "costumes" looked quite good, a sensitive humour, some good morality and the breaking of stereotypes. The current drag acts seem to have taken those looks and elevated it to another level, but not for the best either.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
Ralph
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by Ralph »

STEVIE wrote: Fri Feb 25, 2022 7:32 pm I understand you now but your use of the word "nutter" made me think you were a Brit.
Certainly not one I'd readily associate with the Southern States
No pardon needed, friend. UK was many, many decades ago. About half my vocabulary I got from my mum, and the other half from dad, and the other half from friends and neighbours. Which accent is strongest depends on whether I'm trying to blend in or stand out, how tired or upset I am, etc.

Most of my life I have been on the Gulf Coast, rubbing elbows with the reddest of rednecks. They probably think I'm gay just because of my accent.
Ralph!
STEVIE
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by STEVIE »

Ralph wrote: Sun Feb 27, 2022 12:02 am Most of my life I have been on the Gulf Coast, rubbing elbows with the reddest of rednecks. They probably think I'm gay just because of my accent.
Hi Ralph
In that context, I rather doubt that "Jackanory" for the local kids would likely be hosted by anything less than a good old boy or gal.
I have encountered bigotry but probably never in that magnitude and I wonder how it would be for a non-conforming child of any gender born into such an environment.
Gods, and I thought my early life was difficult!
Steve.
Jackanory was a BBC children's show in the 70s. Simple format, a celebrity narrated a story in 5 instalments and it was a firm favourite of many.
I can't remember any drag artistes though.
Ralph
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by Ralph »

STEVIE wrote: Sun Feb 27, 2022 4:18 amJackanory was a BBC children's show in the 70s. Simple format, a celebrity narrated a story in 5 instalments and it was a firm favourite of many. I can't remember any drag artistes though.
On the subject of children's shows featuring gender ambiguity*... have you encountered the delightful "SheZow" cartoon? The premise is a ring that grants the wearer superhero powers, handed down from generation to generation of female heroes. Only through a fluke it falls into the hands of a young boy - all of which provides a vehicle for telling stories of how his life changes when putting on the ring temporarily transforms him into a girl.

Can you imagine the outrage if that were to appear in the US? There would be riots to make January 6th look like a cakewalk.

* Now there's a phrase I never expected to see or write even as recently as 10 years ago!
Ralph!
STEVIE
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by STEVIE »

Hi Ralph
Not watching a lot of TV these days, no I hadn't seen this but yeah, "charming" seems about right.
Cartoons and animation have certainly come a long way since Bugs Bunny, The Flintstones and Top Cat to name but a few.
I'd love to hear what the target audiences think but I am sure that their elders from either side of the pond could have ever so slight issues with this.
Slight apoplexy that is. Concerned of Tunbridge Wells would be going into complete meltdown.
I think I'd have sold my soul as a kid to try that bit of bling.
Thanks for the share.
Steve.
rode_kater
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Re: Changing Lives

Post by rode_kater »

Recently a children's animation series started here "Heads together (Kop op in Dutch)" where the plot basically revolves around a magic washing machine that allows people to switch heads. So they end up having to pretend to live each-other's lives, leading to much hilarity.

Playing with these kinds of transformations is interesting. People who have a problem with that kind of thing need to get a life.
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