Totally. I think a smart/fun marketing campaign could avoid the word dress altogether, call it a long tee or something like that, and extoll its casual benefits (ie, loungewear in the house, beachwear over trunks, etc...). And I do agree - being more formal in a skirt raises all sorts of style questions that - at least for the general male population - would question their "masculinity to the core".
BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
-
- Member Extraordinaire
- Posts: 2679
- Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2019 4:40 am
- Location: Southeast Michigan
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
-
- Member Extraordinaire
- Posts: 1323
- Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 8:25 am
- Location: North Lincolnshire, UK
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
I wrote a whole thread about what we call garments on here a couple of weeks ago - and everybody disagreed with me:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=22745
-
- Member Extraordinaire
- Posts: 2679
- Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2019 4:40 am
- Location: Southeast Michigan
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
I wondered about that thread too - but I think there is a difference between calling a skirt:Stu wrote: ↑Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:53 pmI wrote a whole thread about what we call garments on here a couple of weeks ago - and everybody disagreed with me:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=22745
A kilt (I don’t like it when fashion retailers do this) - this seems like they are glossing over what the garment is. If the garment has ties to a kilt in a few ways it feels less incorrect.
A manskirt/etc… just feels tacky and unnecessary
Whereas with a t-shirt dress you can call it a tunic - stretching the definition a bit but it’s up to the wearer whether they wear pants with it or not
Or a long tee - it’s similar to a manskirt in that it’s a fake name… but doesn’t try to gender it in any way and the name literally describes what it is.
IMHO, I’m not advocating for this, just wanted to clarify my thoughts.
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
Tunics as worn by modern women.
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
Mostly common sense although the initial suggestions could be summed up in one category of tunic with pants of any sort. The suggestion with a skirt looked wrong as the proportions seemed completely off. Nothing really knew learned but some things confirmed.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
- crfriend
- Master Barista
- Posts: 14474
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 9:52 pm
- Location: New England (U.S.)
- Contact:
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
Hence my argument of, to quote Admiral Farragut's famous line, "Damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead!"
That notion seems unpopular here, but I believe it's worth considering if my life experience has any meaning. In my local environs I am a "one-off" -- somebody truly remarkable and noticeable -- and it's mainly down to attire, but also to demeanour. Bearing, I have found, overrides appearance almost every time and that counts for a lot. If you're a decent human being and demonstrate that by behaviour then folks will appreciate that most of all and shuffle the "appearance" aspect into the background until it's brought up.
If you can carry it well, and behave unapologetically then you should have no problem whatsoever.
Retrocomputing -- It's not just a job, it's an adventure!
-
- Member Extraordinaire
- Posts: 4229
- Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:01 pm
- Location: North East Scotland.
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
Is this what you mean?
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
-
- Member Extraordinaire
- Posts: 1923
- Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 10:36 am
- Location: Somerset, England
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
Is that someone about to to look up your skirt?
There is no such thing as a normal person, only someone you don't know very well yet.
- Pdxfashionpioneer
- Member Extraordinaire
- Posts: 1650
- Joined: Sun Oct 25, 2015 6:39 am
- Location: Portland, OR, USA
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
Carl, I suggest you watch yourself; once again I'm agreeing with you.
I own and wear all kinds of dresses; to church, to the grocery store, to work, to job interviews. In fact, the other day I had a phone interview that I was told upfront would be for just 15 minutes that I still made a point of putting on one of my skirted suits with a silk blouse for. I wanted to be sure I was in the right frame of mind. Even when the interviews were by Zoom or in person and I wore a skirted suit or dress, they went just fine because that is how I dress for work.
So what is the right dress or skirt suit for business? Look at what your female colleagues are wearing (at least the ones who wear skirts or dresses). Make note of the ones that resonate with you. Find a version that's at least a half of a cut above. Take whatever precautions you feel necessary to make sure you're not going to lose your job over this. And then just do it!
With your head held high. You'll be glad you did, because the feeling of freedom will be exhilarating! What's more you will find that you just unleashed your authentic, best self and people will respond better to people and they will to you much better than they ever have before.
There won't ever be a perfect business dress for men because that's the best part of womenswear, the incredible variety. We may never see a majority of men wearing some sort of skirt or dress. We all that will be their loss. But more to the point, it shouldn't matter one whit to any of us. Every one of us knows who we are and that we have nothing to be ashamed of so live that reality. Be yourself, everyone else is taken already.
And before you dismiss what I am saying with some observation about how long my hair now is (and my nails too for that matter), look at the pictures of me at work from before I went to Hair Club. I got LOTS of compliments on my appearance and my clothing choices from both friends and strangers long before I got my new hair.
If you put some thought, taste and effort into your presentation, it will work the same way for you!
I own and wear all kinds of dresses; to church, to the grocery store, to work, to job interviews. In fact, the other day I had a phone interview that I was told upfront would be for just 15 minutes that I still made a point of putting on one of my skirted suits with a silk blouse for. I wanted to be sure I was in the right frame of mind. Even when the interviews were by Zoom or in person and I wore a skirted suit or dress, they went just fine because that is how I dress for work.
So what is the right dress or skirt suit for business? Look at what your female colleagues are wearing (at least the ones who wear skirts or dresses). Make note of the ones that resonate with you. Find a version that's at least a half of a cut above. Take whatever precautions you feel necessary to make sure you're not going to lose your job over this. And then just do it!
With your head held high. You'll be glad you did, because the feeling of freedom will be exhilarating! What's more you will find that you just unleashed your authentic, best self and people will respond better to people and they will to you much better than they ever have before.
There won't ever be a perfect business dress for men because that's the best part of womenswear, the incredible variety. We may never see a majority of men wearing some sort of skirt or dress. We all that will be their loss. But more to the point, it shouldn't matter one whit to any of us. Every one of us knows who we are and that we have nothing to be ashamed of so live that reality. Be yourself, everyone else is taken already.
And before you dismiss what I am saying with some observation about how long my hair now is (and my nails too for that matter), look at the pictures of me at work from before I went to Hair Club. I got LOTS of compliments on my appearance and my clothing choices from both friends and strangers long before I got my new hair.
If you put some thought, taste and effort into your presentation, it will work the same way for you!
David, the PDX Fashion Pioneer
Social norms aren't changed by Congress or Parliament; they're changed by a sufficient number of people ignoring the existing ones and publicly practicing new ones.
Social norms aren't changed by Congress or Parliament; they're changed by a sufficient number of people ignoring the existing ones and publicly practicing new ones.
- crfriend
- Master Barista
- Posts: 14474
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 9:52 pm
- Location: New England (U.S.)
- Contact:
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
That, Sir, is one exuberant look! Top marks
Retrocomputing -- It's not just a job, it's an adventure!
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
What an exuberant look. I love the waistcoat, it's a long time since I wore one. I used to wear three piece suits all the time along with a pocket watch.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
- crfriend
- Master Barista
- Posts: 14474
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 9:52 pm
- Location: New England (U.S.)
- Contact:
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
Back when I was wearing suits I did the same -- and also carried pocket-watches.
I still do the latter, mainly in my waistcoat pockets, but I also have a delightful little one that's a pendant design and works very, very nicely with several of my dresses and double-breasted waistcoats. I also have the watches of several of my ancestors going back generations, including one exquisite piece that dates to 1895 when a timepiece was given to my grandmother's father's sister on her 21st birthday -- a woman's pocket-watch designed to be worn in a blouse (or upper waistcoat pocket) with a very short chain and an exquisitely beautiful fob that hung outside the pocket which terminated in a stamp designed to wax-seal envelopes emblazoned with her family's surname initial which, by happy coincidence, matches my given name. In keeping with who/what I am, all are operational and see occasional use when the fancy strikes.
My great-grandfather's and his sister's are the ones that tend to catch peoples breath up short.
Retrocomputing -- It's not just a job, it's an adventure!
-
- Member Extraordinaire
- Posts: 824
- Joined: Sat May 25, 2019 12:21 am
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
I used to wear 3 piece suits for a few years right after finishing school - I have always had a thing for clothing and I did like the waistcoat and the tailoring on good suiting. That said I am converted to skirt suits now - but I have not paired a waistcoat with any skirt suits - the jackets on your skirt suiting are usually shorter to accentuate your hips/skirt so I haven't tried it.
good suiting - be it pant suits/ skirt suits is good suiting and is to be appreciated.
NZF
good suiting - be it pant suits/ skirt suits is good suiting and is to be appreciated.
NZF
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
nz, a waistcoat should end one inch below the trouser waistband so therefore should pair up with a skirt without any problem. But since a jacket in a skirt suit is generally shorter than a man's suit jacket then in theory this could be a problem. Or not. I have googled this and the pictures I have seen look favourable for the combination. Maybe a conversation with a tailor might be suggested, if your interest is piqued. It's something I would consider. Of course the jacket could be dispensed with, the result being a good look.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
- crfriend
- Master Barista
- Posts: 14474
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 9:52 pm
- Location: New England (U.S.)
- Contact:
Re: BusinessWorld: Will the perfect men’s dress ever exist — and would men wear it?
Indeed I wear waistcoats with skirts very frequently and the look is a nice one. It works well. It's certainly more casual than with a jacket/blazer, but well above what the rest of the general population wears.
Retrocomputing -- It's not just a job, it's an adventure!