“I never joke about my work 007.”

Clippings from news sources involving fashion freedom and other gender equality issues.
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crfriend
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by crfriend »

Sinned wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 2:05 pm
Well, Carl, the weather has mostly been very hot here. Sticky and uncomfortable too.
Perfect skirt weather. On the days here where the temperature has pushed into the 90s with heat indices in the 100s, I've been wearing my minis and fancier camisoles and haven't received any flak whatsoever.
I haven't asked if she is getting used to the idea as I don't know if I could cope with an honest answer! She wouldn't give me a dishonest one.
When I made the comment about "irrational responses" it was entirely without prejudice -- merely a statement that the reaction received will be driven entirely by "gut reaction" and emotion, not intellectual thought. It is what it is.
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by Jim »

When I've been nude a while, my wife tells me I look normal when I put a short skirt on.
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Sinned
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by Sinned »

I know, Carl, I've been through the argument before. Of course it's an emotional response simply because it's irrational. I accept the situation for what it is and I can cope in a fashion knowing what the rules currently are. Of course the rules could change in an instant and without any notification whatsoever.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer »

Considering we're back to one of the most frustrating and therefore annoying topics ever to chew up space in this forum, the state of Sinned's marriage as measured by his "MOH's" acceptance of his skirt wearing, I'd say this post has about run it's course. Before we do, I'd like to clear up a few things.

Each of our "free men," "mavericks," and "MIS's" have complained bitterly about the societal double standard that accepts women in pants but stigmatizes men in skirts. Even I bump into it, suffered from it for decades and endure some ongoing pains because of it. Consequently, we will ALL benefit by it being consigned to the trash heap of the history of Western culture. As my 2nd signature line suggests, laws alone will not bring about that happy day, but where there are places where the law can right wrongs, they do help to change societal values and beliefs.

In his speech to the virtual Democratic National Convention, Pres. Obama cited how color-blind our younger generation is. Every single member? Of course not! However, throughout middle school and high school my stepdaughter, whose complexion is about the color of mayonnaise, had a best friend whose complexion was close to the color of bootblack. And none of her peers thought a thing of it. They were both integral members of their core group of friends who did EVERYTHING together. Indeed, Kellye, my stepdaughter, hesitated to get involved with the fellow who is now her husband until he won the approval of her friends. (They loved him from the getgo because he's a terrific person.)

That didn't happen by accident. If it was, that sea change in attitude would have occurred ages ago. It happened as the long-term result of the post-WWII Civil Rights Movement, the laws that were passed and the unrelenting effort of the advocacy groups that passed the landmark Civil Rights Acts of the mid-60's when a former school teacher from Texas was President.

We and the people who identify as being members of the LGBTQ community are facing a similar challenge. We men who wear skirts are not going to gain acceptance by distancing ourselves from the rest of the LGBTQ community under the forlorn hope that somehow we don't belong with them and that we deserve more acceptance and respect than they do.

The points I was trying to make are:
  • If we want to gain society's respect we first have to attain critical mass, that is have enough of us, including allies, to be noticeable.
    The LGBTQ community has quite clearly attained that critical mass.
    Despite what Dust said, the members of that community accept us, recognize us for who we are and have plenty of room for us in their movement. Ralph is quite right; the various terms in the gender lexicon are poorly defined and cover a lot of disparate behaviors.
    There is one or another of those labels, and labels can be useful identifiers, that any one of us could be comfortable with.
    The advantage to doing so is that we would be allied with organizations that are succeeding in affirming the legal rights of people who don't fit the Gender Binary, seeing to it that those rights are enforced
    And gaining the acceptance and respect of the people who are covered by that rainbow colored umbrella.

If anyone has thoughts on or responses to those points that they haven't expressed yet, I welcome them. If you have some other topic you want to discuss, please start your own thread and let this one die its natural death.


PS: What I found distressing about all of the attention that Sinned draws to his marriage is that he doesn't seem to do anything to change his situation despite all of this time of suffering with it Other members have posted numerous suggestions for addressing his problems, most of which were well-founded and all of which were met by "Yah but ... " And then Dennis has the audacity to call an issue that has drawn 9 pages of responses "boring!"

Dennis, please, either do something to change your wife's feelings about your wearing skirts or learn to live with her non-acceptance, but whichever you choose, please stop with the caterwauling! I'm sure none of us need any more of it.
David, the PDX Fashion Pioneer

Social norms aren't changed by Congress or Parliament; they're changed by a sufficient number of people ignoring the existing ones and publicly practicing new ones.
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by Faldaguy »

David said: PS: What I found distressing about all of the attention that Sinned draws to his marriage is that he doesn't seem to do anything to change his situation despite all of this time of suffering with it Other members have posted numerous suggestions for addressing his problems, most of which were well-founded and all of which were met by "Yah but ... " And then Dennis has the audacity to call an issue that has drawn 9 pages of responses "boring!"

Dennis, please, either do something to change your wife's feelings about your wearing skirts or learn to live with her non-acceptance, but whichever you choose, please stop with the caterwauling! I'm sure none of us need any more of it.
A few times I've seen some of the members ask others not to generalize from either silence or out-of-context fragments to assume agreement; and I think it may be a bit presumptuous to suggest confidence that "none of us need....". If I might offer a bit of my own presumptuous observations, it seems a number of us have a few sensitive toes!

I agree this particular thread has about run its useful course -- and as is oft the case (though not "always!) it does point out a number of strongly held view points that ran the gamut from -- "kinda out there", "emotional", "didactic" and occasionally, even "logical". While Dennis's on-going struggle with his SO is all too commonplace among the men in this forum--it is for many a huge hurdle. Some of us have have good fortune in finding a comfort zone for both ourselves and our S.O's, some have not. The fact that this topic arises so frequently attests to it import as one of the roles for which this forum is useful -- but it is difficult to tell when our divergence from the central core of a specific thread helps or hinders our elucidation. In any case, perhaps we need to wear steel toed boots instead of 'peep toed pumps' to keep life a bit more harmonious, and joyful, herein. I've enjoyed the varying perspectives that arose.
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by moonshadow »

Though my wife supports my skirt wearing, I can somewhat relate to Dennis's situation. I'm sure we all have someone in our lives that give us a hard time over what we wear.

My father doesn't know about my skirts, and knowing my father the way I do, it WILL CAUSE DRAMA. Over the last 10 years or so, my father has become a hyper-political jerk, a bigot, and downright asshole. Nobody really likes his company anymore. The fact that he took me in at the age of eleven and treated me well during my childhood is the only reason I still come around, though it becomes more and more dreadful.

I've asked him to stop ranting about politics, stop using the "N" word, stop calling LGBT people "god damned f*ggots", when we call or come around, but he won't. A growing part of me debates on just wearing a skirt on my next visit and get the estrangement over with. And if I weren't his only child, I'd probably do just that.

But he's my dad and I still love him... even if I don't really like who he is anymore.

I think mom on the other hand is starting to come around. She's been "liking" and "hearting" skirted photos of me on Facebook lately.
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by Spirou003 »

Funny, your description of your father includes a lot of similarities with my father! :D
I'm learning english, thus when there is any mistake or weird word/sentence, feel free to tell me it!
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by skirtyscot »

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 3:54 am
Considering we're back to one of the most frustrating and therefore annoying topics ever to chew up space in this forum, the state of Sinned's marriage as measured by his "MOH's" acceptance of his skirt wearing, I'd say this post has about run it's course. Before we do, I'd like to clear up a few things.

[Stuff about something else]

PS: What I found distressing about all of the attention that Sinned draws to his marriage is that he doesn't seem to do anything to change his situation despite all of this time of suffering with it Other members have posted numerous suggestions for addressing his problems, most of which were well-founded and all of which were met by "Yah but ... " And then Dennis has the audacity to call an issue that has drawn 9 pages of responses "boring!"

Dennis, please, either do something to change your wife's feelings about your wearing skirts or learn to live with her non-acceptance, but whichever you choose, please stop with the caterwauling! I'm sure none of us need any more of it.
Dave, I feel you are being more than a little insensitive to Dennis. The topic of his wife's attitude towards his skirts (and some other clothes) is obviously of great importance to him. That could be why he returns to it again and again. So while I agree it's frustrating, calling it annoying is out of order. (And I should think our frustration is as nought compared to his.) He has tried to talk her round, but it's ridiculous for anyone to say that he isn't doing it right on the grounds that he appears not to have put people's suggestions into practice. Only he knows her and their marriage, he is best placed to judge what to do or say. And she does seem to have shifted, albeit at a glacial pace. I for one enjoy any report of improvement in her attitude and I live in hope that she will make it all the way to acceptance.

By the way, he's right. 9 pages on the subject of gender is pretty hard reading. Plenty of TL;DR in there!
Keep on skirting,

Alastair
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer »

Thank you for your input.

"TL;DR" I'm sorry, I don't understand the abbreviation.
David, the PDX Fashion Pioneer

Social norms aren't changed by Congress or Parliament; they're changed by a sufficient number of people ignoring the existing ones and publicly practicing new ones.
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by rode_kater »

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 9:13 am
"TL;DR" I'm sorry, I don't understand the abbreviation.
Took me ages too. As a programmer I had originally thought it meant "top left; down right" (coordinates for rectangles on a screen) but it actually means "too long; didn't read".
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by skirtyscot »

Google is your friend, Dave.
Keep on skirting,

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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by Sinned »

Alistair, thank you for your defence. To be honest some of Dave's posts are so long that I just skim down the text at best or just go onto the next post without reading it at worst. I had to look back to see what he had written about me.

"Dennis, please, either do something to change your wife's feelings about your wearing skirts or learn to live with her non-acceptance, but whichever you choose, please stop with the caterwauling! I'm sure none of us need any more of it."

Dave, what you said above was just bloody ridiculous and I'm annoyed that you even said it. I CAN'T do anything about changing her feelings. They're hers and such a task is impossible. She's not a computer that I can reprogram!!!! I can try to gently influence her and get her used to me wearing a skirt but I can't just force her to change. To be fair she has come a long way and I wear skirts most days and some very short skirts too. I have other family in the home when I wear skirts and she doesn't moan about it any more. I have even been out the front door to get something from my car while in a skirt and she hasn't whinged. She does complain that I don't wear shorts or trousers often enough but it's been warm weather and I will wear trousers more in winter. Sometimes you really type without putting your brain in gear. so think next time You may be able to get away with wearing dresses but then I think that you are single and so haven't anyone else to apply the handbrake.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
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Re: “I never joke about my work 007.”

Post by denimini »

Some of us might write posts, and at times long posts, on subjects that others find uninteresting. This is the healthy nature of diversity.
The simple solution is for the reader to skip to another post or thread. The only legitimate cause of complaint is when there is significant and prolonged amount of off-topic posts in a particular thread. A polite remark is usually enough for someone to direct further posts to an appropriate thread or start a new topic.

I personally believe that we are here to support each other and not so much to be entertained.
Anthony, a denim miniskirt wearer in Outback Australia
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