Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Clippings from news sources involving fashion freedom and other gender equality issues.
weeladdie18
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by weeladdie18 »

Children? Why on the gods' green Earth would any ethical feeling human being bring a child into today's world? That I cannot fathom.
Some of us had this thought as 18 year old males in the swinging sixties .....some of my current friends are now 85 years old.
My prediction is that I will die when am 85 years old .
However some of my current friends are burnt out in their sixties .

To bring things back to moon's rant. ...The helicopter flight from Penzance to the Scilly Isles is being reinstated in March.
The service may be delayed as the chosen contract helicopter is in quarentine with possible cono virus.

I am installing a wood burner to keep my home dry and warm in my old age ..... However I am advised to use kiln dried logs which are at least a
year old.
The fire can be lit with soft wood but must burn hard wood....One could not make up this sort of information.
Coder
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Coder »

weeladdie18 wrote:
Sat Feb 29, 2020 2:47 am
I am installing a wood burner to keep my home dry and warm in my old age ..... However I am advised to use kiln dried logs which are at least a
year old.
The fire can be lit with soft wood but must burn hard wood....One could not make up this sort of information.
Kiln dried? Or just “seasoned”? In general you want seasoned wood - preferably hardwood of some sort - to prevent creosote buildup in the chimney. Otherwise that buildup could lead to a chimney fire. Plus a cast iron kettle with water to humidify the air, if your house is “tight” crack a window to let some fresh air in, and if you have a catalytic converter to use it at the proper temp. Wood burning stoves are awesome, but can be overly complicated (well, I tend to complicate everything).
Gusto10
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Gusto10 »

moonshadow wrote:
Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:34 pm
It's a curious custom that the bride is expected to receive all of the attention on a wedding day. And that it's considered "her day".

This is not a rant, just mentioning a curious custom...

Why is this?
I would guess that this custom goes back to the Roman era, when the power ( Res mancipi = Right of hand) over the woman was transferred from the father to the husband. This one can still see nowadays when a grill walks down the aile on the arm of her father who than hands her over to the groom. She left the household of her father and entered the household of her husband. The dowry was of major importance to. In the Roman world: gold, jewelry, in the Arab world the number of goats or even better camels.

I do think the the article following the one which was used to start this thread is interesting also: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ear-skirts
andrewsh
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by andrewsh »

Stu wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:20 pm
The writer didn't need to turn it into an ideological point and I hope that wasn't what she was hoping to achieve. I don't want to sound cynical, but I am always suspicious when The Guardian prints stuff like this as there is so often a subtext of man-hating feminism.
This is complete nonsense. I’ve been reading The Guardian for years and I’ve never seen any man-hating there. The opinion pieces in The Guardian are often focused on equal rights, individual freedoms and social problems, but hate is one of the things you never see there.
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Stu »

andrewsh wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:31 pm
This is complete nonsense. I’ve been reading The Guardian for years and I’ve never seen any man-hating there. The opinion pieces in The Guardian are often focused on equal rights, individual freedoms and social problems, but hate is one of the things you never see there.
I have been reading the Guardian for many years too, and it provides a platform for some of the most pernicious, man-hating feminist lunatics with whom we have the misfortune of sharing our society - including the likes of Julie Bindel, Laura Bates and Charlotte Proudman. It's vile. If women were ever treated in such a way by a right-of-centre news outlet, there would be howls of protest.
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by andrewsh »

Stu wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 7:37 pm
I have been reading the Guardian for many years too, and it provides a platform for some of the most pernicious, man-hating feminist lunatics with whom we have the misfortune of sharing our society - including the likes of Julie Bindel, Laura Bates and Charlotte Proudman. It's vile. If women were ever treated in such a way by a right-of-centre news outlet, there would be howls of protest.
Please provide proofs. Just from curiosity, I went to Laura Bates’ profile and I don’t see any man-hating articles from her in The Guardian.
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Shilo »

crfriend wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 6:20 pm
partlyscot wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 5:50 pm
I know that if I was going to be married, and my fiancee started planning a mega wedding, it would get called off pretty quick.
Anecdotally, at least, it seems that the longevity of the marriage in inversely proportional to the cost of the wedding.
It seems that too many concentrate on the wedding and not on being married. The most extreme case I heard of was one couple who spent £28000 on the wedding and began divorce proceedings the day after the honeymoon.
In my case we had a small affair with twenty guests and have been married over forty years.
:roll:
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Sinned
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Sinned »

We had a church ceremony but only a few family in my in-law's house for the "reception". We've been married 44 years.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
Stu
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Stu »

andrewsh wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:00 am
Stu wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 7:37 pm
I have been reading the Guardian for many years too, and it provides a platform for some of the most pernicious, man-hating feminist lunatics with whom we have the misfortune of sharing our society - including the likes of Julie Bindel, Laura Bates and Charlotte Proudman. It's vile. If women were ever treated in such a way by a right-of-centre news outlet, there would be howls of protest.
Please provide proofs. Just from curiosity, I went to Laura Bates’ profile and I don’t see any man-hating articles from her in The Guardian.
Bindel, who was a full-time Guardian columnist in 2015 when she said: "“I mean, I would actually put them all (men) in some kind of camp where they can all drive around in quad bikes, or bicycles, or white vans. I would give them a choice of vehicles to drive around with, give them no porn, they wouldn’t be able to fight – we would have wardens, of course! Women who want to see their sons or male loved ones would be able to go and visit, or take them out like a library book, and then bring them back.” She also hopes that “heterosexuality doesn’t survive.” Can you imagine any other major news outlet continuing to employ her had she said that about any other demographic? Bates is a slightly different character. She relies on what some call "victim feminism", in which she makes out that being female in our society is to be oppressed - and that masculinity is toxic. Men are, according to that thesis, innately violent, and that women and girls suffer far more from violence, and in most other respects, than males. And then they complain that males are running everything (demonstrably false) - the implication being that males are the oppressors. This narrative is rampant in The Guardian.
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Faldaguy »

This group ought to be fun at the old "telephone game"! From reflections on boyfriend in a dress to .... well, wow ... maybe we should all take a walk -- in a dress of course, and make sure our sequins are reflecting the light! Sorry guys, I'm smiling in bemusement with this post's meanderings! (Don't worry, I'm a thing of the past -- married 50+ years, and yes, to the same woman.)
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by andrewsh »

Stu wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:55 pm
Bindel, who was a full-time Guardian columnist in 2015 when she said: "“I mean, I would actually put them all <…>”
Have you got an actual source for this citation? Everything I find are online bigotry reservations or hoax-spreading websites.
Stu wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:55 pm
She also hopes that “heterosexuality doesn’t survive.”
Can you quote her on this? Because her profile on The Guardian shows she holds exactly opposite views.
Stu wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:55 pm
<…> and that masculinity is toxic. Men are, according to that thesis, innately violent, and that women and girls suffer far more from violence, and in most other respects, than males.
No, you misunderstand this. Toxic masculinity is toxic, not any masculinity. Just as if you say toxic food you don’t mean that all food is toxic, when you say toxic masculinity you don’t mean all masculinity is. Toxic masculinity is everyone’s enemy, especially of those people like us who deviate from the society’s views on masculinity. Toxic masculinity is a real thing which includes but is not limited to machismo and other related phenomena.
Stu wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:55 pm
And then they complain that males are running everything (demonstrably false) - the implication being that males are the oppressors. This narrative is rampant in The Guardian.
In most of the world men are indeed running the majority of things, and even developed countries are struggling to achieve equal representation and equal rights.
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

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andrewsh wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:49 am
No, you misunderstand this. Toxic masculinity is toxic, not any masculinity. Just as if you say toxic food you don’t mean that all food is toxic, when you say toxic masculinity you don’t mean all masculinity is. Toxic masculinity is everyone’s enemy, especially of those people like us who deviate from the society’s views on masculinity. Toxic masculinity is a real thing which includes but is not limited to machismo and other related phenomena.
While this distinction appears to be true - it isn’t usually obvious, and many readers will take the term to be an affront to themselves, even if they don’t “practice” toxic masculinity. It’s a bad term, and most of the time it’s not clarified as to only meaning a subset of behavior. No, I’m not a snowflake and don’t wither when I see the term - but I do get an initial visceral reaction, “Hey, I’m a nice person - possess empathy and whatnot - I want nothing to do with this article”.

The problem is one of compassion on the writers side of things, IMHO. They lack the ability to see how their terms and language effect people, men typically.

Finally - I cannot recall an article that discussed toxic masculinity and at the same time listed some positive masculine traits. I’m sure some articles contain said nuance, but I cannot recall any that do.
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Stu »

andrewsh wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:49 am

Have you got an actual source for this citation? Everything I find are online bigotry reservations or hoax-spreading websites.
https://www.change.org/p/the-guardian-t ... e-guardian
andrewsh wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:49 am
In most of the world men are indeed running the majority of things, and even developed countries are struggling to achieve equal representation and equal rights.
The fact that the people who hold more of the world's power are male than are female does not imply that females are systemically disadvantaged. You are pointing to a tiny subset of extremely powerful people and looking at their biological reproductive function and extrapolating from that that they are thereby representative of the entire biological class. That's illogical. It is also predicated on the absurd dogma of parity in terms of outcome, instead of equality of opportunity.
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by andrewsh »

Stu wrote:
Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:53 am
andrewsh wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:49 am
Have you got an actual source for this citation? Everything I find are online bigotry reservations or hoax-spreading websites.
https://www.change.org/p/the-guardian-t ... e-guardian
That’s not a source citing her, it’s citing some bullshіt video from a well-known conspiracy theorist without an actual citation. It says recent interview, but it’s nowhere to be found. So unless you can provide the actual interview where she said that, I’m going to consider this a notorious example of fake news.
Stu wrote:
Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:53 am
andrewsh wrote:
Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:49 am
In most of the world men are indeed running the majority of things, and even developed countries are struggling to achieve equal representation and equal rights.
The fact that the people who hold more of the world's power are male than are female does not imply that females are systemically disadvantaged. You are pointing to a tiny subset of extremely powerful people and looking at their biological reproductive function and extrapolating from that that they are thereby representative of the entire biological class. That's illogical. It is also predicated on the absurd dogma of parity in terms of outcome, instead of equality of opportunity.
It’s not a tiny subset, sexism (conscious or not) is part of everyday life of people in most societies on this planet. I happen to talk about this to a lot of women and listen to their complaints and not look away and pretend none of what they describe is real. And I also happen to know a lot of men who help sustain this status quo, unfortunately.
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Re: Bride gets to grips with skirt-wearing man

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer »

Couldn't agree more with what you have to say Andrewsh.

To those of us who are uncomfortable with the term "toxic masculinity" I say, "GOOD!!!" We should be. Every time we have looked at woman like she was a choice slab of beef, every time we have made a remark to another fellow in that vein we have reinforced the toxic variety of masculinity. Look at the attitudes toward rape that were in play when we were growing up. Etc.

Yes Stu, we can look at the outcomes of the power hierarchies and deduce the mechanisms that created the outcome. It's a fact that most of the male occupants of the C-suite in the Fortune 500 score very high in the psychopathic scale. Think about that; we have an economic system that puts psychopaths at the top of the heap, assuming said psychopaths caught the right set of breaks in their childhood. Otherwise, they get free room and board at the state's for life. If and when we can catch them in the act.

My first reaction when Harvey Weinstein was charged with criminal offenses was, "Good! It's about time that pig got what he deserved! Here's hoping many more like him take a lesson from it!" Fair enough as far as it goes, but when I realized how much self-righteousness went into that reaction I got to thinking, "No, I haven't done any of the things he did. On the other hand, I've never held anything remotely similar to the power he held over the women he raped and sexually abused." Can I honestly say that if I had held that much power at that same time and place I would have done anything different? I hope I wouldn't. I think most people who know me would say I'm not like that. Maybe not, but when I think about some of the things I said and the ways I thought about women in my youth, I'm mortified. To say the least.

Throw around all of the anecdotal evidence, which as my Economics professor was wont to say isn't evidence, that you like; it's still a Man's World but not for lack of talent, intelligence, drive and creativity on the part of the females of our species.
David, the PDX Fashion Pioneer

Social norms aren't changed by Congress or Parliament; they're changed by a sufficient number of people ignoring the existing ones and publicly practicing new ones.
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