Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Clippings from news sources involving fashion freedom and other gender equality issues.

Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby TheRod » Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:45 am

This is similar to many othe stories;
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/mar/20/allowing-shorts-at-a-catholic-girls-school-is-sensible-and-without-hidden-intent

Some of the comments are interesting such as
Equally, for reasons of comfort in summer, boys should be allowed to wear skirts.

At my kids' school, uniform is compulsory but, so long as it is worn in full (i.e. you can't mix and match) there is no restriction on which uniform you wear. The boys are welcome to buy and wear the girls' uniform and vice versa. Not many boys do, but it's not unheard of.


My co-ed school brought in a trouser option for the young ladies in the mid-1990s, without controversy. Of course, this was a time before the culture wars had discovered gender as a battleground.

As it happens, very few girls actually wore the trousers. Most preferred skirts and dresses, and some - gasp! - aggressively tailored the hemlines above the knee.


I’m in favour of allowing girls and women to choose, I personally prefer dresses, far more comfortable. My girls chose dresses for school uniform when they were tiny, trousers in junior school then skirts in secondary school. Choice! The idea that women want to wear gender less clothes is false, my daughters current school switched girls to wearing trousers only last year and she and her friends have successfully lobbied to be allowed to wear skirts again.
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby Stu » Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:27 am

There are now scores, possibly hundreds, of schools in the UK that have non-gendered uniform policies. The purpose of these was to allow girls the choice to wear trousers: nothing more. However, equality principles, plus the growing zeal for everyone to virtue signal their "trans-inclusivity", meant that they had to allow boys to wear uniform skirts and dresses. In theory.

Of course, those who manage schools know full well that boys aren't going to take up this option because social pressure and possible humiliation will override the schools' supposed liberal policies. Sure you can wear skirts if you want, lads! We are, after all, very tolerant of trans girls in this school - and you MUST have gender identity issues if you want to wear a skirt, right? After all, a skirt is a signifier of femininity - everyone knows that. This is the mindset that sits at the root of the issue and it is the one that will have to be addressed if males are ever going to have the freedom to wear something other than trousers.
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby moonshadow » Wed Mar 21, 2018 7:41 pm

Doesn't sound like inequality to me. To me it sounds like all the boys want to do is beat their chest and avoid anything that has anything to do with what they perceive as feminine. Meh... whatever. Far be it for me to make boys feel insecure. If they need to see two tubes when they bow their head to make them feel like men.... hey whatever floats their boat.

You folks over in Europe have equality laws that we can only fantasize about here stateside. Nobody is telling your boys that they can't wear skirts.... and yet they choose not to anyway.

Now in America, our boys (that one in a half million) that wants to wear a skirt is often told not just "no" but "aw HE'LL NO!"

Most of the time they do it anyway. Americans can be an obnoxious bunch, but we generally don't wait for permission to be granted before doing what we want. Why do you think we're always fighting amongst ourselves?

They said men can't wear skirts....

American skirt wearing man: hold my beer.... 8)
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby moonshadow » Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:10 pm

As for the trans thing.... once again... the boys just need to say NO!

Why are we so willing to let other people with political agendas rule over us and define who we are?
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby Stu » Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:48 pm

moonshadow

It's a different culture in Europe. When it comes to the UK, they have uniform rules in most schools, although how strict they are varies according to the headmaster (principal) of the school. In the case of the stricter ones, they will ban a student who commits even a small uniform infraction and that can lead to parents being heavily fined.

In most schools, regardless of what the rules supposedly permit, any boy who turned up in a uniform skirt would have a dog's life. They would be bullied mercilessly; they know that and the teachers know that, and that's precisely why they can ostensibly permit it. Hundreds of schools in the UK technically allow boys to wear skirts and that is written into the rules, but virtually none are doing that now and they won't because the culture doesn't allow it. Shame.
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby crfriend » Wed Mar 21, 2018 10:11 pm

Stu wrote:In most schools, regardless of what the rules supposedly permit, any boy who turned up in a uniform skirt would have a dog's life. They would be bullied mercilessly; they know that and the teachers know that, and that's precisely why they can ostensibly permit it. Hundreds of schools in the UK technically allow boys to wear skirts and that is written into the rules, but virtually none are doing that now and they won't because the culture doesn't allow it. Shame.

Herein lies the crux of the problem, and shame is the right way to approach the matter -- to shame those who insist on upholding the inane double-standard of the status-quo.

If a boy feels like wearing a skirt -- for whatever reason -- don't automatically label him trans-*; he likely isn't. Don't give him grief over the matter; perhaps ask questions and learn something. Most of all, if you're an adult, don't let the bullies in the school-yard be your proxy in beating the lad up; that's borderline criminal -- if you don't have the guts to do it yourself, let the matter drop.

So, yes, until the culture of machismo gets shunted off into the corner it deserves it's going to be a hard go for the guy who wants to wear something other than trousers. I don't know if I'll ever actually see such a world, but I'll do my level best to try and help get it there.
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby moonshadow » Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:16 pm

Stu wrote: When it comes to the UK, they have uniform rules in most schools, although how strict they are varies according to the headmaster (principal) of the school. In the case of the stricter ones, they will ban a student who commits even a small uniform infraction and that can lead to parents being heavily fined.


Well that sucks. I don't think most ordinary public U.S. schools have mandated uniforms. HA! Hell, we're lucky to have computers that aren't 20 years old! You think we can afford those fancy uniforms?? Schools that require them are most likely private schools. As such, by the very nature of the "private school" it's typically understood that they set their own standards for pupil behavior, with the only outside requirement is for the school to meet state mandated education standards. Such as it is in homeschooling.

You and Carl make good points, however I still say that until enough boys, and parents of said boys rise up and say "ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!" and drop the machoism bullsh!t... this type of thing will continue. It is a shame that in too many situations, a boy has to claim to be a girl just to be able to share in the freedoms so many females take for granted in regards to how they express themselves....

I don't see a major paradigm shift in my lifetime either unfortunately.

All that being said, hypothetically, if a typical American school boy in a public school just decided he wanted to wear skirts and NOT be considered a girl. I would imagine there may be a little blow back from certain school systems. But if the kid and the kids parents just held to their convictions and refused to take "no" for an answer, I believe the boy would win out...

Now bullying is another matter. Gone are the good old days when you could just bust a chair across some bullies head when he got to running that mouth. These days you both go to jail.
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby Darryl » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:32 am

I was just imagining the scene if "The Karate Kid" decided to wear a skirt...or a dress. And handing out a little "Chuck Norris" to any bully who landed the first blow. Purely in self-defense, of course. 8)
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby SkirtsDad » Thu Mar 22, 2018 9:36 am

Thanks for posting the article TheRod. A shame a few hear don't appear to have understood it. Shame on a Girl's school giving Girls the option of wearing trousers!!! Next they'll be wanting women to have the vote. Oh yes, and how dare the Guardian write an article that's not about boys just because it's a Girl's Catholic school.... that's not equality ;-)

What I did pick up on again, was the intransigence of many of the supposedly religious parents that was so succinctly put in one comment: "Can’t believe the overreaction from the conservative nutjobs... Sheesh people, get a life! Good on the school for being practical and progressive."

Here's a comment from another site relating to the same story: "This is the most backward thing I have ever read. Tell me none of the mothers threatening to pull their children out of the school own pants they wear to work. Having pants as a uniform option has nothing to do with gender fluidity, it's an all girls school, I don't see how having an option (they are optional) of pants has been blown so incredibly out of proportion. Let's keep in mind it is 2018..."

As with so many of the supporters of the move, I also think the headteacher should receive recognition and in particular for not bowing to pressure of the zealots.

The following article is unlikely to appease those that seek withhold options from girls just because the lack of desire and narrow-mindedness of society that apparently precludes skirt wearing by boys.... even though schools, certainly in the UK and probably elsewhere, have anti-bullying policies and various other levels of complaint and appeal processes designed so give that freedom to boys..... but anyway, here it is:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/21/new-zealand-school-abolishes-gendered-uniforms-offering-same-clothes-to-all

"A New Zealand primary school has abolished gendered uniforms for its pupils and replaced them with shorts, a kilt and trousers that can be worn by either sex."

I hope people here don't complain that there is only a kilt option and not a skirt option.. but look, they've added culottes too :-)
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby pelmut » Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:11 pm

moonshadow wrote:...You folks over in Europe have equality laws that we can only fantasize about here stateside. Nobody is telling your boys that they can't wear skirts....

Unfortunately they still are, this notice has appeared in a local catholic school quite recently:

Uniform.jpg


I'm sure it is illegal but I don't suppose anyone will challenge it.
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby moonshadow » Thu Mar 22, 2018 2:03 pm

pelmut wrote:but I don't suppose anyone will challenge it.


Well, until such day arrives then trouser tyranny it is....

Freedom tends not to fight for itself, and for those willing to be ruled, they shall be ruled over.

In the mean time I think the best thing we can do is to is to continue to display our own liberty in dress in the public square. This spreads the idea. There is a reason why throughout the ages the oppressed were kept illiterate... because when you can thwart the spread of ideas and free thought then you have ultimate control of your subjects.

In other words the best protest we can wage is to keep on skirting on....
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby Fred in Skirts » Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:34 pm

moonshadow wrote:Well, until such day arrives then trouser tyranny it is....
Freedom tends not to fight for itself, and for those willing to be ruled, they shall be ruled over.
In other words the best protest we can wage is to keep on skirting on....

Moon I think you have hit the nail right smack dead on the head. I for one believe everyone should have the choice of wearing what ever they like with out being persecuted for it.
:soapbox:
I continue to wear my skirts and dresses out in the public eye and not worry about what anyone thinks and if confronted will fight back.
I will fight for my FREEDOMS!
Climbing down off the box......

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:whistle: Hi I am Fred and I wear skirts and dresses all of the time. :hooray:
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby ethelthefrog » Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:26 pm

Schools here (UK) are required to have an anti-bullying policy. Schools that have a gender-neutral uniform policy are still required to enforce the anti-bullying policy.

When my son decided he was going to wear skirts/dresses to school (as detailed in various other posts here), we spoke to the school so they had some advance warning. Apart from some curious stares on day 1, he's been going to school in a skirt or a dress for 3 years now, with no problems. He says he isn't trans, which means he isn't trans, and nobody is trying to tell him otherwise.

I think that there is a lot of over-doing of the trans* issue. Some people are getting a bit too excited in their attempts to be inclusive and others are reacting to that over-excitement. Basically, from what my research has revealed, all trans* people want is the right to define their own gender thank you very much, and to go about their daily lives without harassment.
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby pelmut » Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:30 pm

ethelthefrog wrote:... all trans* people want is the right to define their own gender thank you very much, and to go about their daily lives without harassment.

That's certainly true for me, and I suspect for the majority of transpeople. ...But transpeople are just as diverse as everyone else, so there will always be the occasional one who makes an a*se of themselves in public; the problem arises when the press and the haters hold them up as representative of all transpeople.
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Re: Sydney Catholic school allows shorts

Postby Caultron » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:59 am

ethelthefrog wrote:I think that there is a lot of over-doing of the trans* issue. Some people are getting a bit too excited in their attempts to be inclusive and others are reacting to that over-excitement. Basically, from what my research has revealed, all trans* people want is the right to define their own gender thank you very much, and to go about their daily lives without harassment.

Amen.

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