Votes Matter ... or Do They?

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Disaffected.citizen
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Disaffected.citizen » Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:27 pm

Sinned wrote:DA, Of course I understood and I was educated in a Grammar School using the metric system for all our experiments in science of which I took Chemistry, Mathematics and Physics, BUT, it doesn't mean that I prefer the system to the good old Imperial one even though the metric is easier on the calculations. Let's just agree to disagree on this one and leave it at that. If our new commonwealth member-elect wants to still use Imperial then let them.

And as regards Hillary and her pants there was a short article in todays Daily Wail by Amanda Platell, "Not to be outdone by Hillary's thunder-thigh pant-suits, Mrs Trump turned up for Donald's acceptance speech in a white jumpsuit. It was Ralph Lauren and cost £3,172, but wouldn't it be nice if, for once, we had a First Lady who didn't want to wear the trousers?"
Sorry, but I get the impression from both of your responses that you missed the intended humour; the sarcasm. As with most British households, notwithstanding metrication, there are likely daily references to imperial weights and measures. That's why I said "You'll not find us using lbs or feet and inches now, no way :lol: " It's the way it is; I use a pint of milk for my coffee and cereal, and travel miles to work, my weight is in stones, pounds, ounces and kg.

Since I recognise the individual rights to choose how things are measured, be they km, m, cm, mi, yd, ft, in; pt, oz, l, ml, kg, etc, etc, etc, there's no disagreement; never has been, never will be. Scales can be calibrated with both systems; you want a lb of apples, there you go - enjoy. I might calculate the price based upon kg, but you'll still get apples.

As Americans generally don't use Imperial measures anyway (U.S. measures differ from Imperial), you can't offer for them to continue to do so. Their current system generally pre-dates our Imperial system.

I'll leave it at that.
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Pdxfashionpioneer
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer » Sun Nov 13, 2016 12:58 am

Part of the reason Obamacare is such a strange critter is that it had such a strange genesis.

Moon and DC, both of you pretty much have it. The only other twist was the first. In the tradition of Lincoln and FDR, Pres. Obama tried to be unideological about his first big initiative. He said, 'I just want everyone to have some kind of healthcare." Chummed out some suggestions and said, "But I want to leave it to Congress to work out the details." To see if they could play nice together ... I guess you'll never know if you don't give it a try.

What emerged, and I forget who suggested it, probably the President's advisors, was an adaptation of the Romneycare model. Probably under the hope that the Republicans would be amenable to something one of their own had originally come up with ... I guess hope springs eternal.

For sure, we've needed the laugh the English reunification proposal always engenders. It's interesting I haven't seen it when a Democrat gets elected President. Maybe it just doesn't sound as funny in my echo chamber.

Now, let's talk about the important stuff. Who invented radar? I didn't realize some of the basic science was so old! I was taught that the American claim on it was based on an observation by scientists working for the US Navy in the 1920's who reported that warships sailing between 2 line of sight radio posts interrupted their transmissions. Apparently, the Italians also had some interwar claim to the invention. The British deserve a lot of credit for being the first to use it strategically as the foundation of a comprehensive, coordinated air defense system.

The whole system was so well thought-out and robust that even though the Germans were able to discern that those tall radio towers on the coast were probably radar towers and somehow important to the UK's air defense system they made them their first targets in the Battle of Britain. The back-ups were so effective that knocking down the towers didn't seem to make a difference and they lost too many Stukas in the attempt so they stopped attacking them and went on to making other equally stupid blunders. The rest is (well-known) history.

As to who invented the computer, the Englishman who invented logorithms also invented the differences engine, which came so close to being a fully functioning computer that if the metalworkers of his day were just a little more skilled and he was a little more focused there would be few remaining quibbles as to who invented the computer. (Would one of you please help me out on this one? I feel so stupid for not being able to remember his name!)
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer » Sun Nov 13, 2016 1:14 am

DC,

The devil's in the details. Indeed, "My Country ..." was one of our anthems, not THE. As is so often said, "It's over until the fat lady (Congress) sings." Mind you, "The Star Spangled Banner" was written in 1814 in commemoration of one of our few victories in the War of 1812 so we should see that there's nothing new about Congress taking its time in figuring things out. Unless it's whether or not to go to war. Somehow that always seems to fly through Congress.

You got me on the potato chips crisps.

Btw, we allow a token Limey to be a good guy once a year or so. Consider the fellow who played Maj. Winters in "Band of Brothers." Ok, his subsequent parts haven't been as heroic, but this is the US afterall. You are right, there is little excuse for our thespians' lousy English accents. Maybe if there was more of cinematic interest that happened in England they'd have more incentive to act more English. :wink:
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by crfriend » Sun Nov 13, 2016 1:31 am

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:As to who invented the computer, the Englishman who invented logorithms [...]
That'd be Napier. He also developed a precursor to the slde-rule, known originally as "Napier's bones" (ivory being about the most stable substance of the day upon which precise markings could be made). Oughtred did the first device that's recognisable as a "modern" slide-rule based on Napier's logarithms and early device.
[...] also invented the differences engine
The difference engine is usually attributed to Charles Babbage, but there is contemporary evidence that he got the idea from elsewhere. That said, one of Babbage's designs (the Number Two) was successfully executed by a team from the London Science Museum in the very early 1990s; I've not seen thing thing in action, but I've read Doron Swade's book on the matter and have seen a few YouTube clips of it in motion. Swade's description of the action of the carry mechanism in motion as being "arresting" is entirely accurate.
[...] which came so close to being a fully functioning computer that if the metalworkers of his day were just a little more skilled and he was a little more focused there would be few remaining quibbles as to who invented the computer.
Again, Babbage, but that was the Analytical Engine. Pieces of the device have been constructed, but no fully functional example exists today as far as I know. If constructed, this would have been the first example of a "computer", but not of the type we have come to know, love, and revile in the modern landscape. An early example of who might possibly have been termed one of the pioneer programmers was one Ada Lovelace who was fascinated by the possibility of Babbage's machine. Sadly, the machine never saw the light of day in its intended form, Babbage not being a believer in the axiom of, "Better is the enemy of good enough" and who was perennially short on funds.
I feel so stupid for not being able to remember his name!)
Don't. This is an esoteric field that most folks have little or no care about. Thanks, though, for showing interest. It gives the geeks of the world some hope.
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer » Sun Nov 13, 2016 2:08 am

Hello Carl,

Thank you for the clarifications.

I don't know why I conflated Napier and Babbage. I knew Ada Lovelace had been involved with Babbage and his machines. I hadn't known the differences engine and the analytical engine were two different machines.

I will have to look at those YouTube films.
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer » Sun Nov 13, 2016 2:33 am

Sorry DC,

I always for get SOMETHING.

Whatever makes you think that we Americans would want to distance ourselves from the French? There's a reason W has laid low since he left office. He's not as stupid as he acted, but he doesn't have any credibility.

I would never disavow the French, we owe them our Independence.

Thank you for explaining why you drive on the left.

Now as to the vehicles you listed; until it was bought by Ford, Jaguar epitomized the knock I laid on the UK nameplates. I met a guy who said that when he owned his Jag so did his roommate and they spent their whole time of ownership driving one another to the repair shop so the one could drop off his car to pick up the other's! Between them they averaged only one functional Jaguar! For all of their cachet, apparently the same is true of Land Rovers. It stands to reason, afterall it's a British derivative of the Jeep, which since someone tried to turn it into a road car has certainly NOT distinguished itself as reliable transportation.

Finally we get to McClaren ... I know nothing of its reliability rating, but considering its heritage, it's doubtful anyone really cares. :D
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by crfriend » Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:27 am

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:I don't know why I conflated Napier and Babbage. I knew Ada Lovelace had been involved with Babbage and his machines.
You're probably not intimately involved with computing and the history thereof. As I mentioned, it's rather esoteric.
I hadn't known the differences engine and the analytical engine were two different machines.
They're not just two different machines, they're two entirely different concepts! The Analytical Engine was a quantum leap from the Difference Engine. 'Tis a shame one was never built!

A good many difference engines were built over the years with varying levels of precision. A rather recent one, in the electronic realm and taken loosely, would be ENIAC. In Babbage's day, the big problems revolved around navigation and tidal prediction; in ENIAC's day it was ballistics calculations, both of which share similarities.

Tools, technology, and time. They make for an interesting mix.
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Disaffected.citizen » Sun Nov 13, 2016 5:22 am

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:DC,

The devil's in the details. Indeed, "My Country ..." was one of our anthems, not THE. As is so often said, "It's over until the fat lady (Congress) sings." Mind you, "The Star Spangled Banner" was written in 1814 in commemoration of one of our few victories in the War of 1812 so we should see that there's nothing new about Congress taking its time in figuring things out. Unless it's whether or not to go to war. Somehow that always seems to fly through Congress.
This is true, which is why I said "a de facto", not " the de facto"
You got me on the potato chips crisps.
That reference is only to the earliest known record. Who's to say one of your guys hadn't cooked them first - just without recording it?
Btw, we allow a token Limey to be a good guy once a year or so. Consider the fellow who played Maj. Winters in "Band of Brothers." Ok, his subsequent parts haven't been as heroic, but this is the US afterall. You are right, there is little excuse for our thespians' lousy English accents. Maybe if there was more of cinematic interest that happened in England they'd have more incentive to act more English. :wink:
But the villains are always the more interesting characters.
Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:Whatever makes you think that we Americans would want to distance ourselves from the French? There's a reason W has laid low since he left office. He's not as stupid as he acted, but he doesn't have any credibility.

I would never disavow the French, we owe them our Independence.
Well, you've got the Atlantic to start with :lol: :lol: :lol:
Thank you for explaining why you drive on the left.
That's just my interpretation and understanding of some of the history. To expand a little, as most individuals favour their right hand, most small weaponry would be handled so. Therefore, you would meet right-to-right. I guess there's some logic and truth in there.

After the French revolution they changed this because any "nobles" left wouldn't be at an advantage.
Now as to the vehicles you listed; until it was bought by Ford, Jaguar epitomized the knock I laid on the UK nameplates. I met a guy who said that when he owned his Jag so did his roommate and they spent their whole time of ownership driving one another to the repair shop so the one could drop off his car to pick up the other's! Between them they averaged only one functional Jaguar! For all of their cachet, apparently the same is true of Land Rovers. It stands to reason, afterall it's a British derivative of the Jeep, which since someone tried to turn it into a road car has certainly NOT distinguished itself as reliable transportation.
That's what the 1970s did for our car (and most other) industry. So, now (I believe) the Indians own Jaguar, Land Rover/Range Rover, Chinese own MG Rover, Koreans own Lotus, Russians own (the now defunct) TVR, and Germans own Rolls Royce (BMW) and Bentley (VW). We do make some good racing cars, though.
Finally we get to McClaren ... I know nothing of its reliability rating, but considering its heritage, it's doubtful anyone really cares. :D
I suspect it will be quite good, at those prices, it ought to be!

N.B. unlike many, although I'm a Brit, I'm a Bitsa [1]. I'm not so partisan as to think we (as a nation) are better than someone else, "just because we're British", or they're French :lol:

I prefer to look at the world as friends I've yet to meet. I don't think I'm heading near the middle east at present, though!

[1] Bitsa = bits of this, bits of that.

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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by pelmut » Sun Nov 13, 2016 8:57 am

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:..The whole system was so well thought-out and robust that even though the Germans were able to discern that those tall radio towers on the coast were probably radar towers and somehow important to the UK's air defense system...
In the late 1930s, war was anticipated and the "Chain Home" radar system was developed from an experiment into a working system. During trials a huge echo was received from a German airship over the North Sea, which was eavesdropping on British radio signals. The Chain Home system initially synchronised its signals by means of the 50c/s mains frequency and the German radio operators assumed that the signals they were receiving were just mains-related interference.

The German intelligence gatherers reported back that they had found no evidence that the British were developing any sort of radiolocation system. The British development team reported back that their system had successfully detected the presence and position of German aircraft.
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Sinned » Sun Nov 13, 2016 1:29 pm

DC that's the problem with the written word. I took your post phrases at face value. Had we been face to face I would have got the inflection in your voice and understood immediately. I do take your point that probably most households in Britain work in the old money as well as the new. Most probably as us older generation die out the metric system will take over as it is easier to calculate with. Sorry about the lost pick up on the humour.
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Jim » Sun Nov 13, 2016 2:10 pm

Here's a serious suggestion that votes don't matter:
election integrity activists point out that the national media’s election day exit polls found that Hillary Clinton was ahead in four key states — North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and Florida — but lost the computerized vote count. - http://www.alternet.org/election-2016/c ... ession-are
The exit polls by impartial sources may be more reliable than the reported count by hackable computers.
The election machinery could be based on using verifiable paper ballots and transparent counting and audit procedures. -ibid

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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Disaffected.citizen » Sun Nov 13, 2016 5:20 pm

Sinned wrote:DC that's the problem with the written word. I took your post phrases at face value. Had we been face to face I would have got the inflection in your voice and understood immediately. I do take your point that probably most households in Britain work in the old money as well as the new. Most probably as us older generation die out the metric system will take over as it is easier to calculate with. Sorry about the lost pick up on the humour.
No worries; I don't get too het up about things, although it might come across so.

I think it'll take several generations before Imperial habits die out!

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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Ray » Sun Nov 13, 2016 5:21 pm

Err, Dave,

I think you might want to use the term "British reunification proposals", not "English".... ;-)

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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer » Thu Nov 17, 2016 2:24 am

Thank you for the correction Ray. It's hard for us Yanks to see those distinctions from the colonies, we've got all of that water in the way! it's especially tough from the Left Coast because we also have the whole North American continent in the way!
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