Pythos,
Please read my previous post on this thread and let me know what you think.
Off to disaster training and saving lives.
Thanks,
Sapphire
FreestyleCafe --- Ideas, anyone?
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Departed Member
Sorry, chum, as a dedicated Wicca, I don't do 'snide' (as anyone here whose been here a while will tell you) - ever. I genuinely felt sorry for you. However, some of your subsequent postings have led me to come to different conclusions. I'm getting the overwhelming impression that you're only seeking replies to your posts out of 'egomania'. I really hope that's not the case.Pythos wrote: Merlin, you did respond.. with a snide little comment about seeing why I would respond to my own post.
Actually, it's quite difficult to see where you (and others, too! I'm not meaning this personally!) are 'coming from' in respect of "Total Fashion (fad?) Freedom". Why do you (and those even more a Zealot?) object so strongly to those of us whose personal view on their own fashion freedom doesn't meet your ideology? Your published pictures generally display a moderate, conservative approach - to my eyes. Why shouldn't we (all) show an interest in one another's range of styles? And feel free to comment - or not - if we so wish? Isn't that what being part of a progressive forum is all about?
Merlin, that has got to be the first positive compliment I have gotten from you concerning those pictures. You see the only comments I got from you is something along the lines of my leggings look seeming as if I couldn't be bothered to change after gym. This was the response I got.
"Sorry! I'll add an observation then. I'm not making personal remarks, just commenting on that particular 'look'.
The whole leggings thing looks like you're at/en route to/from some "Keep-Fit" class or gym - to me, it doesn't convey 'freestyle fashion' at all - just the "can't be bothered to change look" that you're likely to see in the bar, after a fitness session."
This is the post merlin that made my view of you degrade. Not because of what you said, but the way it was said, with absolutely not one positive statement. Now I find my look to you is acceptable,
"Your published pictures generally display a moderate, conservative approach - to my eyes."
You did not say a radical, overly feminine, or other tag. You said moderately conservative...which despite the connection of the last word to some real jerks, is actually quite gratifying to hear.
Where I am coming from when it comes to fashion freedom, is I would like the choice to choose between a pair of jeans, leggings, or a skirt for an event.
Tonight my friend's show opens, when I go, I am seriously considering a skirted outfit, much like the ones I modeled. I am hesitant about this. It is this hesitancy I want to do away with, and that would be through the success of fashion freedom becoming a fashion reality.
I would like the day to come for you to be able to try on something flattering to your body, be it a tight skirt, loose long skirt, hell even leggings and a sweater (if you gave them a chance), and not fear repercussions by your wife, boss, family or friends, which is what most here face.
I cannot know what your style truly is, cause A)I have yet to find a pic of you in an outfit you see fit to wear in public. B) I have yet to find a description of an outfit you like. A pic of you in what you wear at home really doesn't help cause, that is you hiding. All those outfits I displayed, I have worn at one time or another, outside the house.
I do not believe once on this or any other forum have I told someone they should not wear so and so (aside possibly from obviously feminine things that make a female form of the body). I do plead for those here and at the attrium to present a pleasing image, with positive behavior backing it up. Posting about some fellow appearing in a Marlyn Manson, blood letting video, with really negative images, I do not think helps. I have seen several here state in no uncertain terms what clothing items should be a choice for men (since 1982's post, where tunics were apparently men only dresses). I personally don't like to hear people limiting themselves from certain styles because of a clearly evident fear of what others will think. When I detect such a fear, I will post on it. If someone here or at the attrium states they will only wear certain styles of skirts at only contra dances, I will ask why such a limitation? This is simply my curiosity of what drives men to fear. All styles, any style can be worn by a man, if done in a appropriate manner.
Going to an opera in nothing more than a sheer body stocking would strike as negative, however the outfit could be worn at a rocky horror show, or fancy dress party on the risque side. But the way things are, only women have this option of costume. ( I personally have done this, but I wore a black speedo over the bodystocking, despite my lady friend's (who was similarly attired, except without the speedo) daring me to lose the speedos and go all the way (it was semi-opague, so it was sheer under only some lighting conditions)
A guy wearing a short shiny pleated skirt, with cottage cheese legs I don't think would help the idea of men wearing skirts. The fellow who showed up at MSM in the skating outfit, though daring, I think did great damage to the idea of the march. If I showed up in a catsuit outfit, that looked great, except for the fact the material was breaking down, and tattered looking, and becoming almost transparent in areas, I think would put a negative mark on the idea of fashion freedom.
I also dislike hearing about taking "baby steps" and "choosing battles" reason being, I have been actively wearing what I want for the past 10 or so years, and feel the only reason we are held back is because of most of the others still taking "baby steps". If we were in fact a baby, we would be considered lame by the doctors. It has been ten or more years, and things are nearly exactly the same as they were a decade ago.
Well, I did put a lot of examples. I hope I was able to clarify at least where I stand on fashion freedom.
Perhaps I can become a little more civil toward you, from now on. Who knows.
"Sorry! I'll add an observation then. I'm not making personal remarks, just commenting on that particular 'look'.
The whole leggings thing looks like you're at/en route to/from some "Keep-Fit" class or gym - to me, it doesn't convey 'freestyle fashion' at all - just the "can't be bothered to change look" that you're likely to see in the bar, after a fitness session."
This is the post merlin that made my view of you degrade. Not because of what you said, but the way it was said, with absolutely not one positive statement. Now I find my look to you is acceptable,
"Your published pictures generally display a moderate, conservative approach - to my eyes."
You did not say a radical, overly feminine, or other tag. You said moderately conservative...which despite the connection of the last word to some real jerks, is actually quite gratifying to hear.
Where I am coming from when it comes to fashion freedom, is I would like the choice to choose between a pair of jeans, leggings, or a skirt for an event.
Tonight my friend's show opens, when I go, I am seriously considering a skirted outfit, much like the ones I modeled. I am hesitant about this. It is this hesitancy I want to do away with, and that would be through the success of fashion freedom becoming a fashion reality.
I would like the day to come for you to be able to try on something flattering to your body, be it a tight skirt, loose long skirt, hell even leggings and a sweater (if you gave them a chance), and not fear repercussions by your wife, boss, family or friends, which is what most here face.
I cannot know what your style truly is, cause A)I have yet to find a pic of you in an outfit you see fit to wear in public. B) I have yet to find a description of an outfit you like. A pic of you in what you wear at home really doesn't help cause, that is you hiding. All those outfits I displayed, I have worn at one time or another, outside the house.
I do not believe once on this or any other forum have I told someone they should not wear so and so (aside possibly from obviously feminine things that make a female form of the body). I do plead for those here and at the attrium to present a pleasing image, with positive behavior backing it up. Posting about some fellow appearing in a Marlyn Manson, blood letting video, with really negative images, I do not think helps. I have seen several here state in no uncertain terms what clothing items should be a choice for men (since 1982's post, where tunics were apparently men only dresses). I personally don't like to hear people limiting themselves from certain styles because of a clearly evident fear of what others will think. When I detect such a fear, I will post on it. If someone here or at the attrium states they will only wear certain styles of skirts at only contra dances, I will ask why such a limitation? This is simply my curiosity of what drives men to fear. All styles, any style can be worn by a man, if done in a appropriate manner.
Going to an opera in nothing more than a sheer body stocking would strike as negative, however the outfit could be worn at a rocky horror show, or fancy dress party on the risque side. But the way things are, only women have this option of costume. ( I personally have done this, but I wore a black speedo over the bodystocking, despite my lady friend's (who was similarly attired, except without the speedo) daring me to lose the speedos and go all the way (it was semi-opague, so it was sheer under only some lighting conditions)
A guy wearing a short shiny pleated skirt, with cottage cheese legs I don't think would help the idea of men wearing skirts. The fellow who showed up at MSM in the skating outfit, though daring, I think did great damage to the idea of the march. If I showed up in a catsuit outfit, that looked great, except for the fact the material was breaking down, and tattered looking, and becoming almost transparent in areas, I think would put a negative mark on the idea of fashion freedom.
I also dislike hearing about taking "baby steps" and "choosing battles" reason being, I have been actively wearing what I want for the past 10 or so years, and feel the only reason we are held back is because of most of the others still taking "baby steps". If we were in fact a baby, we would be considered lame by the doctors. It has been ten or more years, and things are nearly exactly the same as they were a decade ago.
Well, I did put a lot of examples. I hope I was able to clarify at least where I stand on fashion freedom.
Perhaps I can become a little more civil toward you, from now on. Who knows.
Cfriend, perhaps such one word responses should be avoided.
In your example, you stated"me too" being a response to something.
Well, instead of just me too, you put what you thought of the subject, or where you saw the subject, or what ever. It is those short, meaningless responses that we need to avoid. I personally don't do such responses, ok there are times I will respond with "and your point being..."cause the poster most likely did not finish their statement in a way people could clearly understand.
The whole attendance thing I have to answer with...So what?
What does it matter?
Also, I am not suggesting you respond each and every time you view a topic, I am only suggesting that a response be given the first time a topic is viewed.
For the safire. I commend what you do, but I find it funny how you can view this forum, and respond to some, when you are so pressed for time. If you are short on time, how can you even participate in the forum?
In your example, you stated"me too" being a response to something.
Well, instead of just me too, you put what you thought of the subject, or where you saw the subject, or what ever. It is those short, meaningless responses that we need to avoid. I personally don't do such responses, ok there are times I will respond with "and your point being..."cause the poster most likely did not finish their statement in a way people could clearly understand.
The whole attendance thing I have to answer with...So what?
What does it matter?
Also, I am not suggesting you respond each and every time you view a topic, I am only suggesting that a response be given the first time a topic is viewed.
For the safire. I commend what you do, but I find it funny how you can view this forum, and respond to some, when you are so pressed for time. If you are short on time, how can you even participate in the forum?
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Departed Member
Ah, Pythos!
Thanks for your most civil response! We all have differing views on what suits us, or others, clothes-wise or whatever. I do solidly stand by both those comments, though. Perhaps I should have used the word "one", rather than "you", in respect of leggings worn outside the sporting context?
There has recently been a concerted push (by the 'fashionistas'), at least here in the UK in recent months, in newspapers and mainstream TV to 'get blokes into leggings'. It would appear to have been a tremendous 'faux pas', as those members of "Joe & Jill Public" interviewed, expressed sentiments similar ('cept not so politely!) to mine. It's not to say that folk shouldn't wear 'em, just that the image seems to be stuck 'by association'. Maybe it is the enduring image of comedian, Max Wall (from the '40s/'50s) that 'cloud' folks' judgement, I'm not sure. I certainly remember conversations on the subject, way back in the late '70s, including one when I was asked, "You're not coming to the Pub in those, are you?" after refereeing a football match! Not because leggings were (still are) totally 'unisex', but because there was nowhere to carry any cash!
As for photos, no, I don't generally post photos (although I have as an avatar, some while ago), as the 'slim jims' would probably take offence at my current 'overweight' situation. There have been a number of opinions offered, in recent months, to the effect that overweight blokes shouldn't wear skirts. I disagree (naturally!), most chaps I know who wear Kilts are 'worse' than I, in that department!
Thanks for your most civil response! We all have differing views on what suits us, or others, clothes-wise or whatever. I do solidly stand by both those comments, though. Perhaps I should have used the word "one", rather than "you", in respect of leggings worn outside the sporting context?
There has recently been a concerted push (by the 'fashionistas'), at least here in the UK in recent months, in newspapers and mainstream TV to 'get blokes into leggings'. It would appear to have been a tremendous 'faux pas', as those members of "Joe & Jill Public" interviewed, expressed sentiments similar ('cept not so politely!) to mine. It's not to say that folk shouldn't wear 'em, just that the image seems to be stuck 'by association'. Maybe it is the enduring image of comedian, Max Wall (from the '40s/'50s) that 'cloud' folks' judgement, I'm not sure. I certainly remember conversations on the subject, way back in the late '70s, including one when I was asked, "You're not coming to the Pub in those, are you?" after refereeing a football match! Not because leggings were (still are) totally 'unisex', but because there was nowhere to carry any cash!
As for photos, no, I don't generally post photos (although I have as an avatar, some while ago), as the 'slim jims' would probably take offence at my current 'overweight' situation. There have been a number of opinions offered, in recent months, to the effect that overweight blokes shouldn't wear skirts. I disagree (naturally!), most chaps I know who wear Kilts are 'worse' than I, in that department!
Did you see those really awful examples of blokes in leggings. First off the leggings did not fit. They were so loose they just looked like really crappy fitting sweat pants. Leggings are supposed to be sleek and fit like a second skin. The colors were terrible looking. The rest of the outfit just did not compliment the leggings. One dummy who did an article wore lavender leggins, no socks, BROWN mens shoes, a stupid looking dress shirt, and a red beanie cap. This presentation looked not only awful, but called into question the seriousnous of this guy.
Both of these examples of leggings suck rocks for lack of a better term.
The first examples were from the Marni exibit.
Now the opinions of the masses really should not matter to you or I. These are the same people that think hose less legs look good, that baggy jeans fit well, and so on and so forth. The opinions I saw about leggings centered about the whole "return of the 80s" which frankly I though was ludicrous. The main reason leggings dropped out of favor is because of the moaning of those that did not have the build to wear them. Also the explosion of really obese individuals wearing them as pants, with clearly visible underwear. These presented a very bad image for leggings, this is the image most people conjure up, when they recall leggings. By their nature leggings should be worn with little or nothing underneath. They should fit well, and be worn with other items that works with them. To be honest most of the complainers are people I would not want to see in leggings, either too skinny or too fat. Heck this one critic ripped into Mariah Carey for wearing an outfit consisting of a nice shirt, jacket, black cotton lycra leggings, and boots when out with her Beau. The comment was "Oh mariah you really shouldn't let your posterior hang out like that." I thought she looked great. Her choice of leggings could have been better, cause they were worn in the seat and the flash bulbs lit up her flowered undies. This would have not been an issue with normal lighting, or the ditching of the undies. She looked great in my opinion from all angles. Would this critic have said this had mariah been in skin tight jeans? Her rear would "hang out" in the same manner. Then I saw the critic. Nuf said. She was not so nice looking.
The comedian you have mentioned I have never heard of.
The whole no where to put your money thing... I have worked out, I wear a jacket with pockets, or a shirt with pockets, or when push comes to crunch and I am in "athletic mode" I wear a fanny pack. Remember skirts have not many areas to put your money, or other things. hence the idea of handbags, which guys are now carrying these days for their lap tops.
As far as being worried or concerned about people knocking you for being overweight and skirted, don't worry about it. Just show yourself in an outfit that looks good to you. It takes guts to go out skirted, don't worry about your build. Now if you are personally ashamed about your being overweight then perhaps you should do something about it. I'll tell you, my catsuit wearing has contributed greatly to my not getting rotund. The moment my belly can push out against the spandex and form a pudge...it's sit ups time, and cut down on extra snacks time.
Both of these examples of leggings suck rocks for lack of a better term.
The first examples were from the Marni exibit.
Now the opinions of the masses really should not matter to you or I. These are the same people that think hose less legs look good, that baggy jeans fit well, and so on and so forth. The opinions I saw about leggings centered about the whole "return of the 80s" which frankly I though was ludicrous. The main reason leggings dropped out of favor is because of the moaning of those that did not have the build to wear them. Also the explosion of really obese individuals wearing them as pants, with clearly visible underwear. These presented a very bad image for leggings, this is the image most people conjure up, when they recall leggings. By their nature leggings should be worn with little or nothing underneath. They should fit well, and be worn with other items that works with them. To be honest most of the complainers are people I would not want to see in leggings, either too skinny or too fat. Heck this one critic ripped into Mariah Carey for wearing an outfit consisting of a nice shirt, jacket, black cotton lycra leggings, and boots when out with her Beau. The comment was "Oh mariah you really shouldn't let your posterior hang out like that." I thought she looked great. Her choice of leggings could have been better, cause they were worn in the seat and the flash bulbs lit up her flowered undies. This would have not been an issue with normal lighting, or the ditching of the undies. She looked great in my opinion from all angles. Would this critic have said this had mariah been in skin tight jeans? Her rear would "hang out" in the same manner. Then I saw the critic. Nuf said. She was not so nice looking.
The comedian you have mentioned I have never heard of.
The whole no where to put your money thing... I have worked out, I wear a jacket with pockets, or a shirt with pockets, or when push comes to crunch and I am in "athletic mode" I wear a fanny pack. Remember skirts have not many areas to put your money, or other things. hence the idea of handbags, which guys are now carrying these days for their lap tops.
As far as being worried or concerned about people knocking you for being overweight and skirted, don't worry about it. Just show yourself in an outfit that looks good to you. It takes guts to go out skirted, don't worry about your build. Now if you are personally ashamed about your being overweight then perhaps you should do something about it. I'll tell you, my catsuit wearing has contributed greatly to my not getting rotund. The moment my belly can push out against the spandex and form a pudge...it's sit ups time, and cut down on extra snacks time.
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crfriend
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This, in a nutshell, is the conundrum that most of us here face any time we want to go out the door -- is it trousers or skirt? -- and, put bluntly, I suspect we're all on the same page of music when it comes to that. We should be able to make that choice and not face ridicule or discrimination because of our apparel choices. Unfortunately, at the moment, we do face those obstacles in many settings.Where I am coming from when it comes to fashion freedom, is I would like the choice to choose between a pair of jeans, leggings, or a skirt for an event.
Tonight my friend's show opens, when I go, I am seriously considering a skirted outfit, much like the ones I modeled. I am hesitant about this. It is this hesitancy I want to do away with, and that would be through the success of fashion freedom becoming a fashion reality.
The question here, to my mind, would be, "Why are you hesitant to wear a skirted rig to your friend's opening?" Are you worried that he'll be discredited by your attire? Will he, himself, heap scorn and ridicule on you (if he's a stand-up comic and is running short on material he might, although if you're good friends it oughtn't matter)? Will you somehow steal his thunder? To me, this sounds like a non-threatening environment that would be conducive to skirt-wearing; what makes you unsure?
I'm very candid about not wearing my skirts to work -- for several reasons, most of which I've already enumerated here in the past. However, pretty much everything else is fair game, unless there are overriding circumstances (see the "need help" thread posted by Sapphire), and I mostly just don't worry about it.
I don't mean to be rude, but will you say the same thing about short skirts when you're in your 40s or 50s and have "cottage cheese legs"? That's like saying that nobody over 30 should wear a miniskirt. It doesn't make a lot of sense, does it? As far as Steve Arness (I believe that's his name) is concerned, I doubt that he did much "damage" at all. Nor did Brad (who collected most of the photo-ops because he was one of the "more extreme" of the crowd at the time (most of the guys, if you look carefully at the pictures, were wearing the ultimate man-skirt -- kilts).A guy wearing a short shiny pleated skirt, with cottage cheese legs I don't think would help the idea of men wearing skirts. The fellow who showed up at MSM in the skating outfit, though daring, I think did great damage to the idea of the march.
So, either we're for all-out equality of fashion options or we're not. Is that what I'm hearing? Does the personal decision of "picking one's battles" disqualify those that do as champions of fashion freedom? If the decision to wear a skirt or not is unavailable because of zealotry does that not make the zealot fully as evil as those who would deny the decision because it's merely unorthodox?
Enormous improvement has been demonstrated here. Nicely done. This one was an interesting read.Perhaps I can become a little more civil toward you, from now on. Who knows.
Retrocomputing -- It's not just a job, it's an adventure!
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ChristopherJ
- Member Extraordinaire
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pythos
I read loads of threads (on this and other forums) and make no response. If I have something that I want to say - then I do respond and post a reply The point is - this is my choice. I would object strongly if that choice was removed and I was forced to post something when I didn't want to.
I don't see why you even brought this subject up. The only possible reason I can think of is that very few people posted responses to a thread that you had started - and you may have felt upset or annoyed about that. If that's the case, you need not have felt that way - I have started loads of threads which everyone else has ignored completely! That's just life.
It's not the responding that is a no-no for me, but the fact that you were saying a response should be compulsory if anyone opened a thread.Chris J. Why is responding when viewing an "absolute no no" for you? You took the time to open the topic, so there must have been interest.
I read loads of threads (on this and other forums) and make no response. If I have something that I want to say - then I do respond and post a reply The point is - this is my choice. I would object strongly if that choice was removed and I was forced to post something when I didn't want to.
I don't see why you even brought this subject up. The only possible reason I can think of is that very few people posted responses to a thread that you had started - and you may have felt upset or annoyed about that. If that's the case, you need not have felt that way - I have started loads of threads which everyone else has ignored completely! That's just life.
It's never too late to have a happy childhood . . .
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crfriend
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Followup to a decision...
Pythos -- How'd the opening go? Perhaps more on-topic for us lot, "What'd you wear?", and "What drove the decision?"Tonight [2007-10-06] my friend's show opens, when I go, I am seriously considering a skirted outfit, much like the ones I modeled. I am hesitant about this. It is this hesitancy I want to do away with, and that would be through the success of fashion freedom becoming a fashion reality.
My comments are based on technical matters and societal responses to technical issues. Certainly, if it was desired, the software the drives the forum could be modified to require a response the first time a post is viewed, and then to waive that requirement for subsequent views -- but, and you may have noticed this, none of the commonly available software has that capability built in; it's a bad idea. Why is it a bad idea? It's a bad idea because it will irk people (who may have more important things to do than compose a cogent response to something they stumbled on) and cause them to expend the minimum amount of energy possible to fulfill the requirement (leading to one-word replies). This, in turn, pollutes the message-space and reduces the S/N ratio thereby reducing the impact and usefulness of the forum. I'm not trying to be an SOB about this; I'm just trying to take human factors into account.Cfriend, perhaps such one word responses should be avoided [to posts].
There is it from the other side of the fence -- "it's just life". Sometimes folks don't reply because they don't like the subject matter, sometimes they don't reply because they haven't the time, and sometimes the don't reply because they legitimately don't know an answer to a problem. Too, there's always the underlying thread that was hammered into many of us from a very young age: "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all."I have started loads of threads which everyone else has ignored completely! That's just life.
On the topic of leggings: Personally, I loathe the things. Poorly executed, and many (if not most) are, they put an extra break in the line of the leg; this can be overcome by making them "footed", but then they become "tights" which, for various reasons puts some people off. Stirrups can help overcome that problem, but unless high-topped shoes (or boots) are worn, there's usually a break. Compounding that aesthetic gaffe, they really are only appropriate for a tiny subset of the population. They look positively awful on stick-figures and the more "chubby" set; there's a very tight envelope that a body can occupy and have the look fly. Properly done, the look can be stunning, but the difference between looking stunning and looking stupid is very small; kudos to those who can make the look work, but they're few and far between.
Retrocomputing -- It's not just a job, it's an adventure!
The opening, I did not attend, scheduels did not work out. My female friend's opening went awful. It was a one actress show, that my friend is prop master for. The actress consitantly forgot her lines.
On why I would be hesitant about wearing a skirt. My friend loves my skirt wearing, she has flat out stated that I cannot embarrass her with the styles I wear. But I do know that other people can be down right cruel, and my friend has only recently started at this theater. I know what my friend would do if someone slighted my choice of style. She's would rip into them on full defense. Knowing how cowardly people will save their remarks after the fact, I was concerned about after the show was done, and the next day was around, and one of the more senior co-workers firing off their mouths.
Silly and convoluted, but there it is. I was concerned for my friend's security at her fledgling job.
Now several months down the line? Different story.
On why I would be hesitant about wearing a skirt. My friend loves my skirt wearing, she has flat out stated that I cannot embarrass her with the styles I wear. But I do know that other people can be down right cruel, and my friend has only recently started at this theater. I know what my friend would do if someone slighted my choice of style. She's would rip into them on full defense. Knowing how cowardly people will save their remarks after the fact, I was concerned about after the show was done, and the next day was around, and one of the more senior co-workers firing off their mouths.
Silly and convoluted, but there it is. I was concerned for my friend's security at her fledgling job.
Now several months down the line? Different story.
Frestyle cafe ideas
Gentlemen, please stop bikkering with each other, and answer the question at hand, do we have any more good ideas for the forum, and do we agree with the introduction as set up?
When there are only twenty people on a forum, then reacting to every vieuwing may be interesting, but when there are more, I am sure that it would only have negative effects. Any full reactions are of course very welcome.
We should of course choose the wording very carefully, indeed not using "allowd" and adressing the term feminine, possibly saying dressing more creatively. In that way we are talking about what freedom of the way we dress is all about. As "feminine" is thought of as referring to women, but in my book refers to a finer, more gentle, subtle, frivole way of dressing.
This is one topic which may be set down already, to adress how we call what we do. Without it referring to women, but to the way PEOPLE dress.
I do enjoy the active participation of the few of you who are curently discussing with each other about the new ideas. At least you have the time and interest to react. As with so many forums, there are a select few who have the time to sit at the computer, end also have the community at heart.
I came at my mother's house after 20.00 hours, and she said to a visitor, I put on this skirt today because I wanted to feel like a woman. I said ( I was in a knee length denim skirt, well nice that you stated that when I am standing here next to you in a skirt. As if I want to feel / be a woman.
That is what I mean with how we use specifik words. All this fashion freedom is relatively new, especially with regards to using clothing and ideas which women curently have in use. So it is a challenge for us to redefine what we are doing so that it can be referred to in the right context. That also goes for the Skirt Cafe as elll naturally, only there the main theme is more about men in manly get ups, where as freestyle is about using fashion that looks and feels good on you, no matter who the fashion people intended it to be sold to.
If you read well you should be able to se that I frased the last sentances so that I didn't referr to "Women". That's not easy, but can be done and is I hope better understandable.
Must stop long enough for now.
Peter v.
When there are only twenty people on a forum, then reacting to every vieuwing may be interesting, but when there are more, I am sure that it would only have negative effects. Any full reactions are of course very welcome.
We should of course choose the wording very carefully, indeed not using "allowd" and adressing the term feminine, possibly saying dressing more creatively. In that way we are talking about what freedom of the way we dress is all about. As "feminine" is thought of as referring to women, but in my book refers to a finer, more gentle, subtle, frivole way of dressing.
This is one topic which may be set down already, to adress how we call what we do. Without it referring to women, but to the way PEOPLE dress.
I do enjoy the active participation of the few of you who are curently discussing with each other about the new ideas. At least you have the time and interest to react. As with so many forums, there are a select few who have the time to sit at the computer, end also have the community at heart.
I came at my mother's house after 20.00 hours, and she said to a visitor, I put on this skirt today because I wanted to feel like a woman. I said ( I was in a knee length denim skirt, well nice that you stated that when I am standing here next to you in a skirt. As if I want to feel / be a woman.
That is what I mean with how we use specifik words. All this fashion freedom is relatively new, especially with regards to using clothing and ideas which women curently have in use. So it is a challenge for us to redefine what we are doing so that it can be referred to in the right context. That also goes for the Skirt Cafe as elll naturally, only there the main theme is more about men in manly get ups, where as freestyle is about using fashion that looks and feels good on you, no matter who the fashion people intended it to be sold to. If you read well you should be able to se that I frased the last sentances so that I didn't referr to "Women". That's not easy, but can be done and is I hope better understandable.
Must stop long enough for now.
Peter v.
A man is the same man in a pair of pants or a skirt. It is only the way people look at him that makes the difference.
upon some thinking and some PMs from members here I have come up with an alteration to my idea.
I would still like the idea of, if one views a topic they should post at least one response. But the response doesn't have to be at that moment. So the viewer can have time to think of a cogent response. I personally do this for my responses that require some thinking and tact.
Perhaps this idea sits better with members here?
I would still like the idea of, if one views a topic they should post at least one response. But the response doesn't have to be at that moment. So the viewer can have time to think of a cogent response. I personally do this for my responses that require some thinking and tact.
Perhaps this idea sits better with members here?
This still does not really work for me, though others may take a different view.Pythos wrote:...I have come up with an alteration to my idea.
< SNIP >
Perhaps this idea sits better with members here?
I don't like the idea of compulsion in a site that is about freedom, that just does not feel right somehow.
Although I sometimes return to a thread to post a delayed reply, often I find even less reason to post after a delay than I might have had initially, either because someone has already said what I was thinking or because I've come to the conclusion that it does not need saying.
I agree that encouraging participation is good but if the participation is mandated I suspect the quality and value of "the average post" (whatever that is) will fall and ultimately lead to a reduction in real participation.
Sorry if that sounds negative, I just don't think that compulsory posting is either useful or workable.
Have fun,
Ian.
PS: To gauge the general mood of the members of the new forum (once it is up and running) why not post a poll asking if members want a rule of this type on the new site? Despite GWB running the USA and Blair then Brown being in the driving seat here in the UK, it is still possible that democracy could come up with a right answer...
Do not argue with idiots; they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
Cogito ergo sum - Descartes
Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum - Ambrose Bierce
Cogito ergo sum - Descartes
Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum - Ambrose Bierce
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Departed Member
I must agree with Ian, here. Belonging to any forum where it is compulsory to respond is a major obstacle to encouraging anyone to join. Even non-compulsory sites (such as X Marks?) are so full of, "Nice Kilt!", "What a pretty colour!", etc., etc., they are just a pain for others to wade through. Mandating response serves no-one.Milfmog wrote: I don't like the idea of compulsion in a site that is about freedom, that just does not feel right somehow.
Sorry if that sounds negative, I just don't think that compulsory posting is either useful or workable.
To gauge the general mood of the members of the new forum (once it is up and running) why not post a poll asking if members want a rule of this type on the new site?
As for a poll/ballot, I'm amazed that there hasn't been one posted here to at least give members the chance to see whether an 'alternative' (Freestyle) forum would be viable, or even welcome! There'd then be no 'compulsion' to post your (personal) reasons why, and thus avoid the 'fire & brimstone' effect of the Freedom Evangelista's wrath!
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Not with me. And I suspect not with anyone else besides you. It's an unfixably bad idea.Pythos wrote:upon some thinking and some PMs from members here I have come up with an alteration to my idea.
I would still like the idea of, if one views a topic they should post at least one response. But the response doesn't have to be at that moment. So the viewer can have time to think of a cogent response. I personally do this for my responses that require some thinking and tact.
Perhaps this idea sits better with members here?
I think any attempt to "compel" participation in any form will, at best backfire. (We could have a whole thread on all the possible bad consequences.) And I cannot see how getting people to post who aren't already inspired to do so by the content they read here will raise the quality of discourse here.
For every response I post, there are two or three that I start writing, and then think better of it. And this site is the better for my not posting them. I'm a bit of a grouch, so, trust me: you really don't want me sharing my reaction to most of the posts I read here! I suspect I'm not alone in this. Also, writing a post (or response) worth reading takes a lot of time and thought, and I don't have all that much free time.
Pythos, if you think your posts are not getting the response they deserve, I think you will have more luck if you spend time figuring out how to write them so they will get that response. Trying to force people to pay attention will just make people want to reject you.