Gold Star Famlies

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oldsalt1
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Gold Star Famlies

Post by oldsalt1 »

I am not sure everyone is aware of what a gold star family is.

A gold star family is one where a member of the family has given their life in the service of our country. It could be a mother who lost a son a wife who lost her husband or children whos father is not coming home.

Part of the tribute to the family is to receive an American flag folded in a specific manor and encased if a wooden container.

Nancy Pelosi has disrespected all of the families by giving a flag as describe above to Floyd's brother

We all regret Floyds death but the man was a convicted felon and in no way deserved to be put in the same class of those who truly earned that flag.
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by Uncle Al »

I totally agree with you. The Flag is given to the families of those
who've perished in the line of duty to, and for, our country.

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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by partlyscot »

" We encourage the display of the flag of the United States by all citizens of the United States. Now while there is no rule for it, traditionally a flag is folded into a triangle when it is not flown and may be stored in a presentation case if a particular flag has special meaning.

So presenting someone with a flag, folded into a triangle and placed into a display case is an honorable way of presenting and maintaining the flag of the United States."


American Legion.
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by Ray »

This is worth a read.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/flag-nancy-pelosi/

I have no opinion on the matter.
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oldsalt1
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by oldsalt1 »

partlyscot wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 5:39 pm
" We encourage the display of the flag of the United States by all citizens of the United States. Now while there is no rule for it, traditionally a flag is folded into a triangle when it is not flown and may be stored in a presentation case if a particular flag has special meaning.

So presenting someone with a flag, folded into a triangle and placed into a display case is an honorable way of presenting and maintaining the flag of the United States."


American Legion.
I am a member of the American legion and I don't think there would be one member of the legion that would condone presenting a flag in this instant.
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by moonshadow »

oldsalt1 wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 2:24 pm
We all regret Floyds death but the man was a convicted felon and in no way deserved to be put in the same class of those who truly earned that flag.
Yeah... I tend to align with you on this one. Of course it's just political posturing by Pelosi anyway, but still...
Last edited by moonshadow on Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Pdxfashionpioneer
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer »

Progress has been made in awareness of police brutality... the politicians can dial it down a notch now.... Yes what happened was inexcusable, but it's not like we nailed him to a cross or anything.


Say what???!! Did you miss the part about the man being DEAD!

Ray, thank you for including that link to Snopes. If anyone is really interested in this topic you should follow the link and read the whole article. If you do you will learn that a spokesperson from the Department of Veteran Affairs said that the DVA presents flags in the triangular presentation box to the families of a wide variety of veterans, not just those who were killed in action or while in uniform during a war.

PartlyScot got the quote that OldSalt had a problem from the Snopes article. They in turn were told that by the national Deputy Director for Communications of the American Legion. The Snopes article directly quoted the US Flag Code. So, it was plain to see that the American Legion's Deputy Director was paraphrasing the code.

Finally, the Snopes article was able to connect with Speaker Pelosi's staff who readily confirmed that the photograph was genuine and shows Speaker Pelosi presenting George Floyd's brother with a flag that had flown over the Capital Building on the day Mr. Floyd was murdered. The Speaker presented the living Mr. Floyd with that flag in a presentation case in gratitude for his coming to Washington, DC to speak to a House Committee about the manner in which his brother was killed and the surrounding issues and impacts.

This is a very common occurrence. The Architect of the Capital Building receives approximately 100,000 requests per year from Senators and Representatives for flags that have flown over the Capital. The members of Congress not only present them as remembrances for one thing or another but any constituent can purchase one from their Senator or Representative for any reason or no reason.

In short, there is nothing sacrosanct about a US flag folded in a triangular shape in a presentation case. Anybody can give one to anybody else for any reason or no reason.

Dan, Al, I respect your service, but it doesn't give either of you or your fellow vets, jointly or severally, any right to supersede the law of the land*. We ARE a nation of laws, not individuals. Those laws protect our freedoms from the encroachments of would-be dictators. That's what you were defending when you wore our nation's uniform. You weren't earning some special prerogative to impose your personal preferences.


*The Flag Code was originally passed into law in 1923. Since then the Supreme Court ruled that it is unenforceable because to do so would infringe on the transgressor's 1st Amendment right to freedom of expression. So legally it is just a set of suggestions on how to handle the flag.
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by moonshadow »

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:11 am
Say what???!! Did you miss the part about the man being DEAD!
Yeah I got that, from the knee of a brutal police officer. He did not die in battle for his country. Unfortunate as it was I do respect the need to note the difference.

If I get nailed by a drunk driver and die as a result, that's also a result of negligence, but I don't think I would deserve military honors.
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Pdxfashionpioneer
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer »

One more time, Speaker Pelosi did NOT grant George Floyd military honors. Read the Snopes.com article.
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by moonshadow »

I did, it's close enough.

It's getting tacky and tangled up in partisan politics.

These kind of shenanigans only serve to galvanize Trumps base and will probably put the needle of a few independents slightly red.

This is the kind of stuff that got Trump elected in the first place.

Keep it up.... this kind of thing only makes Trump stronger.

I don't have a lot of use for Trump, or most politicians... but we respect the customs of our veterans, codified or not, we owe them our lives.
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by moonshadow »

I mean, it makes no difference what I think, it's done now and there is no taking it back, but I'm just saying that when standing in the presence of a veteran, this is not something I'd bring up.

But that's me, this is clearly a thread of opinion regarding what is and isn't appropriate. It is what it is.

Dan and I disagree on just about everything, but I respect his service to our nation, and what is offensive to veterans in general is offensive to me...
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by oldsalt1 »

Don't give me any crap about the law.. This is a simple matter of respect.

Yes

Anyone can give the described flag to anyone

There is a symbolism of presenting such a flag to the relatives of those who have given their lives in the service of their country.

PLain and simple the act of ceremoniously giving the flag in such a manor to Floyds brother was an act of DISRESPECT PERIOD

Raughter from the legion did not condone the act he just stated that there was no legal precedence over it
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oldsalt1
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by oldsalt1 »

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:59 am
One more time, Speaker Pelosi did NOT grant George Floyd military honors. Read the Snopes.com article.
One more time Just as a point of reference when snopes started out it was middle of the road however since 2016 it has leined more and more towards a left leaning liberal position.

We veterans are not trying to circumvent any laws

While you were not in the military I am sure that thru your life you have come across certain actions that represent a level of respect and dignity

please tell me how you would react when someone thru their actions craps all over them.
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by crfriend »

oldsalt1 wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:24 pm
One more time Just as a point of reference when snopes started out it was middle of the road however since 2016 it has leined more and more towards a left leaning liberal position.
Far more likely what happened was that it start off centrist and stayed that way; the country hardened off to the right and that's causing the perception in shift.

For grins, read some of Bernie Sanders' platform. It sounds quite reminiscent of some of the fairly centrist views in the 1960s. Now of course he's regarded as a far-left-wing radical; he hasn't changed, the country changed. In the 1970s I was regarded as leaning "slightly right of centre". I haven't changed my perspective, yet I am now regarded as a Communist; I didn't change, the country changed. And not for the better.
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oldsalt1
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Re: Gold Star Famlies

Post by oldsalt1 »

crfriend wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:54 pm
oldsalt1 wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:24 pm
One more time Just as a point of reference when snopes started out it was middle of the road however since 2016 it has leined more and more towards a left leaning liberal position.
Far more likely what happened was that it start off centrist and stayed that way; the country hardened off to the right and that's causing the perception in shift.
Let me get this straight you are saying that in the last few years the country has shifted to the right.

Is there anybody on the café that agrees with that statement
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