Corona Virus

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moonshadow
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by moonshadow »

Faldaguy wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:11 am
by moonshadow » Tue Nov 23, 2021 5:52 am

Also, how much longer before this virus mutates a vaccine resistant strain? Are we just going to keep poking ourselves with the same formula as they become increasingly useless?
Here you go Moon, from yesterday's Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/ ... -mutations
Yeah, that's kinda what I've been saying.

Plus, I'm a little confused about rode's response that "it doesn't work like that, when the article he posted seems to directly say that indeed, "it does work like that".

I think my comment was misunderstood by rode.
But we should still be careful. As mentioned earlier, numbers matter when it comes to resistance. The more viruses that are around – as in a rapidly growing pandemic – the more likely it is one may hit the jackpot and develop mutations resulting in a significant impact on vaccine efficacy. If that’s the case, a new version of the vaccine may be necessary to create antibodies against these mutated viruses.
With the delta being the big variant right now, and the number of breakthrough cased combined with the obvious reduction in vaccine effectiveness, I do wonder if we've already crossed the threshold of the usefulness of the current vaccine.

Perhaps it's time to start on a new one?

Again, I'm not opposed to additional jabs, but I don't just want to keep sticking myself with an obsolete formula.
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crfriend
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Re: Corona Virus

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moonshadow wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:14 pm
With the delta being the big variant right now, and the number of breakthrough cased combined with the obvious reduction in vaccine effectiveness, I do wonder if we've already crossed the threshold of the usefulness of the current vaccine.

Perhaps it's time to start on a new one?
It likely is time to start considering variants of the current crop of vaccines, but before that can be undertaken it must first be established what the next dominant variant is going to supplant the current one -- and likely the current one isn't going to go away very soon.

Since any new vaccine variant -- and it's pretty much a given that it'll be precisely that -- the designers will need to know the genetic sequencing of the pathogen and will need to know which one to target. It would make little sense developing a vaccine for a virus with a mutation that makes it less transmissible.
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Sinned
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by Sinned »

Just to add insult to r_k's assertions here's the following: https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/ho ... li=BBoPWjQ. Things appear to be much worse in Europe but we mustn't be complacent as situations can change very quickly.

As for variants, well, it's nice to know that scientists are identifying, monitoring and measuring these things.
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by Ray »

New virus mutation in South Africa. Now on the forbidden list in England (with the rest of the U.K. sure to follow). Bang goes my Jan 22 holiday there. Again.

That’s what happens when you don’t vaccinate enough. The damned thing mutates.

(Sigh)
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moonshadow
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by moonshadow »

Ray wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 10:53 pm
That’s what happens when you don’t vaccinate enough. The damned thing mutates.
Well, the western world is about as vaccinated as it's going to get. In fact, I look for many who received the first two jabs to stop there.

You know, I really think people like living like this. I think they like the drama, I think the like the sky high inflation. I think they like the idea that they are living in a major page of history....

You know, we could have ended world hunger, homelessness, eliminated corruption, provided healthcare for all, any of those things, and made history that way but no... it seems humanity will always be defined by its wars, plagues, and injustice.

Let the virus have its way... here's to the mutation that finally wipes out the human species... the inevitable cure for the Earth. *cheers*

Hey... I'd rather go by covid than go by cancer. At least covid is relatively quick. And if covid doesn't get me, cancer probably will.

And if it doesn't kill me, then hey, I get a few weeks off from work. That ought to be funny to watch. Let someone else carry the world on their shoulder for a change! :twisted:
-Moon Shadow
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by rode_kater »

moonshadow wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:14 pm
Plus, I'm a little confused about rode's response that "it doesn't work like that, when the article he posted seems to directly say that indeed, "it does work like that".
These strains are spreading via people who are not vaccinated at all. So far there is not enough information about whether this variant is going to be a problem at all. Research shows that people who got SARS in 2002 have a good response to COVID, and that was a lot further away genetically than any mutations we see now.
moonshadow wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:14 pm
I think my comment was misunderstood by rode.
My point is that historically vaccine resistance is really rare and we have no reason to suspect it will be any different this time round.
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by rode_kater »

Sinned wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:02 pm
r_k, for the adult population AZ is/was used for the first 2 doses and has amounted to some 80 million + doses to the middle of November. As for not being published the figures are available on the NHS and UK Government websites down to by Area by Ethnicity by Month if you want them. I downloaded such an XL spreadsheet giving such information.
Can you send a link? Seriously, because I can't find it, but I don't know the UK government websites very well. The dashboard doesn't breakdown by vaccine type. And ourworldindata doesn't collect these stats either.
Sinned wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:02 pm
Other vaccines were recommended for the younger segment of the population. So that refutes your "never delivered in any meaningful quantity" assertion.
NL has received 2.7mln AZ TOTAL to date. That's not a meaningful quantity. It don't matter why they weren't delivered, they just weren't. The reason for limiting its use was because there was no supply. The idea was 60-65yos, but there wasn't even enough for that group. You can't jab what you don't have. As some point the logistics of an extra vaccine type don't weigh up against the benefits.
Sinned wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:02 pm
Stop the Anti-vaxx propsganda.
Let's not exaggerate shall we. The courts have ruled AZ acted in serious bad faith and as far as I'm concerned that's the end of the issue.
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Re: Corona Virus

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crfriend
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by crfriend »

Gusto10 wrote:
Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:46 pm
an interesting documentary:
More "lab escape" and conspiracy theory.

ENOUGH!

Or, shall we just nuke China now and get the whole damned thing over with?
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Sinned
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Re: Corona Virus

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r_k, try https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/s ... cinations/. Official NHS site. Click on any of the links and they lead to spreadsheets with the appropriate data. I didn't have to search far, I just put "covid vaccine usage in uk" in google.

I think that there was the potential for enough AZ vaccine, just a little behind what the UK was getting, and when the supply started to get through the rubbishing by Macron and Merkel had its desired effect and people didn't want it. Not sure how much AZ is being supplied to the EU and whether any of it is being used but as far as I'm concerned they shot themselves in the foot.
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rode_kater
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by rode_kater »

Sinned wrote:
Sat Nov 27, 2021 12:02 am
r_k, try https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/s ... cinations/. Official NHS site. Click on any of the links and they lead to spreadsheets with the appropriate data. I didn't have to search far, I just put "covid vaccine usage in uk" in google.
Thanks, I downloaded several of the spreadsheets there, but as I suspected they don't breakdown how many got which vaccine. I've come to the conclusion that actual vaccine production figures are considered commercially sensitive and so aren't published. They don't publish figures for production sites here either but the vaccines used by the UK would link 1-to-1 to vaccines produced in the UK. There's a company called Airfinity that tries to estimate figures but even they're being cagey about it.
Sinned wrote:
Sat Nov 27, 2021 12:02 am
Not sure how much AZ is being supplied to the EU and whether any of it is being used but as far as I'm concerned they shot themselves in the foot.
That is known, AZ will deliver a total of 200mln by March 2022, after that the contract ends. Meanwhile the EU produced 3bln this year, NL by itself 500mln. Yes, all the AZ vaccines will be given away.
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by Big and Bashful »

Well everyone I know in this here area got AZ. As far as I know the boosters are not AZ, I will find out shortly.
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Sinned
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Re: Corona Virus

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I think the AZ 2 stage immunisation is UK wide as standard for the adult age groups, r_k, so it would be safe to extrapolate the number of AZ shots from that. Yes, the actual numbers are commercially sensitive and this was noted early on in the vaccination programme when probing questions were asked. Rough figures such as 80 million may be given but not exact numbers. Younger age groups, I think, were given a different supplier.

B&B, the booster down here is a different supplier and for us it was Modena.
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by r.m.anderson »

And this just in - another "wack-a-mole" variant:

COVID-19Omicron variant: B.1.1.529
Variant B.1.1.529 was identified in November 2021 in Botswana and South Africa; one case had travelled to Hong Kong,
one confirmed case was identified in Israel in a traveler returning from Malawi,
along with two who returned from South Africa and one from Madagascar.
It is known to have dramatic genetic differences from other variants.

As of Nov. 27, the variant had spread to Europe with cases detected in two people in the United Kingdom,
two in Germany and at least one in Italy, according to health officials in their respective countries.

Public health officials are studying the new variant but its significance for the pandemic is not yet known.
"Preliminary evidence suggests an increased risk of reinfection with this variant,
as compared to other variants of concern," said the World Health Organization on Friday, Nov 26.

The US banned travelers from South Africa and seven nearby countries out of concern over the new variant.

CDC Statement on B.1.1.529 (Omicron)

SARS-CoV-2 Omicron variant (Wikipedia)

So everyone plan for another go around of booster shots (just kidding LOL) - - -
This herd mentality is going to be like lemmings jumping off a cliff - - -
"Kilt-On" -or- as the case may be "Skirt-On" !
WHY ?
Isn't wearing a kilt enough?
Well a skirt will do in a pinch!
Make mine short and don't you dare think of pinching there !
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moonshadow
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Re: Corona Virus

Post by moonshadow »

I read that the current vaccine may not be as effective on this new variant, however Pfizer is already working on adjusting their formula, and hope to have an updated vaccine within a hundred days....
-Moon Shadow
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