Mary Tyler Moore and her pants.

[Grok]

oldsalt1, I am 60 years old. I doubt that I will live to see true mainstream acceptance. At best, a meer tolerance for some eccentrics in unorthodox clothing.

I feel lucky that I lived to see a modest growth in kilting.

What I do hope to see is growth in groups such as skirt cafe.

[oldsalt1]

Unfortunately you may be right about mainstream acceptance . But I expect a little more than meer tolerance.

It may be a weak example but as I mentioned look at men and ear rings. I think that ten years ago a man wearing an ear ring was just as taboo as skirts.

Look at companies like 511 tactical their main market is first responders this is a male oriented supplier and its 511 tactical kilt is a big seller. I hinted for my son to buy me one for Christmas but I thing it was a little over his budget.

There have been a couple of other small companies at least offering unisex skirts. its just going to take one major to push the issue.

hey I may be dreaming but why not

[Grok]

I would like to see some sort of progress, but this may be a niche thing. (As is kilting, which at least had the advantage of already existing).

[Grok]

Instead of MIS going mainstream, perhaps we will see another dynamic.

Imagine a particular skirt as a niche thing.

This is a quote from the book Glock by Paul M. Barrett. Barrett quoted an employee who does PR....

'" ' Glock owners have a kind of brand loyalty that's incredible, because they were pariahs in a way. You know, you own 'the hideous plastic gun'....'"

A superior design was disdained as a piece of junk, because it was ugly and used plastic, and everybody knows that semiautomatics aren't as reliable as revolvers.

The book even has a chapter about Glock Culture and fans of the gun.

In the context of clothing, some of the kilting web sites have a similar feel, with kilting almost a subculture.

[Grok]

oldsalt1, I would refer you to the Wikipedia article for Bloomers (clothing). This may give a hint of the time scale for MIS to truly go mainstream.

On the order of a century.

[oldsalt1]

can't find article do you mean boomer as opposed to blommers

[Grok]

"Bloomers"...B...l...o...o...m...e...r...s Referring to the clothing worn by early Feminists.

[Stevie D]

Like this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloomers_(clothing)

[Pdxfashionpioneer]

Hi Grok,

I think you're missing a couple things in making your comparison. First off, there's the acceleration in the rate of change in all arenas.

Secondly, in the case of bloomers, it was a matter of a patriarchy asserting its authority and protecting its turf. Before they were done, it was ILLEGAL for women to wear pants in public in every state. By the turn of he century activists neutralized that legal constraint. In our case, it is a matter of men acknowledging the equality women have achieved and learning to enjoy the freedom to choose.

[Grok]

I think what's at issue here is in the older days when women donned a pair of trousers in pop culture it was celebrated as an advancement for women in general where as when men don a skirt in pop culture it's considered a joke, degrading, crazy, a gag, etc.

Yes, unfortunately, because of this sort of attitude I do believe that it will be at least a century for MIS to be accepted as part of the mainstream. On this time scale the dinosaurs with outdated ideas will finally reach old age and die.

Perhaps there is one thing I should clarify, how I see the near term.....

I am fairly optimistic-much more optimistic-about a network of iconoclasts doing their own thing, than converting the trousered masses. The masses who must follow the herd.

[Pdxfashionpioneer]

than converting the trousered masses

Good God man! Why in heavens name would we want to do that?! It'd take away half the fun!

[oldsalt1]

oldsalt1, I am 60 years old. I doubt that I will live to see true mainstream acceptance. At best, a meer tolerance for some eccentrics in unorthodox clothing

What I do hope to see is growth in groups such as skirt cafe.

In truth I don't want everybody wearing skirts. To me a part of wearing a skirt is my rebellion against a lifetime of doing whats expected. If everybody wore skirts it would take that away.
But at the same time I don't want to be considered an eccentric wearing unorthodox clothing.

I am trying to find an example of a level of acceptance that I would like to reach but I can't think of anything.

[Grok]

Even if converting the masses was the goal, I do think it would take at least a century for MIS to be accepted as mainstream.

But while this topic has occasionally come up, for me it is just an intellectual exercise.

I would be pleased with a sort of fraternity, or a loose network, of guys who have had a long standing interest in skirts. (As members tend to be)

[Grok]

I have to wonder how members would vote if there was a poll:

"Which would you prefer?"

"1. That men in general embrace skirts, making it mainstream fashion"

"2. That MIS remain a minority interest, I prefer to be nonconformist"

Personally, I would settle for option 2.

[STEVIE]

Grok,
I'd go mainstream.
I blazed the trail for a bit of it.
Are we not all about choice and freedom of that?
Steve.