Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

General discussion of skirt and kilt-based fashion for men, and stuff that goes with skirts and kilts.

Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby Grok » Mon Sep 09, 2019 6:42 pm

One thing I have been wondering about...could the hem of a skirt be designed to fasten to the bottom of the hoop structure? That might result in a full skirt that doesn't blow up in the wind.

Another thing I have wondered about...could such a rig be held up by suspenders (braces)?
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby crfriend » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:03 pm

Grok wrote:One thing I have been wondering about...could the hem of a skirt be designed to fasten to the bottom of the hoop structure? That might result in a full skirt that doesn't blow up in the wind.

That would cause serious problems with the way the garment system would behave -- as a system. It's best to keep skirt and petticoat/crinoline as separate elements; the skirt functioning as an overlay for the "foundation" garment with the ability to move separately from the support-structure. I've never been worried in the slightest that a heavy skirt riding atop a petticoat was going to rise in anything less than a hurricane -- and in a hurricane I'd be having other issues due to the "sail area" in play!
Another thing I have wondered about...could such a rig be held up by suspenders (braces)?

Absolutely it could be, and likely only the under-layer would need to be supported as that will also tend to support the over-layer.

Look at it from the viewpoint of a structural engineer and these things become clear.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby Grok » Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:34 am

denimini wrote:I must say the hoop does display the great colours and patterns on the skirts you are wearing a lot better than if they hung straight down.

The idea does intrigue me; having the fabric held away from one's legs; it. could be just the thing in hot climates, offering sun protection and good ventilation;
So, basically, engineering a microhabitat for the lower half of the body. :idea:
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby crfriend » Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:39 am

Grok wrote:So, basically, engineering a microhabitat for the lower half of the body. :idea:

Yep. That sums it up.

Why do you think that the clothing of desert inhabitants is very roomy and tends to "stand off" a bit?

Hilariously, the big losers in this when it comes to western civilisation are the women. They used to have light floaty summer costume that kept them cool and dry. Today they have tight-fitting costume that keeps them moist and hot. Guys can learn from this,
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:38 pm

BTW, when I was researching this topic I noticed DIY options for hoop rigs.

One concept uses hula hoops. :shock:

I have to give people credit for creative improvisation.
Last edited by Grok on Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby beachlion » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:02 pm

Grok wrote:BTW, when I was researching this topic I noticed DIY options for hoop rigs.

One concept uses hula hoops. :shock:


I would like to see that, somebody using the hula hoop with a skirt hanging from it. I also think TV would be interested. ;)
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:18 pm

beachlion wrote:
I would like to see that, somebody using the hula hoop with a skirt hanging from it. )

The hula hoop version of a Farthingale.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby crfriend » Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:04 pm

Grok wrote:The hula hoop version of a Farthingale.

No. You're operating on ill-conceived and demonstrably incorrect data. The underlying framework was not rigid, but rather semi-rigid -- i.e. "deformable" in engineer-speak. You could push it out of shape and it would rebound on its own. A truly rigid structure like that, and of that sort of size, would be unwearable in practise.

Moonshadow has a skirt with a hoop, and it deforms; I have a petticoat with a (removable) hoop that deforms ,else I'd not be able to drive wearing the thing; and Big&Bashful I believe has one as well, and that may be a multi-hoop or a "cage". We've all written about the experiences of wearing them, and to a one have mentioned the flexibility which one would most certainly not get with a hula-hoop; that'd be an idiotic experiment carried out by someone completely bereft of clue and who would draw all sorts of fallacious conclusions from.

On the materials front: the early ones had the structure constructed from very thin pieces of whalebone which is somewhat pliable; later ones used spring-steel of the sort of ilk as used to make tape-measures; even later designs use assorted plastics, frequently assisted by embedded or moulded-in spring-steel. All are springy, deformable, and return to their original shape when the deforming force is removed.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:21 pm

Ah, good points regarding materials.

I was wondering if some plastics might be good choices, if somewhat deformable, and lighter weight than metal parts.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby crfriend » Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:36 pm

Grok wrote:I was wondering if some plastics might be good choices, if somewhat deformable, and lighter weight than metal parts.

I can't really think of any compelling reason to get more "advanced" when it comes to materials science in this regard as the actual masses involved are quite small. And the structural properties of steel are very, very well understood.

I just hefted the hoop from my petticoat, it's two 7 1/2' lengths of spring-steel encased in nylon, and it weighs in at perhaps an ounce. The fabric in the petticoat proper is somewhere north of two pounds so the difference in overall weight with the hoop in and the hoop out is really impossible to notice.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby beachlion » Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:09 pm

I still remember I had to pump air into the petticoats of my younger sisters in the late 50s with a bicycle pump.

If the hoops were rigid, the diameter would have been limited by the minimal opening of doorways according to the International Building Code. In edition 2018, section 1010.1.1 it is minimal 32" or 41 1/2" if a bed should go through it. ;)
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:17 pm

Yes, width would be an important consideration.

Another consideration would be height.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:32 pm

Deleted-posted to wrong thread.
Last edited by Grok on Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:45 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby crfriend » Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:04 pm

Grok wrote:Yes, width would be an important consideration.

Another consideration would be height.

Standard door-frames are about 7' (84") in height. NBA players have problems with them; I don't, even in heels.

The hoop in my petticoat works out to be about 2.3 feet in diameter -- which will clear most doors. It feels larger than that, and actually is because there's a large mass of netting below the hoop when it's installed, and that does give me grief with narrow doors. Where it's useful to have the hoop deformable is for activities like driving and sitting. Every once in a great while, I'll have to pass between two hard-to-move objects, and that's when I manually adjust the skirt/petticoat assembly to pass through the gap, frequently without even brushing anything. Practise makes perfect in this regard.

Hoops are an acquired taste and aren't for everybody. They demand a lot more attention to motion and location because of the volume they take up horizontally, and they're great for knocking things over if the wearer isn't paying attention (BTDT).

I still get a laugh out of the reaction that the house-cat had to me the first time she saw me wearing the hoop and my long purple skirt. The eyes grew to the size of saucers, her ears went flat back, and her tail fluffed out to the size of a baseball-bat. The poor thing had never seen anything like it and got scared -- and no amount of trying to make peace worked, either, including me sitting on the deck to reduce the overall size effect.
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Re: Tales from the Brotherhood of the Hoop

Postby Freedomforall » Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:30 pm

crfriend wrote:
Grok wrote:Yes, width would be an important consideration.

I still get a laugh out of the reaction that the house-cat had to me the first time she saw me wearing the hoop and my long purple skirt. The eyes grew to the size of saucers, her ears went flat back, and her tail fluffed out to the size of a baseball-bat. The poor thing had never seen anything like it and got scared -- and no amount of trying to make peace worked, either, including me sitting on the deck to reduce the overall size effect.

Carl that is hilarious. I could not imagine wearing one in an antique store or a glassware business. It would be quite comical.
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