skirtcafe.org

This is a pretty mainstream publication.

http://www.ibtimes.com/men-skirts-women ... er-1952772

"Steele said whereas campaigns to have women wearing pants in the 20th century were well-received, there had not really been a comparable campaign for men to wear women's clothes. "If men are the ones who are in power, there’s always going to be a limit to people who want to look like the powerless," said Steele.

I thought this was a pretty good read. I'm also tempted to pick up A Queer History of Fashion: From the Closet to the Catwalk https://www.amazon.com/dp/0300196709/re ... 5vb3F42NX3. I would be interested in becoming more versed in the way fashion has changed with regards to gender.

KasparHauser wrote:I'm also tempted to pick up A Queer History of Fashion: From the Closet to the Catwalk https://www.amazon.com/dp/0300196709/re ... 5vb3F42NX3. I would be interested in becoming more versed in the way fashion has changed with regards to gender.

I would be loath to recommend that volume on the basis of the current usage of the term "queer". If the usage is in line with the original meaning, then I might regard it as a useful volume; however, if the term is used in its modern meaning, then I suspect it'd miss the mark by a wide margin for me as I do not see anything linking homosexuality and external clothing style.

Orientation is one thing; a sense of style is something altogether different. There may be a tangential correlation, but I am fairly certain that correlation is not down to causation in any way.

As far as power goes, women already have plenty -- if not more than men. They just go about acquiring and wielding it differently than men do. Steele definitely gets it wrong on that count.

Back in '07 or so, during a layover in New York City on our way back from Florida one winter's day, my ex- and I visited the New York Public Library (the branch with the stone lions out front) and found an exhibit on men in skirts in progress. It being brutally cold that day, I was wearing trousers, but the exhibit was a good one. I picked up some of the exhibit notes, but those have gone missing at the moment.

I think the description on Amazon does a pretty good job of explaining how the authors intent.which I take is more of the LGBT influence on fashion rather than a linking of sexuality to clothing style. But I haven't read it yet so I'm just going off that Amazon description.

I think the power thing is more about who occupies the seats of power and how that influences fashion rather than power between the sexes more broadly. At least that's my take.

That must have been quite the layover to end up in midtown Manhattan from one of the airports. Sounds like you may have seen "A Rakish History of Men's Wear": http://www.nypl.org/events/exhibitions/ ... -mens-wear. This does look interesting. Pity there doesn't seem to be an exhibition catalogue or anthying. Were you able to take any pictures?

An exhibition I missed at the Met in 2003/4 but which does have an exhibition catalogue available was "Bravehearts: Men in Skirts": http://metmuseum.org/about-the-museum/p ... -in-skirts. 160 page exhibition catalogue here: [url]Bravehearts: Men in Skirts https://www.amazon.com/dp/0810965585/re ... 5vbS2WPWCE
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Lots of good stuff out there and my thanks to whomever originally set up this forum as a place to collect, share, and discuss all of it.

KasparHauser wrote:I think the power thing is more about who occupies the seats of power and how that influences fashion rather than power between the sexes more broadly. At least that's my take.

Power can be illusory, and recall that "behind" most of those who do pull the levers of power lies somebody who could bring any one of those individuals down in an instant with a mere allegation. In that context, where does power really lie?

That must have been quite the layover to end up in midtown Manhattan from one of the airports. Sounds like you may have seen "A Rakish History of Men's Wear": http://www.nypl.org/events/exhibitions/ ... -mens-wear. This does look interesting. Pity there doesn't seem to be an exhibition catalogue or anthying. Were you able to take any pictures?

That exhibition sounds like it, and I didn't have a camera with me at the time, so it's all from memory (which is remarkably good). The trick to the layover was that we were on the train (I can't fly) and the train station is smack dab in the middle of Manhattan (Pennsylvania Station), so it made sense o go exploring. We also spent the night at the Hotel Pennsylvania to make really sure that we'd catch the train back to New England. Those were happier days.

An exhibition I missed at the Met in 2003/4 but which does have an exhibition catalogue available was "Bravehearts: Men in Skirts": http://metmuseum.org/about-the-museum/p ... -in-skirts. 160 page exhibition catalogue here: [url]Bravehearts: Men in Skirts https://www.amazon.com/dp/0810965585/re ... 5vbS2WPWCE[/url]

That was contemporaneous with the "Million Skirted Man March" organised by some of the real pioneers in men's skirt-wearing. Sadly I missed it because I never learned about it until later on.

Lots of good stuff out there and my thanks to whomever originally set up this forum as a place to collect, share, and discuss all of it.

SkirtCafe is a lineal descendent of Tom's Cafe which was set up in the 1990s by the late Tom Manuel, who was one of the organisers of the above march. When Tom died in the mid 2000s, the original Tom's Cafe was to be set up as a memorial, and lots of the original membership moved here along with quite a bit of the content of the original forum. The memorial site sadly never came to pass, but this forum soldiers on and tries to keep the flame alive. So, there's a bit of history here, and some of the original pioneers still drop in and look the old place over from time to time. It's changed some over the years, mainly as the "Master Barista" position changes hands, but we try as much as possible to stay as true as possible to the original intent.

Thanks Carl for telling the history of the old days. I remember Tom's Cafe and attended the Million Skirted Men march, viewed the exhibit at the Met, and got to meet Tom. He was a braveheart but was open minded enough to accept freestylers. The other organizer of the march was someone named Larre or something like that. There was another board at the time run by Kris Grevstad. After Kris gave it up, the board was supposed to continue under new management but it fizzled fast. Kris' board was more open to freestylers while Tom's was more for the bravehearts. It seems that posts were alot more heated in those days, and the flames could be fast and furious. How times have changed. We should have a moment of silence for Tom Manuel who was taken by illness way too early. He was a pioneer in this movement and alot of what we have now would not have been possible without his hard work.

crfriend wrote: Power can be illusory, and recall that "behind" most of those who do pull the levers of power lies somebody who could bring any one of those individuals down in an instant with a mere allegation. In that context, where does power really lie?

Well, one could, and some probably do, have a whole forum just on the topic of power. The question though would seem to center on who has power, how do they dress, and how does that influence what is considered the norm?

That exhibition sounds like it, and I didn't have a camera with me at the time, so it's all from memory (which is remarkably good). The trick to the layover was that we were on the train (I can't fly) and the train station is smack dab in the middle of Manhattan (Pennsylvania Station), so it made sense o go exploring. We also spent the night at the Hotel Pennsylvania to make really sure that we'd catch the train back to New England. Those were happier days.

Ah trains, the civilized way to travel. Makes sense.

SkirtCafe is a lineal descendent of Tom's Cafe which was set up in the 1990s by the late Tom Manuel, who was one of the organisers of the above march. When Tom died in the mid 2000s, the original Tom's Cafe was to be set up as a memorial, and lots of the original membership moved here along with quite a bit of the content of the original forum. The memorial site sadly never came to pass, but this forum soldiers on and tries to keep the flame alive. So, there's a bit of history here, and some of the original pioneers still drop in and look the old place over from time to time. It's changed some over the years, mainly as the "Master Barista" position changes hands, but we try as much as possible to stay as true as possible to the original intent.

Thanks for the background. I appreciate the work you do and everyone has done. Seems like a diverse, respectful group here.