Skirt Cafe is an on-line community dedicated to exploring, promoting and advocating skirts and kilts as a fashion choice for men. We do this in the context of men's fashion freedom --- an expansion of choices beyond those commonly available for men to inc
http://www.skirtcafe.org/forums/
Stu wrote:Orange Apple
I am not saying that everyone among the remaining 98% has each and every psychological and physical characteristic that we see as emblematic of their biological sex. As an example, we see that some lesbian women exhibit preferences, mannerisms and behaviours that we more often associate with males - and they are attracted to women - but they are entirely happy being women. Likewise, some men have characteristics that are more feminine:
I am struggling to see any feminine characteristics in myself. However, I want to see skirts completely de-gendered so that they are as conventional for males as they are for females. .
I'll play!Stevie D wrote: I like this!
Here's how I measure up:
Stevie D = about 70% feminine/30% masculine; penis; small breasts; shoulder-length hair cut in a feminine bob style, coloured mahogany red; facial hair shaved meticulously; quite a lot of body hair but mostly kept shaved/epilated; medium deep voice; slightly competitive sometimes; just about all my clothes are women's, both outer and underwear.
If I fit into any system it would be non-binary/androgynous.
), knows how to be a b!tch, talked my way out of every roadside ticket, hates sports, loves dressing femininely.
j/k! 
It's actually the opposite of that: the transgender person is transforming into something they knew they were all along - BUT - not all people who come under the transgender umbrella feel the need for transition. As with most of these things, 'transgender' covers a wide range of possibilities. For a long time I did not think of myself as transgender, but I have come to realise that I am. I have not changed - but my understanding of 'transgender' has.moonshadow wrote:... for me, "transgender" implies that one is "transforming" into something that he or she wasn't before, with hormones, behavioral changes, etc.
Crossdessing and changing your apparent sex to match your gender (transitioning) are indeed two separate things. If you are transgender you might want to do both - although you may not consider that wearing clothes expressing your true gender (as opposed to your sex) is actually crossdressing. If you are not transgender, you might want to wear a skirt for comfort, fashion, culture, free-thinking, fetishism or even exhibitionism - and none of those can make you transgender, so there is no slippery slope at all.Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:... I still believe for almost everyone there is such a qualitative difference between crossdressing and changing sexes that there isn't such a slippery slope.
At first I thought you were crazy. Then I actually looked it up and I realized you are correct.pelmut wrote:It's actually the opposite of that: the transgender person is transforming into something they knew they were all along - BUT - not all people who come under the transgender umbrella feel the need for transition. As with most of these things, 'transgender' covers a wide range of possibilities.
That's an interesting thought, but the word "decide" gives a false impression of freedom to choose; "recognise" would describe the process better. There is no choice about being transgender, but there is a degree of freedom to choose what to do about it: deny it for as long as possible, transition, commit suicide.moonshadow wrote:Another curiosity I have regarding transgender people who take hormones: If a man decides he is a "woman" inside and goes down the transgender route, he begins to take hormones and his body chemistry becomes that of a woman. That changing of body chemistry changes the very personality of the former "man", and thus the individual that inspired "him" to go down that road to begin with. Who's to say that after all of that estrogen kicks in, "she" doesn't decide one day that "she's" a transgender man and wants to go back to the way things were before?
Regarding the use of the word "decide", I'll hold to my terminology there. Everything is life is a choice. Even if we choose to be our self. Granted, our inner self is what it is and there's no changing that, or choice involved, unless it's by the way of a slow gradual personality shift that I think most people do as they age anyway (some call it getting wiser?) But for one to embrace an "inner self" as in the case of transgender people, well that is a choice. One could always continue being who society wants them to be, but as you said pelmut, often that choice leads to depression and suicide. But then again, if a man transitions into a woman because he believes he will fit in society better as a "she", then is that not still bowing to the will of society? Thus it is important to allow people the "freedom to choose" how they want to live their life.pelmut wrote:That's an interesting thought, but the word "decide" gives a false impression of freedom to choose; "recognise" would describe the process better. There is no choice about being transgender, but there is a degree of freedom to choose what to do about it: deny it for as long as possible, transition, commit suicide.
moonshadow wrote:I hope nobody is getting ill about what I'm writing on this thread. I know it's a very sensitive issue for a lot of people (must be all that estrogen). But really what it all boils down to is women have been acting like men for the better part of five decades at least, and nobody calls them "transgendered". Why all of a sudden if men want to act like women then we must refer to them as trans? I don't know, the double standard just kind of bugs me. Women are allowed to be women regardless of what they do, and are only considered transgender if they say they are, yet this doesn't apply to men? A masculine woman is still considered a woman, and yet a feminine man "has issues". I don't know...... just doesn't seem right.
You were close, Caultron, but the term is actually gender dysphoria, not diaspora, although there may be a bit of spontaneous dispora, like the emergence of mushrooms in a lawn in the late summer, since many "trans-" people are feeling the freedom and the importance of finally living as the gender which they know themselves to be. Dysphoria is a technical term from the DSM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diagnosti ... _Disorders though there is a growing opinion that calling it a psychiatric condition is out-dated thinking, and, like homosexuality, that gender dysphoria should not be regarded as a disorder. However, part of the reason that it's still listed is that when counseling or other therapy is sought, there often has to be a rote diagnosis in order for many health insurance plans to pick up a portion of the cost; presumably that could include some costs associated with physically transitioning, such as hormone therapy, though I am not sure if the ACA includes any coverage of orchiectomy, vaginoplasty, or other related cosmetic "gender-reconciliation" surgical procedures.Caultron wrote:Well, certainly a lot of things have changed in the past five decades. One in particular is that many more people now believe that gender diaspora (male brain in female body, female brain in male body) is real and that it legitimately deserves treatment, even among children.
And part of transitioning to one's true mental gender is obviously to adopt the appearance of that gender, including clothes.
But just wanting to wear a skirt doesn't, at least to me, indicate full-grown gender diaspora. Maybe it's 1% or 5% or whatever gender diasporic (or not) but I don't think just because you want to wear a skirt means you want hormones and surgery and a new full-time sex.
The cases that appear in the media, however, do tend to be full gender diaspora, and that may lead to an incorrect one-to-one association of wearing a skirt and wanting a full sex-change.
But on the good side, any blurring of the 100% male - 100% female dichotomy probably works in our favor.
Sorry, the autocorrect demon strikes again.dillon wrote:You were close, Caultron, but the term is actually gender dysphoria, not diaspora...