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moonshadow wrote: ↑Mon Aug 01, 2022 10:55 am I try not to care what others think. This is easier said than done.

..it matters to me what I am. I would imagine this matters to most people here, otherwise they wouldn't get so bent out of shape by being labels "trans***". What we are and our personal identity with the world is like the fingerprint of our soul, it's what makes us us (individually).

And like I said, I'm still working it out. I have no doubt that I am of the male sex, but I think it's clear that feminity means more to me than most here, so it's not really something I expect many to understand.

But really I don't think that's my path anyway... I don't know what my path is now... like I said.. I'm working it out. I may not ever figure it out, but maybe it's the journey that yields its own rewards...

I hear you. Although I am trying to find a way of accommodating ideas about myself that I have been quietly ignoring or supressing for a long time, I have come across a number of self-descriptions by those who identify as trans, and that certainly isn't me. I'm quite accepting of my maleness, but I just want to push the restrictions and boundaries of stereotype masculinity as far as I can comfortably manage. That is, no doubt, not as far as some people are comfortable with.

Moon Shadow said "I really like femme stuff." I think there is a sort of mirror image of the classic Tomboy. Tomboys-defined here as girls who like boys stuff. Contrasted by the male who likes femme stuff.

by moonshadow » Mon Aug 01, 2022 4:55 am

Faldaguy wrote: ↑Sun Jul 31, 2022 11:07 pm
This seems contrary to most of your other statements about not caring about what others think;

Somedays are better than others, somedays nothing happens at all, but you never know... somedays suck..

Yea, that registers; even when one is comfortable in their own skin, it can be wearing when surrounded by the dunces and malcontents. Hopefully your trip to 'red' NY gave not only some relief but some hope. There are indeed even more comfortable communities.

Faldaguy wrote: ↑Sun Jul 31, 2022 11:07 pm
so why even bother to consider "your place"
Because it matters to me what I am. I would imagine this matters to most people here, otherwise they wouldn't get so bent out of shape by being labels "trans***". What we are and our personal identity with the world is like the fingerprint of our soul, it's what makes us us (individually).

Yes, "fingerprint of our soul" is our 'me' -- but it matters not where that lands on the spectrum of humanity. If others label me incorrectly, that is their failing, not mine. I really do not care if they think I'm gay, trans, or just weird -- they are making erroneous assumptions based on god knows what, (a skirt?) their label does not alter who I am. I suppose in the darkest of evil worries one could fear they would stir up trouble based on such accusations --but for those so inclined, they will anyway; and knowing what and who you are is not going to change that. But your presenting to all you meet as a decent and thoughtful human being will help foster an environment of tolerance. I think maybe the only reliable label for all of us, is "just me".

Pura vida

Grok wrote: ↑Mon Aug 01, 2022 10:16 pm Moon Shadow said "I really like femme stuff." I think there is a sort of mirror image of the classic Tomboy. Tomboys-defined here as girls who like boys stuff. Contrasted by the male who likes femme stuff.

A male who likes femme stuff is a JaneGirl which is the opposite of a TomBoy. The term describes me well.

jamie001 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 2:44 am JaneGirl which is the opposite of a TomBoy.

Just one problem, when good old Joe Public applies these terms to, say a ten year old, one will be in the positive and the other, not.
Would anyone care to hazard a guess?
For that matter, I wonder how a JaneGirl would fare in the playground jungle, easy prey?
If we could lose all the connotations around spurious labels such as these, that indeed, would be progress.
Personally, I am happy with "STUFF", I like, I purchase and will wear.
Regardless, I am still that same "grizzled old dude", if anyone else applies anything else, that is not my concern.
Just too busy living I guess!
Steve.

When I was growing up, if there was a boyish girl she was called a Tomboy. If there was a girlish boy he was called a sissy.

Ask me how I know...

moonshadow wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 10:38 am When I was growing up, if there was a boyish girl she was called a Tomboy. If there was a girlish boy he was called a sissy.

Ask me how I know...

Heck - I just watched a Netflix movie - released in 2022 - The Gray Man - and the main / bad character says to his henchmen:

All right, ladies, focus.

I get it - "ladies" are prim, proper, kind, caring - the opposite of what the bad guys are... but I wondered for a moment - was this said as a pejorative? Another example of subtle clues where we subconsciously reinforce those stereotypes. Does this upset me? Not really - it is what it is, just another example of the uphill battle we have to "fight".

Moon, I would never accuse you of being trans. You like feminine stuff and so do I. Sometimes everything I wear comes from the other side. So what? My wife accuses me of wearing too much women's stuff. She knows a man who wears feminine stuff and she gets given some of his castoffs and she accuses me of being like him. Some stuff I keep, some I pass on. The latest was 3 diaphanous tops, 1 green, 2 pink. Very see-through and ultra feminine. Not sure yet if I'll keep them. Not even sure if SD could pull off the look.