skirtcafe.org

Hello there, again everyone and nice to meet you Bri and Since1982 !

Yes, I really do think that you've got something special going on at your local college and church, sapphire. It's such a wonderful thing for people from different backgrounds and cultures to live side-by-side in harmony like that. This can also be an amazing learning experience for all those concerned. We can all learn so much from each other and broaden our horizons this way. Refreshing to hear about positive things going on...I'm sure Martin Luther King Jr would be very, very proud!

Spot on, Bri! We hear too many times, companies and organisations making the excuse that they are 'only' trying to foster a professional image by imposing strict and divise gendered dress codes. Just what has stopping men from wearing skirts and women from wearing trousers got to do with being professional?! And, as you so crucially pointed out; those companies who are so hostile to their employees being 'different' and 'individuals' are likely to be the ones that are bereft of innovation and iinvention. As a result of such stunted attitudes and thought processes, these bigoted firms and organisations are hardly likely to be the ones going places, are they?

Since1982: It's great to read that Skirtcafe has given you the confidence to wear the things that you want to wear whenever you wish (as much as is possible) to wear them. So, this site has truly empowered you then! That's excellent!

Well...you've all given me such a warm welcome, everyone - much warmer than, for example, this place below, where I dropped by the other day:

http://charliegrrl.wordpress.com/2007/1 ... m-freebie/

Anyway...I'd like to say a big thank you to everyone for being so friendly, for sharing your experiences and perspectives and also for taking time out to look at, and provide feedback to my website.

Cheers!

3genders

I have read the links and I think you have to allow for the fact that charliegrrl is probably an adolescent university student who does not yet have the life experience to understand and be tolerant of transgender, and therefore not take this personally. When my girlfriend went off with a transgender person, for years I was very bitter against gays and transgenders, a trend which I saw as a serious threat to natural procreation of the human species. It was only many years later, once I started wearing kilts, an activity which brought me into contact with gays and transgenders who shared that similar interest, that I began to understand that they are all ordinary people with the same hopes and fears as myself, whose needs may differ in certain respects, but that otherwise we had much in common and I like to think I have mellowed and become much more tolerant and understanding.

[Soapbox mode]

If you have looked at the website linked by David / Katie (3genders) above, you may have noticed that there is a button on the site labelled "Wanna sign my petition?". The petition in question is in the electronic petitions area of the UK Prime Minister's website.

As has been discussed on the forum previously, this is a web space that has been made available for UK citizens and residents to raise issues that they feel have, or should have, public support. Once a petition has been put on the site, UK citizens and residents may add their names to show their support. The site rules require a government response to any petition that gathers more than 200 signatures. In practise the reply will almost certainly be put together by a civil servant and I suspect that few are brought to the attention of the PM unless they gather far more than a couple of hundred signatures. However, just persuading someone on the staff of Number 10 Downing Street to consider the issue of gender for a while can't be harmful and may actually help to raise gender awareness issues around the seat of UK power, which can't be a bad thing.

The petition reads:

We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to legally recognize a third gender.

And has the following additional notes:

Our 'ladies & gents' society allows no space for a third gender - yet gender variant people do exist.

UK law, including the 1975 Sex Discrimination Act, only recognizes & legislates for women & men - deemed equal, but different. Thus a transsexual is afforded protection under UK law only if s/he is about to have, is having, or has already had gender reassignment surgery (a 'sex-change') to become either a man or a woman.

However, not every transgender person has gender reassignment surgery. Many can't undergo such a challenging series of operations because their health isn't up to it. Others don't want surgery & some just can't make that irreversible decision. Some transpeople define themselves as neither male nor female.

Importantly, gender dysphoria can still hurt. A two-gendered society that imposes a masculine or feminine gender identity upon us in spite of this is cruel & stupid.

Legal third gender recognition would hopefully lead to transgender-friendly public toilets, third gender tick boxes on forms & a legal obligation for employers/education authorities to make their dress codes/uniforms gender-flexible & non-sexist.

Let's put transgender on the agenda!

To date the petition has gathered 174 signatures, still 26 short of the threshold to require a response. If you feel that the two gender model in UK law should be replaced with a recognition that there are more than two genders, please add your name to the petition before 3 April 2008 (the closing date).

The petition may be found here.

I know there are forum members here who regard themselves as not being at either extreme of the gender spectrum and I have personally learned a lot from some of the well considered posts that have appeared here on the subject of gender. If you are not traditionally gendered or believe in fairness for all mankind please consider signing this petition.

Thanks.

[/Soapbox mode]

Have fun,


Ian.

I've added my signature, its the very least I can do towards making amends for all the intolerance I showed over many years towards anybody who wasn't clearly heterosexual male or female.

Hello again, everyone !

Many thanks for all the feedback folks and to you, Milfmog, for being so kind as to post some info about, and a link to the third gender petition. That was a very pleasant surprise for me ! Thank you to all who have signed it...Last count...only 22 more signatures to get now before we arrive at the 200 figure - which means that the government will be obliged to issue an email response to every signatory which will tell us whether or not they are going to accomodate any of the suggestions proposed.

I realise, of course, that many people here are not transgendered, but I would like to think that if, at least, some laws were passed to prevent employers, organisations and schools from having the power to compel employees and students to conform to gendered dress codes, then this would benefit everyone - male, female or otherwise gendered etc. Unfortunately, there's no shortage of those who laugh at the very idea of there being people who don't really feel completely male or female and those people who laugh at us for identifying as a kind of third gender, are usually the same people who also laugh at men who wear skirts etc. I think that although we may be challenging gendered dress code tyranny for different reasons it's so positive that we can find some common ground here. I think that the more of us who challenge the 'status quo' in these matters - the better, because the more of us there are; the more the mocking laughter is going to die down and that's when the 'mainstream' (whatever that is) will start to listen to us and begin to take us seriously.

Those who think 'outside the box' are often greeted with suspicion and disbelief at first. Being a pioneer of anything is always gonna be tough But by persevering we may well get there with the desirable end result being beneficial to society as a whole. New ideas and those who dare to propose them are always met with scorn at first. Just look at the trouble women like Amelia Bloomer and the Dress Refom League encountered back in the mid-nineteenth century when they wanted to reform female dress codes. Now you don't have to wear a crinoline anymore...unless, of course, you choose to do so...but, importantly, the accent is on the word 'choice'!

So...yeah - let's all keep going on even when we feel so many people are laughing at us!!!

Oh...sorry I've gone on a bit. Waffling again !

Thank you, Cessna152towser for following the link about my encounter with charliegrrl. I've done a little searching on the Net and I discovered that her blog and activities were featured in a Guardian report last year which appears on the Guardian Unlimited website. Apparently, she is a Lancaster University Graduate in her late twenties/early thirties who attracted a lot of media attention a few years ago by staging a protest carrying around a life-size inflatable doll of former PM, Tony Blair ! And she thinks I'm weird !?

Thanks for kindly following this through with me and thank you for sharing your life journey with me, too. You must have gone through such a difficult time when your girlfriend left you - you must have felt such pain. Not many people have the bravery to be as honest and critical of themselves as you, Cessna. Let's face it; we're learning all the time. I look back at the way I was even a few day's ago and cringe !

Oh well...sorry for going on so much. All the very best to you all and thank you for being so welcoming and supportive. It's gonna be great here !!!

Big hugs
3genders

3genders petition about recognising that there are more than the two traditionally acknowledged genders has now attracted a total of 181 signatures. I would urge any UK residents to sign this, if only in the interests of equality for all residents of these fair isles. The petition may be found here.

Thanks and have fun,


Ian.

The signature count on 3genders petition now stands at 230 so Mr Brown, or one of his minions, will have to compose a response to it.

The petition closes tomorrow ( 3 April '08 ) so if you have not yet signed it and want to this is your last chance to add your weight.

Have fun,


Ian.