skirtcafe.org

I see little reason why the average male would care about what he wears, beyond being (barely) presentable.

Because of the sheer dullness, if not down right drabness, of male attire. Even formal wear tends to be quite dull.

In which case, clothing is little more than something to cover your nakedness.

Grok wrote:Because of the sheer dullness, if not down right drabness, of male attire. Even formal wear tends to be quite dull.

The only exception to that seems to be in tailoring at the very high end of the scale, and that's done as a (subtle) display of power and devil-may-care wealth. Although, recently, some brilliantly-coloured dress shirts have shown up in some mainline US stores (JC Penney, for instance). I don't know if they're still available as I haven't looked in a few months.

In which case, clothing is little more than something to cover your nakedness.

That's largely what it's beginning to come to for women as well, although their stuff is frequently worn skin-tight which, on the typical US figure is hardly attractive.

I noticed that some people who post to City Data (the fashion forum) are interested in revivals of long ago designs-if these offered style or even elegance. There may be a latent hunger out there for something other than drab casual wear.

Hi Orange Apple, it's my observation as well that fewer women seemed to wear skirts, though that may be bouncing back. Part of the reason may be simple demographics. Baby boomers are getting old enough that the women of that generation don't feel attractive in skirts anymore. I base that last on some of the comments women at church have given me on my outfits and my legs.

Hi Grok, I don't know where you live, but last Summer at least once a week I'd see a man in a skirt (no, not the same one each time) in downtown Portland, OR. It seemed to be an attempt to beat the heat because as it cooled off, they disappeared. So I feel there's an undercurrent there somewhere.

I have done informal surveys at the store where I work and typically in a full shift I would see less than 20 women in skirts or dresses and in really cold weather probably only half that. And this is in a store that sells household goods that would appeal more to women than men. Of course during summer the number of women wearing skirts or a short dress would increase. I think that it's time to start my surveys again. I'll report back as and when results come in.

crfriend wrote:

Grok wrote: Even formal wear tends to be quite dull.

The only exception to that seems to be in tailoring at the very high end of the scale, and that's done as a (subtle) display of power and devil-may-care wealth.

.

Outfits that are somewhat interesting? Among the few exceptions:

1. Military dress uniforms

2. Traditional kilts worn as formal wear, with the associated regalia.

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:Hi Orange Apple, it's my observation as well that fewer women seemed to wear skirts, though that may be bouncing back.

Hi Grok, I don't know where you live, but last Summer at least once a week I'd see a man in a skirt (no, not the same one each time) in downtown Portland, OR. It seemed to be an attempt to beat the heat because as it cooled off, they disappeared. So I feel there's an undercurrent there somewhere.

Seattle. And during the hottest days of summer, I find that wearing shorts provides highly effective insulation for the crotch, resulting in sweaty underwear. If I wear a utilikilt, however, that problem goes away.

Of course, physical comfort goes far in explaining why people will wear open ended garments during the summer, at least for men. (And during those hottest days I notice a surge of women in skirts/dresses). And of course, having a wedge of cloth in your crotch is not exactly the most comfortable thing at any time of the year.

Come to think of it, physical comfort is not really discussed by the general public. The average Western male will not have had the experience of wearing an open ended garment (except maybe a bath robe), so he won't know what he is missing out on.

crfriend wrote:

Grok wrote:Actually, the concept of a unisex skirt is still probably too much of a novelty for the general public

This is especially the case given that the term "unisex" has always historically meant women appropriating men's styles. Attempting to apply it to men causes much cognitive dissonance.

I had a house mate who was surprised when he first came across me wearing a utilitkilt.

One day he and his sister went shopping for clothes-they presented me with plaid stockings. It seems that they thought I was wearing a utilikilt as a Scottish heritage thing. Actually, these garments are too new (even if inspired by traditional kilts) to be part of anyone's traditions. No, I wasn't wearing a utilikilt as a heritage thing, I was wearing it for physical comfort. I think I caused a bit of cognitive dissonance there, but my house mate probably resolved that with the heritage assumption. Therefore, he was helping me do the heritage thing with the gift of plaid stockings.

crfriend wrote:

Grok wrote:Actually, the concept of a unisex skirt is still probably too much of a novelty for the general public

This is especially the case given that the term "unisex" has always historically meant women appropriating men's styles. Attempting to apply it to men causes much cognitive dissonance.

Good!

Grok wrote: Seattle. And during the hottest days of summer, I find that wearing shorts provides highly effective insulation for the crotch, resulting in sweaty underwear. If I wear a utilikilt, however, that problem goes away.

Of course, physical comfort goes far in explaining why people will wear open ended garments during the summer, at least for men. (And during those hottest days I notice a surge of women in skirts/dresses). And of course, having a wedge of cloth in your crotch is not exactly the most comfortable thing at any time of the year.

Come to think of it, physical comfort is not really discussed by the general public. The average Western male will not have had the experience of wearing an open ended garment (except maybe a bath robe), so he won't know what he is missing out on.

Howdy, neighbor! Was actually in your city part of the afternoon today. Will be over there tomorrow and Sunday as well.

Heck, even today would've been warm enough to make my privates area too warm if I was in shorts. It was, what, 68-70 during the warmest part of the day?

Yes, and most of them will laugh at what we say, thinking that we're nuts to think that. Even my father is that way. Will he ever try something without an inseam? No. He's too set in his ways, being 81 years old. I think the last time he wore shorts was sometime in the early '90s. Ever since then, it's either jeans, dockers, or the massively itchy worsted wool dress trousers worn with a business suit.

Provided your UK was solid color or denim, etc, the argyle socks would look fine. For that matter, they work well with my nightwatch camo UK.

-J

Hello Kilted John.

A few years ago I donated a ton of clothes, including the stockings.


BTW, I did get laughed at one toasty summer day, while wearing a Utilikilt. Laughed at by ( what appeared to be) a teen age boy. Laughing at my "skirt", as he called it. From a moving car.


No, we aren't crazy for appreciating the physical comfort. (We may be crazy for other reasons, but thats a different issue )

skirtingtheissue wrote:

dillon wrote:....

However I think the other movement, the Freestyle Fashion Movement, occupant of this portion of the Café, is also a valid evolutionary path for society. Its aficionados in these pages are clearly enjoying pushing the feminine envelope (AS MEN) and celebrating being able to wear whatever they want. But this movement will meet more resistance.

------Henry

I suspect that, for the foreseeable future, this will be an interest embraced by a certain breed of iconoclast.

Its hard to imagine the average male trying kilts, let alone something more daring.

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:Hi Orange Apple, it's my observation as well that fewer women seemed to wear skirts, though that may be bouncing back. Part of the reason may be simple demographics. Baby boomers are getting old enough that the women of that generation don't feel attractive in skirts anymore. I base that last on some of the comments women at church have given me on my outfits and my legs.

It occurs to me that the very reason that we wear skirts is the reason that women don't want to.

Most of us wear skirts because they are comfortable. That's not the only reason, of course, but it's a contributing factor.

The same societal norm that dictates that men don't wear skirts preocribes that when women wear a skirt they're expected to wear hose and shave their legs (especially here in the US). Panty hose are uncomfortable in the same heat that motivates us to wear a skirt to keep cool. Plus women are under pressure to wear restrictive undergarments to squish down any extra flab to make them look slim. The bottom line is that I can certainly understand the move from a skirt/dress to a pantsuit when that was possible due to lifting the restriction on formal dress.

Brings to mind a story. I started working for a very conservative bank in the 1970s. We were very pleased when the bank liberalized the dress code - we were allowed to remove our suit coat while sitting at our desk. If we got up, even to go to the bathroom, we were expected to immediately don the coat. Women were expected to wear a dress/skirt with hose, and heels. Things have changed a lot, although I think that at this bank anyone who has customer contact still is expected to wear a suit.

Orange Apple wrote:The same societal norm that dictates that men don't wear skirts preocribes that when women wear a skirt they're expected to wear hose and shave their legs (especially here in the US).

Here in SF it is so rare to see a skirted woman in stockings (not tights/leggings) that it is a novelty.

There is a certain irony in the idea that we (male iconoclasts) have had more positive experiences with skirts than women.