Stu wrote:I have been posting on here pretty much since this board started as Tom's Cafe - close to two decades ago, now. How much progress have we made since then? Hardly any. I made the same points back then as I am making now. People back then were saying pretty much the same as you are saying now. So there was no unified movement which a coherent narrative - and no progress has been made.
Indeed, and I have great respect for you for having been at it for this length of time -- and it's times like these that I really wish more of what I call "The Pioneers" would actually chime up. Another one lives about 60 miles to the north of me who lurks here, and it's to my shame that I cannot call his name up at this instant. I a very real sense, blokes like me do stand upon the shoulders of giants, because in the early 1990s -- the absolute height of yuppiedom and the "greed is good" mentality -- it would have been absolutely unthinkable that I might do anything other than toe the line in the Uniform.
Today, however, I really believe we have seen a softening of the facade. Twenty years ago wearing anything other than trousers would have been a good way to get the stuffing kicked out of one, at least in the parts where I live, and the level of vitriol that would have been directed at one who dared defy Convention would have been withering. I now routinely wear my non-trousered rigs out and about in public; I wear them to work; I wear them in the "Big City" to my east and to the smaller ones to my south. And I wear them without fear -- fear that would have been very present two decades ago. Is this progress? Or am I just the modern version of the village idiot? My belief is that for however bad everything else may be, minds -- specifically the "herd mind" -- is more open than it was not all that long ago.
I am advocating a movement which has a far more limited goal to begin with - an aim which I am sure you would find far too narrow.
The impression I get is that you have -- and I mean absolutely no disrespect by this -- the laser-like focus of a general whose sole mission, possibly in life, is to take "that hill over there". This is laudable in many circumstances, but I believe that times may have changed under us: I share the same focus on other things in my life, and I realise that I am fighting a rear-guard action in those because the world has moved on.
Yes, we would have to arbitrarily decide what is and is not "masculine", but that would be a starting point only and, once we had achieved some progress, we could push the barriers back further be re-defining and extending what is "masculine".
I am well aware of the power of language, and you have likely read me on the topic a number of times hereon; however, I believe that "masculinity" is vastly more powerful -- and visible -- in the behaviours we adopt and the way we interact with the world around us than what we happen to be clothed in at the moment. Even male nudists can be "masculine" or "feminine", and the same principle applies once we put the veneer of fabric over our hides -- and it's pretty easily spotted. This is not to say that a powerful dissonance can be created by "piling on" western-traditional-"feminine" articles of clothing (e.g. extreme heels) -- it certainly can, and it can mask the wearer's intent in subtle and very subjective ways.
At present, there is no strategy, and men who wear skirts are regarded at best as oddballs and, at worst, are mocked.
I have been called vastly worse than an "oddball" for views I have held in the past (computer security and SCADA systems come to mind) and I got mocked pretty well in the schoolyard because I was just plain "different" (tall, blisteringly smart, and with a very short fuze for bullsh*t). So, "been there, done that"; it's not necessarily fun, but it's surviveable, especially if one takes into account the source.
For us, the breakthrough is to find ONE unbifurcated garment which is commonly worn by males of all ages, is marketed for men and is widely available in our clothing stores. Without that breakthrough, we are going precisely nowhere.
As far as the gay rights argument goes, I think that's a canard; only in the most backward and ignorant areas -- and they do exist, mind -- were there legal prohibitions on blokes wearing skirted garments (else things like bathrobes would have been forbidden). There are loose parallels, but that's really it. Settling on "ONE unbirfucated garment" is merely setting the stage for a variant on uniform; that's a laudable first step, but I rather suspect it'd stall right there (if it ever got that far) because the vast majority of guys
just don't care -- they're happy with Levis and Dockers, and that's what covers then and makes them happy. From that perspective, I rather suspect we're banging on a door that won't lead anywhere.
In short, swapping Levis for a denim skirt sounds easy, but I do not really think it has the power to make the observer go, "Wow! That looks is amazing. I wonder how he pulls it off. Could I?" There are likely only a tiny number of guys who can elicit such a response, and I am probably not in those ranks; at least I try not to look like a "slacker" (any more).
