When will men wear women's clothing...

Discussion of fashion elements and looks that are traditionally considered somewhat "femme" but are presented in a masculine context. This is NOT about transvestism or crossdressing.

Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby jamodu » Tue May 15, 2018 10:41 am

I might be in the minority, but discussions on 'being a Woman trapped in a Man's body' surely goes against and beyond the site's policy in not discussing transvestism and crossdressing. Likewise, the site's clarification on freestyle fashion is that it is relative to the wearing of skirts in a masculine fashion - and not in discussing pre-surgery transsexuals. I suggest that other sites are more appropriate for such discussions.

Many of us at some time or another have faced the wrath of our Wives/Girlfriends who falsely believe that our interest in wearing clothes from the other side of the isle is a forewarning of the possibility/likelihood of future sex-change.

Such talk of being a Woman trapped in a Man's body would confirm the fears of our Wives/Girlfriends, and would firmly shut the door on our discussing even the possibility of us wearing Skirts. It would seal the notion of Men wearing Skirts and Dresses as a taboo subject.

Personally, I frequent this site because I like to wear Skirts and Dresses as a Man's alternative clothing choice - a freestyle clothing choice. In an ideal world, all Men, like Women, would have equal access to any clothing of their choice. Let us not derail this ideal by inappropriate discussion.
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby crfriend » Tue May 15, 2018 11:39 am

jamodu wrote:I might be in the minority, but discussions on 'being a Woman trapped in a Man's body' surely goes against and beyond the site's policy in not discussing transvestism and crossdressing. Likewise, the site's clarification on freestyle fashion is that it is relative to the wearing of skirts in a masculine fashion - and not in discussing pre-surgery transsexuals. I suggest that other sites are more appropriate for such discussions.

That depends entirely on context. There are folks who are truly transgendered and who should be treated with the courtesy and respect that all of us deserve to be treated with. So, in that context it's OK. Claiming that in a disingenuous manner so as to "justify" or "get away with" "wearing women's clothing" isn't. The main thrust here is to get skirts accepted as everyday attire options for men -- to "de-gender" the skirt. Unfortunately, it would seem that the average male psyche is so frail that it can't (or won't) get a grip on the notion that a skirt is merely an article of clothing and "seeks justification" to wear one in all manner of ways.

If the poster really feels the way he says we have to take his word on the matter. It'll be down to he and his partner as to what to do going forward.
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby Grok » Tue May 15, 2018 2:52 pm

jamodu wrote:Many of us at some time or another have faced the wrath of our Wives/Girlfriends who falsely believe that our interest in wearing clothes from the other side of the isle is a forewarning of the possibility/likelihood of future sex-change.
When the poor fellow may merely want to wear one pipe, and borrowing from the other side is one of the only options.
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby pelmut » Tue May 15, 2018 3:56 pm

jamodu wrote:Many of us at some time or another have faced the wrath of our Wives/Girlfriends who falsely believe that our interest in wearing clothes from the other side of the isle is a forewarning of the possibility/likelihood of future sex-change.

Educating the wives/girlfriends is the answer to that.
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby crfriend » Tue May 15, 2018 8:26 pm

pelmut wrote:Educating the wives/girlfriends is the answer to that.

Sometimes it's not so easy; many will be resistant to being educated. Recall that they have their own preconceived notions of things and may be hesitant to let go of them.

I suspect the number of men who actually go on to transition is very small, so there's not really a lot in there to get rationally worried about on the part of our female SOs -- but recall that this isn't a rational situation. I'm glad that my late ex- still hadn't lost her mind when I started wearing skirts and getting interested in style choices. If I'd waited a few more years the situation would probably have been very, very, different.

But, it must hit like a ton of bricks when somebody's SO finds out the guy she thought she was in love with is actually somebody else. That's where the pain -- and the fear -- lies.
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby pelmut » Tue May 15, 2018 8:35 pm

crfriend wrote:... it must hit like a ton of bricks when somebody's SO finds out the guy she thought she was in love with is actually somebody else. That's where the pain -- and the fear -- lies.

It is a terrible marriage-breaker, although some do survive it. Worse still is when the husband has only just realised it himself and is then battered with accusations of lying to his wife for years. If the children can be told before the furious wife has had time to poison their minds, they are usually the most accepting.
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby Grok » Thu May 17, 2018 3:58 pm

mishawakaskirt wrote:I personally don't want to wear women's clothes, but since nearly no one makes men's skirts, or if they do they charge a ridiculous amount. We are stuck with kilts or shopping across the aisle.


Other conceivable options:

1. Sewing-creating your own garment from scratch, or converting one garment into another. (Or finding a seamstress/tailor to do this for you).

2. A design intended for both men and women. Skirtcraft seems to have pulled this off, on a minuscule scale, through crowd funding. This general strategy seems to be just barely viable. Very much a (tiny) niche.

3. Import traditional, Male Unbifurcated Garments from non-Western cultures. I noticed an effort to market the kikoy-African version of a sarong-but this seems to have abandoned, though not the effort to sell products to women. It may be that Westerners don't view such garments as legitimate, even if they are (somebody else's) mens wear.

4. The possibility that a few imported designs might exist in a sort of limbo, neither completely accepted nor completely rejected by Western society. The most likely garment would be the sarong-being basically a rectangle of cloth, these might be easily improvised. Conceivably this category might also include caftans.

I see new, commercially viable MUGs as being a distant possibility. There seems to be a high attrition rate for companies that try to sell new, non-kilt designs. Trying to market a new MUG runs into the chicken or egg problem. To keep costs down you need mass production. But for mass production you need a sizable demand. And "Trousers Tyranny" and gender policing have suppressed demand.
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby Grok » Thu May 17, 2018 7:22 pm

One other conceivable option that I thought of.

5. Import traditional, female unbifurcated garments from non-Western cultures.
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby weeladdie18 » Thu May 17, 2018 8:23 pm

The Kilt is a garment designed to be worn by the Male.....So what is the name of the garment which the Male wears when he does not wish to wear a wrap over pleated Kilt ? For example .....what is the name of the tartan garment which a Male may wish to wear which has no pleats ?

As far as I am aware this is the stumbling block in the English Language. There is no historical word which the male may use if he wishes to name the garment he is wearing which is a style of garment which the male does not traditionally wear. Do we cross the fashion description Isle and say we are wearing a man's skirt or do we try to invent or procure a 'new ' word in the English Language ?

......perhaps this is the dilemma which we face........................weeladdie
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby weeladdie18 » Thu May 17, 2018 8:43 pm

In my daily travels I wear a skirt.....On the average day I will probably only see two or three females wearing skirts. ....I could say this shows my market research for the current fashionable wearing of skirts....... In some regions or in some climates the figures may be different.

Unless there is some new statistical fashion trend these figures will not change

.................. weeladdie
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby crfriend » Thu May 17, 2018 9:28 pm

weeladdie18 wrote:The Kilt is a garment designed to be worn by the Male.....So what is the name of the garment which the Male wears when he does not wish to wear a wrap over pleated Kilt ? For example .....what is the name of the tartan garment which a Male may wish to wear which has no pleats ?

That'd be a skirt, unless it's one of the various specialised culture-specific types, e.g. sarongs, sulus, or the like.

There is precisely nothing "feminine" about the word "skirt"; recall that rockets have skirts, and it's difficult to get much more phallic than that.

Unless there is some new statistical fashion trend these figures will not change.

Or, just maybe, guys learn to get over their insecurities about the notion. What one wears does not define the character of the wearer.
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Re: Terminology Explained

Postby Grok » Fri May 18, 2018 12:00 am

A Male Unbifurcated Garment is a MUG.

A Female Unbifurcated Garment would be a FUG.

A unisex skirt-designed for both men and women-would a Bigender Unbifurcated Garment, or BUG.
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Re: Terminology Explained

Postby crfriend » Fri May 18, 2018 12:26 am

Grok wrote:A Male Unbifurcated Garment is a MUG.

A Female Unbifurcated Garment would be a FUG.

A unisex skirt-designed for both men and women-would a Bigender Unbifurcated Garment, or BUG.

That's clearly a forced usage and will get picked up on instantly by a listener. Don't try to mask what the garment is. It's a skirt. Full stop. Calling it anything else -- unless the design has unmistakable "brand recognition" -- is going to make the individual calling it so look like an idiot. Clothing has no gender.

A bisexual garment? Really?
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby Grok » Fri May 18, 2018 12:36 am

I wasn't being serious in my last post. I thought that "FUG",and especially "BUG", sounded amusing. :mrgreen:
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Re: When will men wear women's clothing...

Postby Jim » Fri May 18, 2018 1:02 am

Words are continually changing their meaning. We might just encourage the mistake many of us have run into. If a man wears a skirt, it's a "kilt".
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