Need advice in Nebraska.

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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby crfriend » Wed Sep 23, 2015 10:29 pm

dpinNE wrote:crfriend: What do you mean "do" it? I have some ideas what you might mean but I don't want to assume.

In this context, my assertion was that you should just simply wear a skirt or kilt instead of talking about it. Actions, after all, speak vastly louder than words and action is widely viewed as a masculine response to things. Beware, however, that approach will bring things to a head very quickly; let your own instincts guide you, but always be true to who you are.
crfriend wrote:But, are you ready for the consequences if she decides that her selfish sense of "security" is more important than the relationship -- or you?

That I'm pretty sure isn't going to be a problem (she even said that she doesn't want to separate) but this is very early in the game and we haven't said anything more about it since the weekend.

My comment was a way of prepping you for the "worst-case scenario". The old adage, "Hope for the best - plan for the worst." is applicable in situations like these where the outcome is a real crap-shoot and unable to be discerned from a distance. If we were dealing in the purely rational world here, the answer would be pretty obvious; unfortunately, we're most assuredly not because the woman's emotions frequently run amok and cloud the reality. I may be a bit gun-shy here, but the fact that she mentioned that "she doesn't want to separate" means that she's thought of it already which gives one pause for reflection regarding how her emotions are seeing things.
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby dillon » Thu Sep 24, 2015 12:33 am

dpinNE wrote:I have no plans at all to contact him or any one else. She maybe was thinking that me wearing a skirt was somehow a psychiatric problem and that he could help. One of those things said in the heat of the moment.


A competent psychologist would consel both you and your wife. You, to identify if you have a significant gender dysphoria, and her because she is the one really having the issues. You have no angst with your own feelings and desires, which is healthy. She is the one who seems unable to adjust.
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby moonshadow » Thu Sep 24, 2015 5:00 am

*sighs*

This thread is difficult for me to read. Not for grammar, or such, but it's just tough to read the stories. The whole ordeal get's me in a ranting mood about the double standards of society, but alas, I will refrain.

I just attempted to write my thoughts on it, and guess what, I worked myself into one heck of a rant anyway, so I deleted it.

I will close with one final comment.... God help you. You're a better man than me. I think I would have a certain someone to kiss my.... Moon.... no ranting!

I gotta go to bed.

Edit... kiss my.... Moon... LOL unintentional pun I promise!
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby crfriend » Thu Sep 24, 2015 9:29 am

moonshadow wrote:I just attempted to write my thoughts on it, and guess what, I worked myself into one heck of a rant anyway, so I deleted it.

Isn't it interesting how that happens? I've found myself composing a few pieces on this particular thread which I've decided not to publish simply because they might be viewed as incendiary at worst or not particularly PC (Politically Correct) at best.

Double standards are a corrosive thing because they arbitrarily confer automatic and absolute disadvantage to one while at the same time conferring advantage to another. This results in the advantaged side trying to keep them in place and the disadvantaged trying to knock them down -- and the conflict that results. We run into the double-standard of what's "acceptable" wear in so-called Western society -- perceive ourselves disadvantaged by it -- and chafe at it. That's minor; I assure you it goes much deeper than that.

Really the only advice I can offer to anyone is to follow what their heart and their mind say their path should be. Ideally that path should only intersect with others' paths in positive ways, but when push comes to shove one needs to follow that path because to get too far off it means losing one's way in life. Note that new paths can emerge over time -- sometimes in unexpected ways; however, over time, one's character remains surprisingly constant. When new paths appear, explore them; however, let your character make the decision as to which to follow -- and sometimes it's not the most appealing one that's the "best".

Best of luck with your soul-searching and explorations. Work the problem with heart and mind functioning as a team and with the power of your convictions as a guide; that's a hard combination to beat. Whatever happens, it'll probably work out for the best in the end.
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby moonshadow » Thu Sep 24, 2015 1:49 pm

Its tough.... I have to admit, I caught myself actually angry for the poor fellow. Sometimes my Italian blood gets the best of me.
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby dpinNE » Thu Sep 24, 2015 9:19 pm

dpinNE wrote:
crfriend: What do you mean "do" it? I have some ideas what you might mean but I don't want to assume.

In this context, my assertion was that you should just simply wear a skirt or kilt instead of talking about it. Actions, after all, speak vastly louder than words and action is widely viewed as a masculine response to things. Beware, however, that approach will bring things to a head very quickly; let your own instincts guide you, but always be true to who you are.


That is what I thought you might have meant. Love the idea but I have kids that don't know anything about it. And remember they can't be told about it. It's rare that there are no kids around but occasionally it does happen. I have brought this up before: How to let them know? Tell them, let one "catch" me wearing one, etc. I have one on now and my oldest could come home from school at any moment and I'm not anywhere near to where I can change quickly. I think getting caught is the best one. I have always wanted to not change out of my skirt and go get the other kids from school. I have to wonder if they would notice (probably) when they get into my vehicle what I had on. That won't happen until they know about it. :(

Thanks all for your responses. It would have interesting to read those "comments" that you both deleted. Yes, this double standard bites.
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby moonshadow » Fri Sep 25, 2015 12:58 am

dpinNE wrote:It would have interesting to read those "comments" that you both deleted.


Okay, you asked for it... and I'll go on to say I'm less animated now than I was last night, so you're still getting the "lite" version...


The only advice I can give is what I would do in your personal situation. That said, my personality is that of the minority and I'll admit wouldn't be workable for most people in the same situation.

To put it bluntly, if you do what I would do, from the looks of it you stand a good chance of being homeless, divorced, kidless, and possibly unemployed. But that's just my personal nature, I'd rather live on the street than live under someone's thumb.

Obviously most people would not be willing to sacrifice so much for what amounts to a such a frivolous ideal, that of simply wearing a skirt. I suppose the logical answer would be that a garment simply isn't worth such sacrifice. But as for me personally, it's more than just a garment, it's a fundamental right.

My mind reasons, if I can't wear something as simple as a skirt, despite the fact that doing so isn't illegal, unethical, or immoral, then where do my masters draw the line? Before you know it I'm being told what to eat, how to eat, where to work, what profession, what God to pray to, and worst of all, how to THINK. Before you know it, I'm living under complete oppression. And I believe this act must be nipped in the bud!

Out of respect for my wife, I will not engage in activities that I wouldn't want her engaging in, such as infidelity, excessive debt without consultation of the other, major life changes like quitting a job, buying a house or car, etc. But what to slip on in the morning is of little consequence, and I don't need anyone's permission on what to, or not to wear!

This is not to say that we don't fight, or lord yes we do, and do we ever! We fight often. But the fact is, I don't tell her what to wear, and she won't tell me. If that ever becomes a problem, the yellow pages are full of divorce lawyers. I'd hate to go down that route, but I'd really hate being under someone's thumb. I've been divorced before. You survive. I don't really care... I don't need nor want a master, I'd like to have a partner in life. If I can't have that than I'll go it alone! It's a simple as that!

The light version of what I was going to say, was simply, a free man takes control of his life, and to hell with the consequences. If you can't do such simple little things, then you're not a free man. It really is quite black and white. You are either free, or you are not. If you don't expect your wife to wear skirts all of the time, than she shouldn't expect you to wear pants!

Some on this board will say to give it time, and gently nudge. Well, I'll agree with that, but this thread was started over a year ago. It sounds like you are no further along with the other half as you were when you started. If she hasn't budged by now she probably won't. Really, it comes down to a simple choice... do you want to live this way, or do you want to live another way? How important are these skirts to you? Are they worth your marriage? Are they worth the anxiety of always keeping them hidden? Do you enjoy sneaking around, or would you rather be free in the open?

If your marriage is more important, get rid of the skirts and wear pants. If the skirts are more important, get rid of the wife and keep the skirts. It sounds like to me that's what this boils down to.

Only you can decide how you want to handle this, I think I've been pretty clear on how I would. But again, you're mileage may vary.

***Side note:

I'm not just talking out of my butt, I practice what I preach. I have separated from my wife before. It was over, among other things, religion. But to me, religion is another one of those fundamental rights that I will not compromise on. Yes, I'm selfish and somewhat arrogant about my rights. Most will disagree with me, but I still will not waver. If it ever gets to be too much for my wife, I will not contest a divorce. I don't want her to be unhappy, and I don't want to make myself unhappy.

She came back a few months later, and six years later I still believe the same way. We still fight about it now and then, and I can't say for sure if we will grow old together or not, but one thing is for sure, if I live to be an old man, I'll still be wearing a pentacle around my neck and still be wearing skirts in my free time. If I'm not it will ONLY be because I CHOOSE not to!
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby moonshadow » Fri Sep 25, 2015 1:13 am

Or, we could ask the Godfather what to do when faced with an situation we feel is unfair....

From one of my favorite movies...

https://youtu.be/idP5-vtkhBE
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby crfriend » Fri Sep 25, 2015 9:34 am

dpinNE wrote:[...]It would have interesting to read those "comments" that you both deleted. Yes, this double standard bites.

My pen is temporarily stilled by various externalities which I'd rather not deal with at the moment, and which I cannot prevail over at this point in time. I'll write about it eventually once the overt danger and raw pain have subsided.
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby dillon » Fri Sep 25, 2015 3:37 pm

Any advice we offer is likely to be worth every cent it costs, unfortunately. We are all individuals, as are our spouses, and there is no one-size-fits-all road map, formula, or recipe that will work for all individuals. Furthermore, we don't know your wife, her background, or her belief origins, so nothing we can say is likely to fit.

At the risk of issuing platitudes or comments that may be far off the mark, here is the best general advice I can offer:

First, don't be too hard on your wife. She is in shock. It is upsetting to her to see you skirted, clearly, and there may be many and varied reasons for this. She feels threatened perhaps because like so many women who hold unfounded beliefs they may not want to admit, or even acknowledge to themselves, she feels that skirted = gay, regardless of whatever reasons and rationalizations you may offer. To think that her husband is gay or trans- is upsetting her whole universe, her concepts about what her husband may be, her concepts about what you two are as a couple, or if you will soon leave her. She may feel your marriage has been a lie; there is simply nothing more humiliating to a woman to believe she has been used as a "beard" for a gay husband. Or that something about herself attracted a man who was hiding an attraction to men. Again, because she and you are both individuals, there is no recipe for reassuring her, or restoring her faith in your heterosexual orientation that any of us can share.

Second, for your part, you are not responsible for the ideas that please you. You did not conspire with Satan to develop a desire to wear a skirt. The most difficult thing you will have to answer is the question "Why?" Our desires are, for most of us, beyond articulation, and perhaps beyond the comprehension of anyone who isn't experiencing similar interests and impulses.

For your part, of course, you understand that you are the same man in trousers or a skirt. You act the same, and think the same; the main difference is that you are feeling a lightness of being when skirted, and a feeling of freedom and joy by such a simple thing. You naturally wonder why she doesn't want you to be happy, and you will suffer some guilt because you sense that your happiness results in her unhappiness. Not to mention the pain in your gut when you think of the hurt, anger, consternation, etc that any evidence of your desire may reveal, along with the denial or the secrecy for you have no outlet; it twists and knots in your belly and leaves you miserable.

Your reasoning is probably the same that many of us have: I am the same person skirted, only happier. This is just a garment; it pleases me to wear it just as your clothing choices please you. Am I not entitled to happiness? Why can't you trust my feelings as I trust yours? Why are you allowed to dress as you please but I am not? It is insulting that you have so little faith in my love for you and in my sexuality after all our years together. What happened to "for better or worse?" People change; why do you refuse to adjust to that fact? Do you want me to live a lie?

Unfortunately, what you must prepare for is the possibility that her adjustment will be the dissolution of the relationship. It's a poor choice for you both, but it happens. Some people value their preconceived ideas and prejudices above the people in their lives, sadly.

The threat of the dissolution of your marriage will not alter your desires, however. You may keep them closeted, hidden from view, practiced only at a great distance and under much tiresome subterfuge, to your great guilt and frustration, but they will not go away. And your resentment of her unyielding POV will slowly poison whatever you had with her. I understand that I am not painting an attractive picture of the future, and perhaps I'm being overly pessimistic. I wish there was some magical resource to which I could direct her so she could understand you, but even if there was such a resource, it is still up to her as to how she adapts. It is possible that she is now making value assessments of her own regarding your relationship.

Whatever comes of your marriage from this point forward, your behavior must be well-considered, because you have to live with your regrets. Always take the high road. Maintain honesty with her about your feelings, but do not dismiss hers. Try to articulate them when you can, and gently, lovingly, encourage her to examine her own views. Keep your dignity, above all; don't allow anger and frustration to be the factors that steer your side of the inevitable conflicts. But don't be a milksop that is easily pushed around. At the end of the day, whatever results, you must be able to respect your own masculinity; if you don't respect your own behavior, how could you expect your wife to respect you?

I'm afraid none of this will solve your problem, but please know you are not alone in facing this sort of thing. Many of us are or have been where you are today.
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby Breezy » Tue Oct 06, 2015 9:08 am

I 2nd the advice about startring with some Kilts. They are socialy acceptable for men to wear, then ease youself, one step at at time to the length that you want. Get one of ebay, i'll post a link below. How long have you liked wearing skirts? I live in Berlin, and it's a very open and free city, I wear skirts everywhere, but i come from a city that wouldnt allow me to wear one.....so i can emphasise. Good luck!
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby skirtyscot » Tue Oct 06, 2015 9:53 pm

Hi Breezy, why don't you start an intro thread of your own? Tell us about yourself and what the Berliners think of your skirts.
Last edited by crfriend on Tue Oct 06, 2015 10:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Fixed a typo [CRF]
Keep on skirting,

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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby Breezy » Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:56 am

OK i will :) Thanks for taking an interest!
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby dpinNE » Sun Apr 03, 2016 10:39 pm

Hi all,
While my issues with my wife regarding my skirts haven't changed, the one with my oldest daughter is just starting. I thought she had seen me once before but today while she was leaving for her job she saw me in one no more than a few feet away. I knew she noticed it because her eyes looked down at it. I sent her a text asking if she was surprised. She responds about what. I said if you didn't notice then never mind. But she did notice. I told her that I want to talk to her about it-just the two of us. So after school on Tuesday we'll talk about it. Now that the cat is out of the bag maybe a few things might get better or a lot worse. My wife said that I wasn't supposed to let the kids see me in one or be outside the house. Broke those two rules but I'm sure she forgot about them-hopefully.

How have some you with teenage kids handle it? I am planning on telling her my feelings about it, the comfort of them and anything else that I come up with.

Any thoughts are appreciated.
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Re: Need advice in Nebraska.

Postby Caultron » Mon Apr 04, 2016 2:10 am

Without knowing you and your daughter (and therefore with no basis at all), I'd suggest telling your daughter that the quest to find outselves never ends. We never stop growing, never stop changing, never finish seeking and finding ourselves.

And for reasons you may or may not be able to explain, this is something you need to explore.

My only caution is that this requires your daughter seeing you not as an authoritative parent, but as a fellow traveler in life. You have to decide if she's ready to start accepting that.
Courage, conviction, nerve, verve, dash, panache, guts, nuts, balls, gall, élan, stones, whatever. Get some and get skirted.

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