Fashion or Fetish?

Clippings from news sources involving fashion freedom and other gender equality issues.
Sasquatch
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Post by Sasquatch »

AMM wrote:I guess I've had a sheltered life -- I've never been exposed to a "ballet fetish", though I guess I should have known there would be one..

The only exposure I can recall having to a man (in real life) wearing a tutu, other than in a ballet, was a picture of a man (on a boat) in Australia, in a National Geographic article which referred to some sort of regular festival when guys deliberately do silly things. I'd also expect to see a few men in tutus in the New York City Hallowe'en parade, though since I haven't gone in 20 years, I couldn't say for sure.

But, let's assume that it's true that 99% of time when a non-dancer adult male wears a tutu, it's because he has a sexual obsession with them, as exemplified by the website Bob referenced.

Doesn't this situation strike anyone as a little odd? As something that needs explaining?

Why aren't there guys who just kind of like it, but don't need to go off the deep end over it? (Or gals, for that matter.)

I mean, there are indeed men who are sexually fixated on women in high heels, but there are more men who just kind of like the look. There are websites for corset fetishists and leather fetishists, but also people who like to wear one or the other without going off the deep end.

Where are the guys who occasionally wear tutus just for the heck of it? I can't help feeling that somewhere under the rockslide of socialization that we all go through, there is a significant number of people who might have liked to wear a tutu occasionally, if they hadn't learned that this was unthinkable. Isn't it a little hard to believe that only 5-year-old girls would by nature feel any attraction to ballet costumes, and never any 5-year-old boys, or 10-year-old girls?

I have to admit, I myself think tutus and other dance costumes are kinda cute. I might even consider trying one on, if I weren't afraid of being permanently branded a pervert if I did.

If my fears are typical (and remember, I'm willing to wear a skirt in public!), then you'd figure that someone would have to be pretty driven to overcome their fears and actually go out and do it.


So, in a sense, the social disapproval ends up making it a fetish activity (if only by driving away the non-fetishists.)

And to the one or two of you who haven't yet written me off as having more than one screw loose, I say:
Maybe it's time to liberate dancewear from the fetishists, in the name of Fashion Freedom.

-- AMM

"Some people see what is there and say, why? I see what is not there and ask, why not?"
(misquoted from somebody or other.)

Don't get the idea that just because I agree with you it means you don't have multiple screws loose! :)

From what I've gathered, the difference between fashion and fetish is the extent to which it "flops your mop". If you're flopping your mop every time you see a particular item of clothing, it's a fetish!

A normal hetero man can have a strong appreciation for a woman who, let's say, is wearing open toe high heel sandals and several toe rings. It wouldn't be unusual to be a little aroused by that; I mean, she wouldn't wear them if she didn't want you to notice them. That's the point of fashion. But if the man then hired a hooker to wear open toe high heel sandals and toe rings while he flopped his mop over her toes, well, that's a fetish!

If the idea of putting on a tutu is a little bit exciting, in a naughty way, and you do it a few times just to be silly, maybe even run through the park for the sake of the freedom to look and act silly, and maybe you flop your mop afterward, that's not necessarily unhealthy IMHO. But if you have a closet full of tutus and you wear them contsantly at home and need to flop a lot, that, to me, would constitute an unhealthy fetish.

But my screws may be loose, too.

Sasq
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Sasquatch
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Post by Sasquatch »

I meant no offense by my comments on dance. If you are in fact a professional dancer, then I will defer to your opinion of this so-called "unspoken code."

However, if the state of Dance in America is as morbidly serious as you make it seem, then sometime in the past two decades someone has found a way to suck the joy out of an avocation that I fondly remember as the most joyous, uplifting, and liberating period of my youth. I am sorry for your loss.

By the way, I am also a professional with advanced degrees. I can assure you that in my field the code of conduct and ethics is well recorded and clearly stated, and not some ethereal transmission open to individual perceptions. I know of no unspoken codes.

Have a pleasant evening.

Sasq
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Post by Bob »

If I'm making out dance to be dreadful, then I'm not communicating properly. It is a wonderful art form, but also one that takes a lot out of you.

Almost nothing in dance is written, it is all oral tradition.
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Post by raindog »

Hehehehe....Just musing on the phrase 'flop your mop'....


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knickerless
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flop your mop

Post by knickerless »

I assume this means the same as having a w*nk?


Nick
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Post by raindog »

I'm betting so, although it could be a wink....
I've never referred to the male pudenda as a 'Mop' before, but I might start now:wink2:


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Post by Departed Member »

Could be just, "whatever excites you!", could it not? :think: You naughty people have one track minds..................! :naughty:
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"Flops your Mop"

Post by Since1982 »

For all you folks on the "Other" side of the pond and are not "up" on American slang, "Flops your mop" is quite innocent, it means exactly the same as any other phrase having to do with doing whatever you like to do. If you're happy doing something, it might be called "whatever flops your mop" or Whatever turns you on" or just plain "whateverrrrrrrr".......:ninjajig:
I had to remove this signature as it was being used on Twitter. This is my OPINION, you NEEDN'T AGREE.

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Sasquatch
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Post by Sasquatch »

I didn't mean any harm, Skip. Just having a little fun with the expression. Simple minds like mine are easily amused!
Sasq
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Post by Departed Member »

"whateverrrrrrrr"

Gosh, Skip, are you a Catherine Tate fan, too?

I didn't know the phrase, "Flops your mop", originated in the USA. It's absolutely donkey's years since I first heard it! Takes me back, and no mistake! Jolly good one for the "must use it in a conversation ASAP" stakes!
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Catherine Tate

Post by Since1982 »

Who the FLOPPED MOP is Catherine Tate???:confused: :sarcastic: :drool: :eh:
I had to remove this signature as it was being used on Twitter. This is my OPINION, you NEEDN'T AGREE.

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Post by Stevie D »

Since1982 wrote:Who the FLOPPED MOP is Catherine Tate???:confused: :sarcastic: :drool: :eh:
Catherine Tate is a popular English comedienne and comedy writer. Her show on BBC television consists of a series of sketches in which she takes the role of a range of characters. The 'whatever' quote in previous messages is a reference to one of her characters Lauren - a bored, rebellious London or Essex teenage girl, whose response to any remark made to her is a surly "wo' evahhh!", or the catch phrase "am I bovvered?"

Links here:

http://www.catherinetate.co.uk/
and here ....
http://www.bbc.co.uk/comedy/guide/articles/c/catherinetateshow_999040216.shtml

In the both links, there are some video clips of the different characters.

More clips can be found on YouTube.com Just do a search for "Catherine Tate".
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AMM
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Post by AMM »

Bob wrote:The ballet schools I know all have rules against coming in and out of the studio without street clothes on top of the dance clothing. I don't know anyone who goes out in public without at least throwing on a skirt and a shirt over the dance clothing. I have never seen any dancer show a leotard line or leotard top in public.

I have never seen any dancer go around just wearing tights and a T-shirt, without at least shorts or a skirt on top. Maybe it's different out in the burbs or something.
For what it's worth, I seem to recall that there was a fashion, maybe in NYC, among young women (college age or so) to wear what appeared to be dance practice clothes -- leotard of some sort, tights (maybe footless), ballet-style skirt, often with leg warmers. Some of them may have been dancers, but it was definitely not confined to dancers, or to going to or from dance practice. I also recall a style of dressing (among women of various ages) consisting of a leotard (or bodysuit?), tights, and a simple skirt.

I also notice a popular style of women's shoe based on ballet slippers, referred to as "ballet flats."

In other words, even non-fetishist women sometimes wear women's "dancewear" without any connection with ballet or, indeed, dance of any kind.

-- AMM
Thanks for all the fish.
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Post by Pythos »

To the person who said that the person probably had a dancewear fetish, and that dancewear should only be worn in the studio 9or what not), I pose this. Jeans were orginally worn as work clothing only, by miners, or other dirty jobs. They were not to be worn out in "polite" public, and were concidered the uniform of the underclass.

What are jeans now?

Oh and guess what, there are people that have a denim fetish as well. I think there is a fetish for most anything out there. Is it bad? Not really, as long as no one is physically harmed by it.

I wear lycra a lot. My garments were bought in a dance store, or sports store. But because the are black, and rather subdued in appearance (except in good sunlight, then they shine) they do not draw too much more attention than athletic wear. But if they were white or other harsh or bright color, you know there would be those saying the old "that's inappropriate" line.

ah limited minds. They are so common.
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Post by Skirt Chaser »

Pythos wrote:I think there is a fetish for most anything out there. Is it bad? Not really, as long as no one is physically harmed by it.
That reminds me, why is it that a man gets labeled with 'fetishist' for the same thing that just is considered an eccentricity or merely a style preference in a woman? :roll: That isn't fair yet it happens all the time. I'd say both sides are harmed when men are judged more harshly and that women aren't seen as sexually driven.
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