Votes Matter ... or Do They?

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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

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Ray wrote:In view of your failure to elect a competent President and thus to govern yourselves, we hereby give notice of the revocation of your independence, effective immediately.

Her Sovereign Majesty, Queen Elizabeth II, will resume monarchical duties over all states, commonwealths and other territories (except Kansas, which she does not fancy), as from Monday next. [...]
Thank the heavens above that I read this after getting out of the loo, otherwise I almost certainly would have wet myself. Bravissimo!

This:
6. You will relearn your original national anthem, “God Save The Queen”,
but only after fully carrying out Task #1 (see above).
... I actually got into trouble for in my "formative years" when in first or second grade (I forget which; it was decades ago) and being tired with the inane lyrics of "My country 'tis of thee" instead belted out "God save the Queen" in class (which morphs into "King" when there's one of those on the throne (I have only known Queen Elizabeth the Second (not, goddammit, "QE2")). It wasn't the first time I got sent to the Headmaster's office, and it wasn't the last. My father even got called in on the matter, and all he had to say on the matter was, "Well done, lad, but just don't do it in front of the authorities next time." which I'm sure frosted The Authorities.
Thank you for your co-operation.
I am going to be laughing about that missive for weeks. Grazie!
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by moonshadow »

Hey Ray.... can we still wear skirts? :lol:
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer »

Ray,

Please believe me that I accept that your (our?) Majesty's proclamation is for own good, especially the part about firearms. Her logic's impeccable.

But in the name of logic I would ask that given there are a whole lot more of us reclaimed colonists than you current subjects wouldn't you agree that maybe we could compromise on some of the particulars, especially in the additional light that some of your details aren't quite right.

To begin with, we invented potato chips, along with almost everything else including radar, so we get to name them (see compromise #5 below).

"My Country 'Tis of Thee" was never our national anthem, it was one of the candidates, but we preferred to not only steal a tune from you -- albeit an unsingable one -- but invent lyrics telling the world how we whupped your butts ... You're right, under this new regime we need something else to sing to express our common identity. Maybe it will serve to calm us down rather than rile us as our current anthem does.

Another correction, it's not true that baseball is played only in the US. It's quite popular in Central America and the Caribbean nations, including Cuba. Not to mention Japan. Nor is it quite fair to say only teams based in the United States are eligible for the World Series; I suggest you NOT tell the inhabitants of Montreal that they're part of the US.

Another example, there's a segment of our population that's quite familiar with rugby and play it with great enthusiasm. Of course, with typical Yankee perversity most of them are women. Generally, who are quite as enthusiastic about women as most football players are, if you follow me.

So here's some initial compromises to consider:

1. Accept that American spelling is simpler and therefore more efficient and better for the environment (less ink and paper used to say the same thing). Think of it as a move to making our common language more ... common.

2. We'll accept the abolition of our automobiles if you'll do likewise with yours (Talk about CRAP, at least ours have always lasted, more or less.) and you switch over to driving on the right hand side, like the rest of the world. That way the Japanese and Germans will only have to build one version of each model. And while we're on the topic of cars, we're quite aware of German autos, thank you very much, at least at the luxury end of the market.

3. We'll accept the $8/ gallon price -- it'll do us good, even a dyed in the wool oilman like George W. acknowledged that we Americans are addicted to the stuff -- if you'll accept the name "gasoline" and its nickname "gas." It's only fair, we have a domestic supply that's all our own and you don't. Besides there are a lot more gas gauges in circulation than petrol gauges.

4. It only makes sense that we join the rest of the world and adopt the metric system. I know it will make things go faster and smoother in our space program. Not to mention at least one cause of lost spacecraft. But can't you let us have conversion charts, at least for the first few months? (Don't worry we'll be back before that time period's up for an extension; on this side of the globe there's nothing so permanent as "temporary.") But, once we have officially adopted the metric system and put it into common usage, you have to let us go back to calling inches and feet and ounces and pounds, et. al. the "English system." I mean, you don't expect US to take the rap for such a nonsensical "system!"

5. We will adopt proper pronunciation if you'll accept proper nomenclature starting with such gastronomic staples as potato chips and French fries.

And look, az a sign of good faith I'll thrown in a couple of gimmes. Y/Our Majesty should take another look at Kansas before dismissing it as not worthy of being a part of her realm. I know it has a reputation for being as flat as a pool billiards table, but there's two things she should know about that. 1) The topography makes it ideal for growing wheat (I KNOW her Majesty thinks of that as corn, but if she doesn't bear with us for awhile on that particular she will have an awfully large number of very confused colonials.). And 2) it's a bad rap (That's American for, "It's not true."). The Eastern half of Kansas is nothing but rolling hills so she would probably feel quite at home in Kansas if she just gave it a chance. Besides, while Europe is riddled with national enclaves; they have a very poor track record on this side of the pond. The Kansans I checked with promised to not be much of a bother. They say they got all of that out of their system in the 1850's before they got statehood.

My other gimme is that if you want to know who killed Kennedy (any one of them), all you have to do is ask any American. Every single one of us knows the answer to that for a certified FACT. Just be forewarned, it will be hard to find more than 2 or 3 of us at a time who will give you the same answer.

:wink: :wink:
Last edited by Pdxfashionpioneer on Sat Nov 12, 2016 5:07 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer »

Dear Moonshadow,

Please do not put words into my mouth. I do NOT think Democrats, including FDR and Truman, are infallible. Let alone that the legislation that they proposed was perfect either at its introduction or its enactment into law. While compromise often improves things, the ACA wasn't one of those cases.

I have said several times that I would have preferred a national system similar to one of the European models; unfortunately the Republicans wouldn't even go along with a public option.

You are absolutely right that the inhabitants of states that wouldn't accept the expansion of Medicaid are getting screwed, but again, to get anything through Congress, the President had to accept the states having some prerogatives. If you'll check your facts, you will see that the states that didn't adopt the Medicaid reforms have Republican-dominated legislatures and Republican governors.

You're absolutely right there are plenty of kinks in the darnedest places in the ACA. There always is in any complex, controversial piece of legislation. In the ACA's case, there are 4 contradictory definitions of "Native American," none of which matches. That's why almost as quickly as something like the ACA passes, a bill of technical amendments is proposed. In most Congresses such bills are routine. The Republican Congresses not only refused to consider such a bill, every single month they wasted the taxpayers' dollars and the President's time with yet another bill to repeal Obamacare.

In short, don't blame Pres. Obama for things beyond his control. Put the blame on the guilty.

And note that Trump has been the President-elect all of 3 days and already he's walking back his pledge to immediately repeal Obamacare. Now he's saying he'll "amend" it. Damn right he will. 21 million Americans rely on that law for their health insurance. It's not great coverage, but it sure beats nothing.

Dear Jenn,

In a similar fashion I need to ask you to check your facts. Special Prosecutor Starr, who was given a blank check to investigate everything the Clintons ever did to find illegal activities and impeachable offenses found one. Bill lied about having adulterous affairs with women. The rest of the "scandals" were overinflated if not groundless accusations. None of which were illegal.

As far as the rapist that Hillary defended as a young public defender goes, she originally tried to get taken off that case, but the judge insisted because the defendant wanted a female attorney and the judge wanted a good defense attorney for the man. So, as the law and attorneys' professional ethics require, she provided the accused a zealous defense. Even the prosecutor she beat in that case admits she was just doing her job and did it well. Better in fact than he had done is. When she has been interviewed about it, if you watch the whole interchange it's clear she still feels conflicted about the whole episode.

I can't speak to who Hillary Clinton called a "retard" when or why because it's a new one on me. I expect though, like so many of these other accusations, it was taken out of context.

To the both of you,

Consider this, until Clinton's 2nd term was over and the 2 of them left the White House, Hillary Clinton had shown no interest in running for any political office so to suggest that her earlier services to humanity were for political gain is baseless. To claim they were to feed her ego in a manner similar to the way Donald Trump is constantly feeding his is to draw an incredibly false equivalency. CNN had Trump's biographers and ghostwriters on as guests and to a man they talked about his character flaws and shortcomings. In fact, the overwhelming of the people who voted for Trump said he has neither the temperament nor character to be President or Commander-in-Chief.

As Carl said, one of the only hopes for Trump as a President is that he seems to have few, if any, real convictions so he can be counted on to do what he finds most personally expedient leavened with occasional flashes of humanity. How can I say such things when he hasn't even been sworn in yet? It's simple, it's his lifelong behavior pattern!

This is America so I will do my best to give him a chance and accentuate the positive. I have said on this forum several times that the attention his candidacy put a spotlight on what a pisspoor job BOTH parties have done in addressing the needs and concerns of the average individual. (See, I know some plain American English and I have NEVER said either party or anyone is perfect.)

Already we have seen Trump talk about his political opponent and his predecessor entirely differently than he had during the campaign. And, as I said, he's already talking about Obamacare quite differently than he had, which makes me think he's figured out that he's going to have to face at least some of the facts. If he hasn't already, by January 20 I think he's going to realize he's in way over his head. Of course, that's how every single one of his predecessors felt when the enormity of the job hit them. The difference, every single other one had some experience with government or the military. He has neither to fall back on.

Hopefully he will decide to do a lot of out of character things, like seek and take advice, admit his shortcomings, stop ranting and raving every time things don't go his way, LISTEN to other people and take to heart something he said in his victory speech, he's now going to be the President for all of us.
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by moonshadow »

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:In short, don't blame Pres. Obama for things beyond his control. Put the blame on the guilty.
Oh yes, I can not deny the Republicans had their hand in train wrecking the ACA.

In fact, correct me if I'm (please do, because I may actually be, this is a sincere question, not my usual passive aggression) But wasn't the original ACA proposed by Obama more inline with a national medicare (Canadian/European) type system? For some reason I seem to remember hearing his plans for it, but if I'm not mistaken we had mid-term elections around that time and the Republicans took congress and watered it down.

I really don't know the ins and outs of it as it was quite a snafu, and involved a lot of politics that frankly was pretty far over my head, but you seem pretty well versed in these matters, perhaps you can clear this up for me, I am genuinely curious, and it's hard to find good information about the true genesis of the ACA.

But for the record, you are incorrect about one little detail, Virginia has had Democratic governors throughout Obama's presidency, however we've had Republican controlled general assemblies (which by the way is the oldest in the New world :wink: ), so they would never send a bill to the governor to fund expanding medicaid. Governor McAuliffe has made countless appeals to our general assembly to accept the program, but they won't budge. And as you've seen in my explanation of Virginia voters, 98% of our counties and districts are Republican strong holds. We'll probably never have a Democratic controlled general assembly, yet "at large" we can swing a Democratic governor. Yes, we're a strange state with a hell of an identity crisis! As I've often said, NOVA could just about be it's own state as they have little in common with southern Virginians. But I'm glad their not. Their votes save from becoming another "deeply southern state", even if they can't brew good tea for sh!t! :lol:

Make no mistake though, if not for NOVA (northern Virginia), we'd be another Mississippi.
Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:Please do not put words into my mouth.
I do apologize for getting a little carried away with my label gun. It happens sometimes... I like stickers. :P

* * *

And speaking of tea, Ray, don't think we're going to give up our cold pitchers of southern sweet tea. We don't say "one lump or two?"... we say "one cup or two?", often the answer is "make it thick enough to pour of pancakes!" :lol: Diabetes isn't a problem in the south.... right? naaaaaahhh! :wink:

I've heard that the 1040 form is really a form of payment to the Queen! But if that gets out Carl might witness cases of English tea being thrown into Boston Harbor! :D

And everybody knows Kennedy was shot because of the Illuminati's resistance to the gold standard... :mrgreen:

Okay.. now I'm popping off! :lol: :lol:
Or am I? :twisted:
:hide:

*hears helicopters flying overhead!*
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

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Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:......
But in the name of logic I would ask that given there are a whole lot more of us reclaimed colonists than you current subjects wouldn't you agree that maybe we could compromise on some of the particulars, especially in the additional light that some of your details aren't quite right.
I hardly see that as relevant, dear boy; there were a lot more Indians ruled by Empress Victoria!
To begin with, we invented potato chips, along with almost everything else including radar, so we get to name them (see compromise #5 below).
I suspect there was a further injection of humour there :D but for the sake of those who may believe the provenance of radar and crisps, you only coined the name R.A.D.A.R; it's invention was based upon James Clerk Maxwell's (a British Scotsman) work on electromagnetism and attributable to Heinrich Hertz in the late19th century, later developed upon by Christian Hülsmeyer (both Germans). Wikipedia is not infallible, but the information here is reasonably reliable.

Similarly, we find evidence pre-dating the potato chip/crisp here.
"My Country 'Tis of Thee" was never our national anthem, it was one of the candidates, but we preferred to not only steal a tune from you -- albeit an unsingable one -- but invent lyrics telling the world how we whupped your butts ... You're right, under this new regime we need something else to sing to express our common identity. Maybe it will serve to calm us down rather than rile us as our current anthem does.
Again, there is evidence (to which you allude) here that it was a de facto national anthem during the 19th and early 20th century (alongside several others). The "Star Spangled Banner" was not officially adopted until 1931
Another correction, it's not true that baseball is played only in the US. It's quite popular in Central America and the Caribbean nations, including Cuba. Not to mention Japan. Nor is it quite fair to say only teams based in the United States are eligible for the World Series; I suggest you NOT tell the inhabitants of Montreal that they're part of the US.
Although correct, it's not exactly a "world" sport, is it? Then again, neither is snooker and we have the world championships for that game!
Another example, there's a segment of our population that's quite familiar with rugby and play it with great enthusiasm. Of course, with typical Yankee perversity most of them are women. Generally, who are quite as enthusiastic about women as most football players are, if you follow me.

So here's some initial compromises to consider:

1. Accept that American spelling is simpler and therefore more efficient and better for the environment (less ink and paper used to say the same thing). Think of it as a move to making our common language more ... common.
Actually, some "American" spellings are archaic "English" spellings; we've evolved, so catch up guys :lol:
2. We'll accept the abolition of our automobiles if you'll do likewise with yours (Talk about CRAP, at least ours have always lasted, more or less.) and you switch over to driving on the right hand side, like the rest of the world. That way the Japanese and Germans will only have to build one version of each model. And while we're on the topic of cars, we're quite aware of German autos, thank you very much, at least at the luxury end of the market.
If only you knew the truth of our automobile industry; other than some niche and prestige or performance companies (Morgan, Ariel, McLaren and Bristol) our manufacturing is for American, German, Japanese, French and Italian owned businesses!

However, the Japanese drive on the correct (i.e. left hand side) of the carriageway. You have the French to thank for driving on the right hand side following the revolution. You must convert so that our mounted lords and the gentry can keep order with their swords :lol:
3. We'll accept the $8/ gallon price -- it'll do us good, even a dyed in the wool oilman like George W. acknowledged that we Americans are addicted to the stuff -- if you'll accept the name "gasoline" and its nickname "gas." It's only fair, we have a domestic supply that's all our own and you don't. Besides there are a lot more gas gauges in circulation than petrol gauges.
We do have a domestic supply; we are not self sufficient though. But that's what an empire or commonwealth is for!
4. It only makes sense that we join the rest of the world and adopt the metric system. I know it will make things go faster and smoother in our space program. Not to mention at least one cause of lost spacecraft. But can't you let us have conversion charts, at least for the first few months? (Don't worry we'll be back before that time period's up for an extension; on this side of the globe there's nothing so permanent as "temporary.") But, once we have officially adopted the metric system and put it into common usage, you have to let us go back to calling inches and feet and ounces and pounds, et. al. the "English system." I mean, you don't expect US to take the rap for such a nonsensical "system!"
We've vascillated over metrication since the 1800s, but it didn't start in ernest until the 1960s. You'll not find us using lbs or feet and inches now, no way :lol: Just glad you haven't pointed out that much of your system started out here and pre-dates our "Imperial" measures, oops!
5. We will adopt proper pronunciation if you'll accept proper nomenclature starting with such gastronomic staples as potato chips and French fries.
Sorry, but we'd have thought you'd look for an easy way out of anything French.
And look, az a sign of good faith I'll thrown in a couple of gimmes. Y/Our Majesty should take another look at Kansas before dismissing it as not worthy of being a part of her realm. I know it has a reputation for being as flat as a pool billiards table, but there's two things she should know about that. 1) The topography makes it ideal for growing wheat (I KNOW her Majesty thinks of that as corn, but if she doesn't bear with us for awhile on that particular she will have an awfully large number of very confused colonials.). And 2) it's a bad rap (That's American for, "It's not true."). The Eastern half of Kansas is nothing but rolling hills so she would probably feel quite at home in Kansas if she just gave it a chance. Besides, while Europe is riddled with national enclaves; they have a very poor track record on this side of the pond. The Kansans I checked with promised to not be much of a bother. They say they got all of that out of their system in the 1850's before they got statehood.
We might use it as once we did with Australia; is that fair?
My other gimme is that if you want to know who killed Kennedy (any one of them), all you have to do is ask any American. Every single one of us knows the answer to that for a certified FACT. Just be forewarned, it will be hard to find more than 2 or 3 of us at a time who will give you the same answer.

:wink: :wink:
OK :D
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Disaffected.citizen »

moonshadow wrote:In fact, correct me if I'm (please do, because I may actually be, this is a sincere question, not my usual passive aggression) But wasn't the original ACA proposed by Obama more inline with a national medicare (Canadian/European) type system? For some reason I seem to remember hearing his plans for it, but if I'm not mistaken we had mid-term elections around that time and the Republicans took congress and watered it down.
I'm only a Brit, with little recall of all of your current president's original plans, but I think this is correct; which is why I believe Carl refers to it as "Romneycare". Had the plan gone as intended you would, indeed, have "Obamacare".
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

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Sorry DA but the metric system is not used in our household and many, many others. I couldn't tell you what my weight or height is in these new-fangled kilogrammes or kilometres. It annoys me when they talk bout kilometres on tele and I have to get my calculator out to convert to the real units of miles. If we ever get out of the EU such units should be immediately abolished and we go back to good old pounds, shillings and pence and pay for expensive things in guineas. BTW if the politicians vote to overturn the referendum then Up the Revolution.
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Ray »

Great debate! Dave, I'll convey your suggestions to the Queen, but I'm not sure she's going to like the reference to our cars being rubbish! We have Range Rovers, Jaguars, McLarens. You have, err, the F150? ;-)
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Disaffected.citizen »

Sinned wrote:Sorry DA but the metric system is not used in our household and many, many others. I couldn't tell you what my weight or height is in these new-fangled kilogrammes or kilometres. It annoys me when they talk bout kilometres on tele and I have to get my calculator out to convert to the real units of miles. If we ever get out of the EU such units should be immediately abolished and we go back to good old pounds, shillings and pence and pay for expensive things in guineas. BTW if the politicians vote to overturn the referendum then Up the Revolution.
Did you not understand
Disaffected.citizen wrote:You'll not find us using lbs or feet and inches now, no way :lol:
?
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by dillon »

I guess the whole thing about Independence would have been more cutting if we hadn't just watched the Brits implode by the unexpected margin for Brexit... But it does add that element of amusement. Nice try, though. As Jack Longland might have said "Half a mark..."
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by moonshadow »

This page of this thread has got to be the funniest I've seen on this site in a long time!

Keep it up guys! :rofl:
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

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Disaffected.citizen wrote:Actually, some "American" spellings are archaic "English" spellings; we've evolved, so catch up guys :lol:
That explains, then, why the Welsh have few vowels -- you lot made off with most of 'em. I believe an offer was made of some of ours to the Welsh in the 19-teens but the transport they were on got torpedoed.
I suspect there was a further injection of humour there :D but for the sake of those who may believe the provenance of radar and crisps, you only coined the name R.A.D.A.R; it's invention was based upon James Clerk Maxwell's (a British Scotsman) work on electromagnetism and attributable to Heinrich Hertz in the late19th century, later developed upon by Christian Hülsmeyer (both Germans).
Correct. However, there is much jingoism apparent on both sides of the pond with tender sensitivities aplenty.

It's like arguing about the first general-purpose computer. The Yanks claim ENIAC [0] or the ABC [1], the Brits claim Baby [2] and Colossus [3], and the Krauts claim the Z-3 [4].

On politics and fashion: At least Rudy Guiliani has been seen and photographed in a dress and high-heels. Other than her stint in the military -- as a mechanic, natch -- has Queen Elizabeth the Second ever been seen in trousers in formal settings? Has Hillary Clinton been seen in the past decade wearing anything other than pants [cross-pond pun intentional]? Would Donald Trump know what to do with a skirt if was the only thing available when waking up one morning?


[0] Electronic Numerical Integrator And Calculator; Valve-based electronics, patch-panel programming
[1] Atanasoff Berry Computer; mostly electronic with some mechanical parts in the memory subsection; program not in mainstore
[2] Also, SSEM, Manchester Small-Scale Experimental Machine; all valve-based electronics, Williams tube memory; test-bed for the Mark I
[3] which wasn't "discovered" until the veil of secrecy surrounding it was lifted in the 1970s
[4] designed by Konrad Zuse in the 1930s and operational in 1941; relay-based
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

Post by Disaffected.citizen »

crfriend wrote:
Disaffected.citizen wrote:Actually, some "American" spellings are archaic "English" spellings; we've evolved, so catch up guys :lol:
That explains, then, why the Welsh have few vowels -- you lot made off with most of 'em. I believe an offer was made of some of ours to the Welsh in the 19-teens but the transport they were on got torpedoed.
I thought that was the case.
I suspect there was a further injection of humour there :D but for the sake of those who may believe the provenance of radar and crisps, you only coined the name R.A.D.A.R; it's invention was based upon James Clerk Maxwell's (a British Scotsman) work on electromagnetism and attributable to Heinrich Hertz in the late19th century, later developed upon by Christian Hülsmeyer (both Germans).
Correct. However, there is much jingoism apparent on both sides of the pond with tender sensitivities aplenty.

It's like arguing about the first general-purpose computer. The Yanks claim ENIAC [0] or the ABC [1], the Brits claim Baby [2] and Colossus [3], and the Krauts claim the Z-3 [4].
The secrecy during the war years makes it nigh on impossible to determine who was first here. As a Brit, I'm bound to say Baby or Colossus; I'd expect nothing less of you guys than to support ENIAC or ABC.
On politics and fashion: At least Rudy Guiliani has been seen and photographed in a dress and high-heels. Other than her stint in the military -- as a mechanic, natch -- has Queen Elizabeth the Second ever been seen in trousers in formal settings? Has Hillary Clinton been seen in the past decade wearing anything other than pants [cross-pond pun intentional]? Would Donald Trump know what to do with a skirt if was the only thing available when waking up one morning?
I recall pictures of Rudy. I cannot recall any or our Queen, other than the military stint to which you refer. I think Hillary has worn dresses to some evening "functions", even recently. As for Donald, well....
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Re: Votes Matter ... or Do They?

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DA, Of course I understood and I was educated in a Grammar School using the metric system for all our experiments in science of which I took Chemistry, Mathematics and Physics, BUT, it doesn't mean that I prefer the system to the good old Imperial one even though the metric is easier on the calculations. Let's just agree to disagree on this one and leave it at that. If our new commonwealth member-elect wants to still use Imperial then let them.

And as regards Hillary and her pants there was a short article in todays Daily Wail by Amanda Platell, "Not to be outdone by Hillary's thunder-thigh pant-suits, Mrs Trump turned up for Donald's acceptance speech in a white jumpsuit. It was Ralph Lauren and cost £3,172, but wouldn't it be nice if, for once, we had a First Lady who didn't want to wear the trousers?"
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
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