Brexit

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Re: Brexit

Postby pelmut » Sat Jun 01, 2019 7:09 pm

FranTastic444 wrote:Things have become so toxic and entrenched within the UK that I think the only way forward is exit in October with no deal.

The press loves a scrap and gives the impression that everyone is violently pro or anti Brexit.  It may be true of Parliament, but it doesn't correspond with my experience of ordinary people; most of the people I know have a general leaning one way or the other, but they can weigh up the pros and cons and are quite happy to admit that both sides have their good and bad points.  The toxicity appears to be coming mostly from the politicians.

People do get heated when discussing individual matters such as laws, immigrants, trade, travel and the demonstrated inability of any political party to deliver what we thought they were promising or to put the good of the country first.
There is no such thing as a normal person, only someone you don't know very well yet.
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Re: Brexit

Postby skirtyscot » Sun Jun 02, 2019 12:37 am

Epic post, FT444. I was reading it and thinking "wow, this guy has saved me hours of typing. Then you went and ruined it with your dumb suggestion of a no-deal Brexit.

Captain's log, star date 1 November 2019.
Yay, we're free! No more kowtowing to the Germans! Rule Britannia!

2/11/19
Oh man, these WTO tariffs suck. Our imports are way too expensive, they're pushing inflation up. And our exports are way too expensive, the exporters are all going out of business.

3/11/19
What do you mean, we have no way to change the WTO tariffs until the next round of talks? When are they? Twenty-when? Fcuk!

4/11/19
Looks like we'd better get ourselves some trade deals. Hmm... who first?..... Ah, the EU, right next door and our biggest customer. Let's start there.

5/11/19
Hello, is that Mr Barnier?
Oui. Quoi?
Well, we've noticed that you're out of a job, what with the Brexit negotiations finished, and we wondered if you'd like to negotiate a trade deal with us for the EU.
Mais bien sûr, mon plaisir.
We'd like to have no tariffs please. Those nice BMWs are kind of pricey all of a sudden.
Hmm.. peut-etre. But first there is the small matter of the €39,000,000,000 you were going to pay us. And you'll have to agree to let EU citizens into the UK. And we need any disputes to be resolved by the ECJ. Apart from that, everything is negotiable and I hope we can agree something by 2025.

6/11/19
Boris, I distinctly recall you saying this was going to be easy.
Sorry, I lied, but it got me into No 10 and that's all I care about.
Keep on skirting,

Alastair
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Re: Brexit

Postby crfriend » Sun Jun 02, 2019 2:29 am

Please be careful, gents. I've got some tricks up my sleeve regarding the dismal state of discourse on the western [0] side of the pond. I'm hoping I don't have to use that same hammer on the discourse on the eastern [0] side of the pond.


[0] Dammit, I can't even use the conventional "left" and "right" terms any more. Where is this madness going to end?
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Re: Brexit

Postby Darryl » Sun Jun 02, 2019 3:45 am

crfriend wrote:Please be careful, gents. I've got some tricks up my sleeve regarding the dismal state of discourse on the western [0] side of the pond. I'm hoping I don't have to use that same hammer on the discourse on the eastern [0] side of the pond.


[0] Dammit, I can't even use the conventional "left" and "right" terms any more. Where is this madness going to end?


Write up a simple system and rename all groups as Quadrant x.y where x is the major position and y is the minor position(s).

Then if 'they' start using it, you know you've got a mole. :shock:
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Re: Brexit

Postby Sinned » Sun Jun 02, 2019 9:52 am

Well, the Peterborough by election is next Thursday. Interestingly the Brexit Party is supposed to be hot favourites to win the seat. We'll see, I always have a healthy disrespect of dead certs. If it does turn out that way, though, it will certainly make things interesting and liven up the political scene!

I don't get riled up over political issues. Mostly it's opinion. Very few, apart from the authors, have read even a small fraction of the documents produced by the European Civil Service, and mostly rely on summaries. So first hand researched "facts" can be hard to come by and distortions arise from interpretations. I have read very little so don't purport to be an expert. All I have is a gut feeling disconnect with European continental societies but then I'm generally a loner so that's understandable. I certainly wouldn't get upset with anyone telling me that I'm talking out of my *rs* hole and that my opinions aren't factually based. Whilst I may modify my opinion I'm not going to do a complete u-turn anytime soon.
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Re: Brexit

Postby skirtyscot » Sun Jun 02, 2019 9:32 pm

Carl, maybe just stick to the conventional "west" and "east". That way you won't be at risk of confusing our upside-down friends from Aus and NZ.
Keep on skirting,

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Re: Brexit

Postby crfriend » Sun Jun 02, 2019 11:24 pm

skirtyscot wrote:Carl, maybe just stick to the conventional "west" and "east". That way you won't be at risk of confusing our upside-down friends from Aus and NZ.

I suppose that's best, especially as Aussie maps have North as "up" and East as "left". One cannot blame them really.

{dives for cover}
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Re: Brexit

Postby happykilt » Thu Jun 06, 2019 3:22 pm

One point of view:

“I can’t help feeling that it would be an awful shame if what we’ve gone to so much trouble to do, to collect the European big nations together, to break it all up now would be a crying shame,” said Mr Chardin, 94, from Cambridge, in a BBC interview at the 75th anniversary commemorations in Portsmouth.

“We have learnt that war stinks, that peace is the natural goal for civilisation, and that Europeans are our brothers in arms. But that peace and friendship is now threatened by Brexit. Peace in Europe is not something that should be taken for granted. We should be proud to lead in Europe, proud that our friends respect us and can rely on us. That’s why we, as former members of the armed forces, all support a People’s Vote on Brexit.”

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... 1559806602
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Re: Brexit

Postby Sinned » Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:49 pm

happykilt, I can't subscribe to the point of view of the second one. The Europeans are not "our brothers in arms", never have been and probably never will be. Even though I was never interested in history at school I now read books about the history of our nation - the Normans, Saxons, Tudors, Elizabethans ( the first ones ) and so on and we have spent more time at war with Europeans - Dutch, French, Germans, Portugese, Spanish than we have being at peace with them. ( Maybe an exaggeration but you know what I mean. ) Hopefully we are a bit more civilised now but as we found with the break up of the Russian Empire, war ( and genocide ) is still a possibility on the mainland. In Europe now we still have various factions ( which don't necessarily stick to country ( or state as they now seem to be called ) ) with their own agenda seeking dominance over other factions. If all the countries unite then that gives them a bigger pie. Call me cynical but then that's me. I don't want to be a part of a humongous United States of Europe just as certain parts of the United States of America would probably like to go their own way. Peace is NOT threatened by Brexit and "lead in Europe" or have respect from them. Excuse me if a have a little chuckle over those. Not sure that he can speak for the whole of the armed forces either. That's like saying that I speak for the whole of the country - I don't, only approximately 50% of them. Anyway it's been a by-election in Peterborough so we'll see how that washes out tonight.
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