Common Terminology

General discussion of skirt and kilt-based fashion for men, and stuff that goes with skirts and kilts.
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Caultron
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by Caultron »

crfriend wrote:
Caultron wrote:And yet here we are, with I dare say more media coverage for men in skirts than then.
Indeed, but what is the purpose of the "coverage". Is it to educate and encourage, or is it a veiled attempt at public shaming? Which would sell more advertising copy?
The cross-section that I see are mostly along the lines of, "intrigued trend-spotter," or, "Why not?" Only a small percentage are negative.
Courage, conviction, nerve, verve, dash, panache, guts, nuts, balls, gall, élan, stones, whatever. Get some and get skirted.

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denimini
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by denimini »

As well as skirt length terminology we have style terminology:
Skater
Cargo
Wrap
Kilt
Circle
Flip skirt
Flouncy
Tennis
A-line
Pencil
Bubble

There are terms like pleated and ruffled which I am unsure of their status in skirt taxonomy hierachy, whether they are a style or just a detail like colour or material.

Also there are dress styles, of which I was bitterly disappointed to discover that the Peter Pan dress wasn't for boys; it refers to a collar style.
Anthony, a denim miniskirt wearer in Outback Australia
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Daryl
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by Daryl »

denimini wrote:As well as skirt length terminology we have style terminology:
Skater
Cargo
Wrap
Kilt
Circle
Flip skirt
Flouncy
Tennis
A-line
Pencil
Bubble

There are terms like pleated and ruffled which I am unsure of their status in skirt taxonomy hierachy, whether they are a style or just a detail like colour or material.

Also there are dress styles, of which I was bitterly disappointed to discover that the Peter Pan dress wasn't for boys; it refers to a collar style.
That's a pretty good base list of styles though "flouncy" could apply as a description of some of the others so may be a bit redundant. I think we should keep it in just to remind the world that "flounce" has an original meaning. Wouldn't we just call it a "flounce" skirt though, signifying any skirt like that not better described by one of the other categories?

Flouncing has come to mean exxagerated expression, particularly expression of annoyance, through use of the word deriving from skirts that left an impression under certain circumstances of that kind.
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by Stu »

I do not profess to be an expert on this, but I have been told by a family member who is knowledgeable on fashion that the whole idea of a pencil skirt was for women to show the contrast between their hip-width and their slender legs - i.e. they emphasised the womanly shape. The price women paid for wearing them was that they had to take short steps. However, it seems the word "pencil" is now used to encompass what we used to call "straight skirts", such as are found in many suits and uniforms, and they don't have the same problems as the pencil style - you can walk naturally in them.

Another one which isn't on the list is what used to be called "full" or "flared" - I am not sure if these words have been replaced by "flouncy".
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by crfriend »

Stu wrote:I do not profess to be an expert on this, but I have been told by a family member who is knowledgeable on fashion that the whole idea of a pencil skirt was for women to show the contrast between their hip-width and their slender legs - i.e. they emphasised the womanly shape. The price women paid for wearing them was that they had to take short steps. However, it seems the word "pencil" is now used to encompass what we used to call "straight skirts", such as are found in many suits and uniforms, and they don't have the same problems as the pencil style - you can walk naturally in them.
Indeed. This remains a classic style, and with the walking vent in the back, or, less commonly, at the side, they do not restrict movement.
Another one which isn't on the list is what used to be called "full" or "flared" - I am not sure if these words have been replaced by "flouncy".
A "flounce" in this context would apply to a separate tier (or sometimes two) on the skirt sewn so as to give it a more exaggerated flare than the tier above it. An A-line skirt can be considered a "full" or "flared" design depending on the construction
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Re: Common Terminology

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From an ebay page: http://www.ebay.com/gds/15-Essential-Sk ... 604/g.html
What to wear.JPG
I was encouraged by the fact that the first 5 body types are not gender specific, spoilt by the last 3 that mention women although the body types are just as applicable to men.
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denimini
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by denimini »

Here is a selection of skirts with "flouncy" in the title.
flouncy_skirt.JPG
I am sure I have a few that would comply with the term flouncy, obviously the shorter variety, and can't wait for an opportunity to reply to ..... "Kilt?"
"No, it is a flouncy skirt"
I also like flip skirts and skater skirts which are a similar style which offer coolness and great freedom of movement, but check out the weather forcast for wind speed.

The only pencil skirts I have are a bit like my carpenter's pencils; short and stubby.
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Daryl
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Re: Common Terminology

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Stu wrote:I do not profess to be an expert on this, but I have been told by a family member who is knowledgeable on fashion that the whole idea of a pencil skirt was for women to show the contrast between their hip-width and their slender legs - i.e. they emphasised the womanly shape. The price women paid for wearing them was that they had to take short steps. However, it seems the word "pencil" is now used to encompass what we used to call "straight skirts", such as are found in many suits and uniforms, and they don't have the same problems as the pencil style - you can walk naturally in them.
Wikipedia has it that the pencil skirt is a legacy of the hobble skirt, the chief feature of which was that it actually meant to hobble (severely restrict the stride of) its wearer. Pictures of hobble skirts confirm that idea, but by banding points of the legs they also obviously amplify the unbanded parts including hips and butts.

Pencil/straight skirts also came on the scene at a time when more practicality in women's garments was being demanded, and not too long before a time when economic efficiency would have been a factor too (world wars and the great depression). They take little material and are easy to construct, and are super practical in the wind and in situations where larger garments would be liabilities (crowded offices, factories, etc.).

The idea that their point was to show the contrast between hips and legs is certainly well founded, since bodily contrasts has been an aim of women's fashions for a long long time. A pencil skirt as we know it generally tapers towards the bottom and is not straight like a real pencil would be. Even with a kick pleat a longish pencil can be quite restrictive but it just looks so darned sharp and is so comfortable and convenient to wear it is worth that slight sacrifice IMO.

I just bought two metres each of a print fabric in two different floral designs for the purpose of expanding my straight/pencil skirt collection with some more feminine eyeball pleasures. The fabric has a slight stretch to it in both dimensions, which will compensate somewhat for the restrictiveness, so I plan to make them taper a little more than my skirts made with rigid fabrics do. It still won't be much of a taper, just barely noticeable, but I think it does make my pencil look sharper even if no real figure accentuation takes place. Figure accentuation would not be my goal anyway since while I want to indulge feminine aesthetics I am not trying to trick any eyes into seeing a female where none exists.
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by skirtyscot »

On the right body, pencil skirts look terrific. A colleague of mine a few years ago was maybe a little curvier than the ideal. Not huge but generally rounded. (Is this what they call an apple shape?) She bought a pencil skirt and the effect was remarkable. Somehow it took a feature which was not terribly attractive, her backside, and by emphasising it made it look stunning. Alchemy, pure alchemy.

Not one for us gents to try.
Keep on skirting,

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Re: Common Terminology

Post by Caultron »

skirtyscot wrote:On the right body, pencil skirts look terrific... Not one for us gents to try.
I guess it depends on the gent and the body. I wear pencil skirts a lot and think I think look good in them.

For me, good percentage of Lycra and/or a well-placed slit solves the freedom-of-movement problem.
Courage, conviction, nerve, verve, dash, panache, guts, nuts, balls, gall, élan, stones, whatever. Get some and get skirted.

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Re: Common Terminology

Post by Kilty »

Caultron wrote:
skirtyscot wrote:On the right body, pencil skirts look terrific... Not one for us gents to try.
I guess it depends on the gent and the body. I wear pencil skirts a lot and think I think look good in them.

For me, good percentage of Lycra and/or a well-placed slit solves the freedom-of-movement problem.
+1 8)
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by skirtyscot »

Men tend to lack the curves that pencil skirts are designed to emphasise, but if they work for you, far be it from me to stop you!
Keep on skirting,

Alastair
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by Kirbstone »

Was that what you guys had in mind?

Tom
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by Grok »

Daryl wrote:
The idea that their point was to show the contrast between hips and legs is certainly well founded, since bodily contrasts has been an aim of women's fashions for a long long time. A pencil skirt as we know it generally tapers towards the bottom and is not straight like a real pencil would be. Even with a kick pleat a longish pencil can be quite restrictive but it just looks so darned sharp and is so comfortable and convenient to wear it is worth that slight sacrifice IMO.
I was looking at comments online which described the difference between pencil and straight. A straight skirt lacks the taper of a pencil skirt. A straight skirt goes straight down, giving it a somewhat looser fit than a pencil skirt-and permitting normal walking.

BTW, there is a style called a "peg skirt", which has even more of a taper than a pencil skirt.
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Re: Common Terminology

Post by beachlion »

When I think of pencil skirts, I have to think of a movie, Mon oncle from Jacques Tati. A secretary at the office of his brother in law has a narrow pencil skirt and quite lumpy high heels. She walks around fast with ridiculous small steps but with a lot of noise from her spikes on the marble floor.
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