Difficulties with partners

General discussion of skirt and kilt-based fashion for men, and stuff that goes with skirts and kilts.
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crfriend
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Sinned wrote:You have to realise that MOH is perfect, she doesn't drink alcohol, has never smoked, is utterly faithful, is rather conservative in all her ways and in many ways has a heart of gold with others. Although I have supported her many times in the past it's difficult to think of anything that's as way out as my skirt wearing. She wars leggings ALL the time but they're not trousers, they were designed and made for women.
"I love you, dear, and you know that. But those 'leggings' make you look like a beached whale."

Yes, that's entirely inflammatory, and I know it. However, that's what "leggings" do to 90+% of those who wear them. Ditto "yoga pants". They are entirely unforgiving and generally reveal way too much information. The average mortal is not a super-model.

Pot. Kettle. Black. One gets the picture.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Sinned wrote:You have to realise that MOH is perfect....
I mean no disrespect here; I assume this statement is "firmly tongue in cheek". Nobody is perfect.
crfriend wrote:... that's what "leggings" do to 90+% of those who wear them. Ditto "yoga pants". They are entirely unforgiving and generally reveal way too much information.
So very true; ghastly items and usually worn by those least able to "carry the look".

I am by no means perfect and I support everybody's right to their own clothing choices and expression; but the words of Billy Connelly come to mind .... " fat girls should nay wear ski pants!"
Sinned wrote:Although I have supported her many times in the past it's difficult to think of anything that's as way out as my skirt wearing.
As I have no significant lasting relationships, these words come from no authority whatsoever; I suspect that if you think hard enough over the 41 years there will be some instances where you provided exactly the support you now seek. Equality in the world of 1976 was likely just a concept; it's taken many years to get where we are today. You've had to make adjustments between then and now; think about the patriarchal mindset back then. It's just that a significant lobby rallied around the "women's equality cause", now read "women's dominance cause".

Have you ever read or seen the John Grisham story "A Time to Kill"? This might not be in the same league as that proposition, but the defense attorney's closing statement could be adopted here.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Good point D.C.

I'm sure Dennis's wife has burned a "proverbial bra or two" in her time...

If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times... fair is fair.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Disaffected.citizen wrote:I am by no means perfect and I support everybody's right to their own clothing choices and expression [...]
That's the genius of it: none of us are perfect by the simple measure of being human. However, that should not -- nay, cannot -- silence criticism of things that glorify assorted imperfections as aesthetic abominations.

I may not have done so earlier on in life, but I do try today to make the world a bit more of a beautiful place, and I heartily encourage others to do so as well. The old saw of, "Practise beauty and random acts of kindness" just might make a difference in the increasingly nasty and unpleasant world we now inhabit. Especially practise those traits in front of children, for their future is entirely bleak indeed. Perhaps in that way such acts may, just maybe, make a difference. It sure can't hurt to try.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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crfriend wrote:That's the genius of it: none of us are perfect by the simple measure of being human. However, that should not -- nay, cannot -- silence criticism of things that glorify assorted imperfections as aesthetic abominations.
Although I agree that critics should not be silenced, I am also of the opinion that we need to see everyday aesthetic abominations to be able to appreciate beauty - yin and yang and all that! :D Also, individual perceptions of beauty vary; one man's meat, etc.
I may not have done so earlier on in life, but I do try today to make the world a bit more of a beautiful place, and I heartily encourage others to do so as well.
With age comes..... I, too, do my best, yet fall woefully short.
The old saw of, "Practise beauty and random acts of kindness" just might make a difference in the increasingly nasty and unpleasant world we now inhabit. Especially practise those traits in front of children, for their future is entirely bleak indeed. Perhaps in that way such acts may, just maybe, make a difference. It sure can't hurt to try.
Prepare for the worst, hope and pray for the best - let's not write their futures off entirely, yet. In troubled times the dramatic and music arts usually step up to the mark with stories to pique the conscience; obviously many re-tellings of classics, but pertinent nonetheless.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Disaffected.citizen wrote:[...] I agree that critics should not be silenced, I am also of the opinion that we need to see everyday aesthetic abominations to be able to appreciate beauty - yin and yang and all that! :D
Yin and yang are all well and good, but -- please -- in moderation on both counts. It's like seasoning a fine recipe -- the balance counts and an over-abundance of either, or both, ruins the repast. What I see today is a cornucopia of aesthetic abomination and a dreadful dearth of beauty. That's not balance; that's toxin!
With age comes..... I, too, do my best, yet fall woefully short.
Ageing is inescapable. I have my faults -- and plenty of them, Ill add -- and over the years the age-related ones are aggregating. However, I try to deal with them as they arise -- with varying degrees of efficacy. At the moment, I really need to figure out how to get rid of the lizard-skin I seem to have developed in the past year. Everything itches, and much of it is flaking. This is going to put a real kink in wearing short skirts come spring (if it ever comes, that is).
In troubled times the dramatic and music arts usually step up to the mark with stories to pique the conscience; obviously many re-tellings of classics, but pertinent nonetheless.
One word: "rap" (aka "hip-hop"). Is there any hope in that sort of a bullet-wound to the head?
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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crfriend wrote:
Disaffected.citizen wrote:[...] I agree that critics should not be silenced, I am also of the opinion that we need to see everyday aesthetic abominations to be able to appreciate beauty - yin and yang and all that! :D
Yin and yang are all well and good, but -- please -- in moderation on both counts. It's like seasoning a fine recipe -- the balance counts and an over-abundance of either, or both, ruins the repast. What I see today is a cornucopia of aesthetic abomination and a dreadful dearth of beauty. That's not balance; that's toxin!
I agree; however, it is inescapable that abominations outweigh the beautiful in almost everything. We each do our best, striving for the highest factor; sadly, too many are comfortable settling for the lowest common denominator.
With age comes..... I, too, do my best, yet fall woefully short.
Ageing is inescapable. I have my faults -- and plenty of them, Ill add -- and over the years the age-related ones are aggregating. However, I try to deal with them as they arise -- with varying degrees of efficacy. At the moment, I really need to figure out how to get rid of the lizard-skin I seem to have developed in the past year. Everything itches, and much of it is flaking. This is going to put a real kink in wearing short skirts come spring (if it ever comes, that is).
So, we're flawed gems :lol: I have suffered from dry, flakey skin most of my life and, until I started wearing skirts, was very self-conscious. If I venture out again, I shall moisturise, but I'll not worry too much - I've seen much worse (not that that's an excuse).
In troubled times the dramatic and music arts usually step up to the mark with stories to pique the conscience; obviously many re-tellings of classics, but pertinent nonetheless.
One word: "rap" (aka "hip-hop"). Is there any hope in that sort of a bullet-wound to the head?
But even within (c)rap there are still some that convey messages of good and hope - just don't ask me to cite examples! :lol:
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Disaffected.citizen wrote:...I have suffered from dry, flakey skin most of my life and, until I started wearing skirts, was very self-conscious. If I venture out again, I shall moisturise, but I'll not worry too much - I've seen much worse (not that that's an excuse)...
Really? You're less self-conscious about showing your legs in a skirt than, say, shorts or trousers?

Bravo, but how so?

On a related note, I've been slobbering skin cream on my calves and forearms twice a day for many years. It just makes them feel and look better better than dry flakey skin. Age, I suppose, although I keep fighting that...
Courage, conviction, nerve, verve, dash, panache, guts, nuts, balls, gall, élan, stones, whatever. Get some and get skirted.

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Re: Difficulties with partners

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I'd like to digress from the ills of aging, Carl's visceral hatred of leggings and his certainty that the world is going to hell in a handbasket and get back to the actual topic of this thread.

Today I remembered another pertinent incident in Nancy's and my friendship. One evening, at the drop of a hat she asked if I could join her for dinner because she was going to be at her favorite restaurant and would prefer some company. I replied that would be great, because I was literally "all dressed up and had nowhere to go.

Too literally, as it turned out. She wasn't surprised by turning up in a dress, she was shocked! I was flabbergasted. I thought she knew what I meant because in our numerous texts I had sent her a photo of me in one of my sweater dresses, had told her about being in line at Penney's to pay for "the perfect red dress," etc.

Apparently, they hadn't registered because as she explained, she had this image of me as this well put-together, if somewhat casual (Dockers/khakis and polos had become my work uniform), professional and wearing a dress and high heels didn't fit that image. Because I had sent her so many other indications without reaction, I thought she was kidding herself and that she wasn't as open-minded as she gave herself credit for being.

In retrospect, I think she her explanation was mostly right. Her image of me had blinded her to the reality I presented in the text messages so when she was presented with the reality, it was a shock. Since then we've had other dinners together. Once, I was in my sheath with the Mondrian style colorblocking and several waitresses chat me up about it and ignore her because they liked it and she was in her bicycling gear. And she was just fine with that.

As I said about this upcoming event, she still has stumbling blocks she has to think through and she's just a friend. How much harder does it have to be for your spouses, who thought they knew you through and through, certainly never suspected you wanted to wear skirts and now they have to deal with something there isn't even a good label for, let alone it being anything their moms prepared them for?!

I know most of you hate being labelled, but this is a place where finding a label that comes close and that you can define for her, at least insofar as it pertains to you, can help you out. Labels are a device we humans use to wrap our mental arms around a new concept or reality by giving it some sense of familiarity. It's not a perfect tool, but few things are. Maybe you can help your lady over her mental barriers by extending a close-enough label.

But judging your beloved Other Half is tantamount to slamming the door on open discourse so I'd suggest actively fighting the temptation to let your inevitable judgements take control of your thinking.

And again, the best of luck.

All of you who have shared your struggles, please keep us up to date on what you've tried and what has worked and hasn't worked so all of us can know what works and what doesn't.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:I'd like to digress from the ills of aging, Carl's visceral hatred of leggings and his certainty that the world is going to hell in a handbasket and get back to the actual topic of this thread.
I'm not sure this was entirely necessary, PDX.

Back to topic....
In my case, before I entered into my last relationship, I was up front about my unusual style but that I was just a guy who happens to choose to wear a skirt and/or knee boots, with hosiery.

She had the option of not progressing a relationship at that point, but chose to do so. Little did I know that she would twist and use it, amongst other weapons, to psychologically, emotionally and financially abuse. It is an insidious crime, utterly destroying those subjected to it and there are wider consequences.

I can offer no real advice to those already in relationships. As for those considering embarking upon a relationship, I would still countenance openness and honesty at the outset, although there are no guarantees it will not be used against you at a later date.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Caultron wrote:Really? You're less self-conscious about showing your legs in a skirt than, say, shorts or trousers?

Bravo, but how so?
Yep, I know that seems a strange scenario, but my legs look like the twigs of a diseased tree poking from tubes of shorts. My body image in shorts is compromised. In a skirt, I think the proportions are better, thus I become less aware of the other flaws.

Hope that makes some semblance of sense.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Carl, your statement about leggings raised a laugh over here. I can just imagine the ( chain ) reaction if I were to say it! :bom:

DA - the perfect was a little tongue in cheek and whilst she may have some character and attitude flaws I would have extreme difficulty finding anything to blackmail her with. Yes, I have been her rock as she is mine so I have to find some way of getting her through this. I think that this smiley indicates where I feel at the moment. :wall:

Dave, I agree with DA that the statement was uncalled for. You have a very acid tongue at times. The world IS going downhill fast and at an accelerating pace.

This thread has certainly gone around an unusual corner.
I believe in offering every assistance short of actual help but then mainly just want to be left to be myself in all my difference and uniqueness.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

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Sinned wrote:Carl, your statement about leggings raised a laugh over here. I can just imagine the ( chain ) reaction if I were to say it! :bom:
Oh, yeah. That'd achieve critical mass in no time flat.

'Tis a sad thing, but I really wish I had a chance to tell my ex- that before everything imploded. It was something she needed to hear. She may someday, in whatever place she's in now, but it won't be me delivering the line.
Dave, I agree with DA that the statement was uncalled for. You have a very acid tongue at times. The world IS going downhill fast and at an accelerating pace.
I'll take the source into account. Folks with rose-coloured glasses -- and who have forgotten they have them on -- do have a strange perception of the world around them.
This thread has certainly gone around an unusual corner.
Isn't that wonderful? It's like conversations in a meat-space cafe! Speaking of which, it's about time for me to scrape yesterday's dead cells from the ol' carcass and head out for the afternoon! (If nothing else, I need lunch.)
Disaffected citizen wrote:[... I]t is inescapable that abominations outweigh the beautiful in almost everything.
I do not believe so. Beauty is out there, although one must occasionally search it out -- and it shows up in the most amazing places. The trick is being aware that it's "out there" and to be on the lookout. To be "sensitive", so to say.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

Post by Pdxfashionpioneer »

Dennis, I was trying to keep the discussion on point because I thought it was important to you.

Apparently I was mistaken.

My bad.
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Re: Difficulties with partners

Post by Disaffected.citizen »

Pdxfashionpioneer wrote:Dennis, I was trying to keep the discussion on point because I thought it was important to you.

Apparently I was mistaken.

My bad.
Threads drift. When there is a pertinent comment bringing it back on topic then that's entirely appropriate.

The drift to leggings commenced with Sinned, CRFriend responded and I, too, continued. I just felt that your opening paragraph was irrelevant other than as a dig. Sinned seemed to agree. Sorry if that wasn't your intent, it's just the way it read to me.

On a different note, congratulations on the job.
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