Do folks notice or not?

General discussion of skirt and kilt-based fashion for men, and stuff that goes with skirts and kilts.

Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Caultron » Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:12 pm

Happy-N-Skirts wrote:My wife and I are nature and wildlife photographers and travel quite a bit. We spent last weekend in a small desert town with some upscale amenities and a state park with a lot of various scenery and wildlife. We stayed in a nice hotel, ate in restaurants, shopped in local stores, visited various points of interest, gas stations, convenience stores, and visited the park headquarters speaking with rangers, docents, other visitors, etc. We wore skirts for the entire weekend. Mine were two different camouflage patterns. I was very comfortable out and about...

Sounds like a great trip! And congratulations for being skirted the whole time!

In my experience, vacation spots are even more tolerant than home settings. People go on vacations to relax and get mellow, and not to go on moral crusades. They expect to see people from all over, and to see different habits and customs. So if you stay laid back, so will they.

The shopkeepers and clerks, of course, just want your money no matter how you're dressed. And I'm sure it takes very little time before they've seen practically everything you can imagine, and then some.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby skirted_in_SF » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:45 pm

Happy-N-Skirts wrote:There were a couple of times I even forgot I was in a skirt.

I'm getting like that more and more as skirts become pretty much an every day thing again.

Happy-N-Skirts wrote:One time in particular when I was getting out of my truck without looking around first and exposed a lot of thigh.

I took advantage of what might be the last warm day in SF for many months by wearing a 15" (38cm) skirt to the beach (first time out for that skirt). I drive a Mazda3 sedan and probably showed a bit of thigh getting out and in of the car in the lot. Since I was going to the clothing optional end of the beach anyway, I didn't worry much about it. Yes, I did go for maximum vitamin D production while I was on the beach.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Daryl » Wed Oct 18, 2017 5:22 am

I'm convinced that everyone notices but suppresses their reactions. If I wear a kilt, I get comments (all positive), but when in a skirt, almost no comments. People feel they can connect with a man in a kilt, because there's a comfortable explanatory narrative for kilts. They don't feel they can connect with a man in a skirt, because the only explanatory narrative they can imagine is not comfortable, and they'd rather not open a can of worms.

This is both good news and bad news. The good news is that no reaction or suppressed reaction means that people no longer expect others to join in group censure of the person being different. It means that society has changed substantially in 50 years, and that we are safer now to dress as we like than we have been in a long time. The bad news is that the explanatory narrative most people hold is that it's a "gender issues thing". Were people thinking that it's just a new freedom that some men are taking, they would be as openly friendly with a man in a skirt as they are with a man in a kilt. They say things like "that looks comfortable" and "nice skirt" and "where did you get that".

We are not getting the message that it's a freedom available to men out very quickly. My male friends are visibly tolerant of my skirting, but I can feel their empathetic discomfort (they feel embarrassed for me, as we humans do). One tries to make his best imitation Scottish accent even when I'm wearing skirts that could not be mistaken for kilts by Mr. Magoo. He is playing the tape of the narrative he finds comfortable.

I had an experience the other day I'm going to write about in the "out and about" thread, that seems to fit my conclusions here.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby pelmut » Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:48 am

Daryl wrote:I'm convinced that everyone notices but suppresses their reactions. If I wear a kilt, I get comments (all positive), but when in a skirt, almost no comments. People feel they can connect with a man in a kilt, because there's a comfortable explanatory narrative for kilts. They don't feel they can connect with a man in a skirt, because the only explanatory narrative they can imagine is not comfortable, and they'd rather not open a can of worms.

I also found that I got a lot more reactions when I wore a kit than I do now I wear skirts - but they were different from the ones you describe and I have put a different interpretation on it. A high proportion of my kilt encounters had to be handled carefully as they were either mocking or provoking, very few skirt encounters have had anything of that about them.

My interpretation is that, because I wasn't wearing the full regalia and wasn't in a 'display' situation, I was seen by the provoker as a bloke who is afraid of wearing a skirt so he is wearing a kilt instead; someone to be taunted into giving a reaction. There was an element of "what sort of queer are you?" about the encounters. In a skirt they 'know' what I am (whatever individual interpretation they put on that) and don't feel the need to challenge me to find out more. In the unprovocative encounters, I get quite open and friendly enquiries which often lead to pleasant conversations with strangers on all sorts of topics.

The non-interacting encounters can be very revealing if an interaction later becomes inevitable: The shop assistant who saw me arrive and later addresses me as "madam" with no hint that he thinks I am anything else. The person I had to deal with professionally who noticed me earlier in the day and wondered if I was male or female. The organiser at a meeting where I was guest speaker and thought I was a monk (that's what a smart formal evening skirt does for you!). Friends who hang back in public and listen out for comments can also be very helpful; their reports have ranged from "no-one seemed to notice" to "a woman told her daughter that your boots didn't go with your skirt". I don't recall anything more negative than a few amazed stares.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Sinned » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:13 pm

OS, yes I regret now not taking her up on her offer to show her how ridiculous I would look. Then change into my skirt and show her the difference. Not thinking clearly at the time and it was probably a missed opportunity. I'm maybe thinking that part of her problem is that I do look good in a skirt and maybe there's a bit of subconscious jealousy there. Who knows, just when I think that there's a glimmer of understanding she does or says something that demolishes all my theories.

Caultron, just got back from Audiology and the problem was blocked filters in the hearing aids so that the sound wasn't getting to the microphones and hence not to my ears. So now I can hear again. I have some spare filters so I can change them if the problem arises in the future. I managed to sneak out to Audiology in a skirt and get back before she returned. Heh, heh. And nobody took the blindest bit of notice.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Caultron » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:23 pm

Sinned wrote:..An interesting piece to this. When it was apparent that the jeans would be too tight she said that she could lend me a pair of leggings. I just about split my sides and I think she realised what she had just suggested. I said that that was the most ridiculous offering I have heard from her for a long time. She could see that even from her point of view her leggings were women's wear just as she thinks that skirts are only women's wear. I said that I would feel more ridiculous wearing leggings that a skirt. I HATE leggings and that's pretty much all MOH wears nowadays. I'm hoping her suggestion may have started the thinking about the illogicality of her feelings but I doubt it.

You know, I have a pair of "jeggings" that I wear sometimes when going out with my wife, who refuses to be seen in public with me wearing a skirt. They have a denim-like fabric, lots of Lycra, and faux pockets like jeans.

I much prefer wearing a skirt, but the jeggings do provide a way to be out with my wife with me in womenswear. And with the pockets being faux, I have to carry a bag, which she also grudgingly accepts. So I look at the whole style as being a form of gentle pressure.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Sinned » Thu Oct 19, 2017 7:28 am

I get what you are saying, Caultron, and to both MOH and I leggings are a female garment and if she is able to allow me to wear those then it is a step towards her accepting a skirt. I don't wear a skirt or anything just because it's a female garment, I wear it because it's comfortable and fits in with my look. After all I wear the strappy tops which are about as female as they come but which are apt for hot weather without any complaint from her. I will wear them less during winter except maybe as an undergarment. Maybe sometimes we have to take a sideways step before a forward one. It's an avenue I will explore over the coming weeks. Hmmmm.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Daryl » Sat Oct 21, 2017 5:28 am

pelmut wrote:
Daryl wrote:I'm convinced that everyone notices but suppresses their reactions. If I wear a kilt, I get comments (all positive), but when in a skirt, almost no comments. People feel they can connect with a man in a kilt, because there's a comfortable explanatory narrative for kilts. They don't feel they can connect with a man in a skirt, because the only explanatory narrative they can imagine is not comfortable, and they'd rather not open a can of worms.

I also found that I got a lot more reactions when I wore a kit than I do now I wear skirts - but they were different from the ones you describe and I have put a different interpretation on it. A high proportion of my kilt encounters had to be handled carefully as they were either mocking or provoking, very few skirt encounters have had anything of that about them.

My interpretation is that, because I wasn't wearing the full regalia and wasn't in a 'display' situation, I was seen by the provoker as a bloke who is afraid of wearing a skirt so he is wearing a kilt instead; someone to be taunted into giving a reaction. There was an element of "what sort of queer are you?" about the encounters.


I've had maybe two of those provoking types of encounters and indeed wearing a kilt WAS partly because I didn't want to smash the gender norm all at once, but wanted to wear a skirt of some kind. Taking it the next possible logical step and thinking of that as me "hiding" some sexual preversion isn't that unreasonable from a certain POV, just not the only possible next logical step. And that's where the provokers expectation that he won't be one lone asshole doing it is important. More than ever nowadays people mostly expect that they *would* be one lone asshole, so keep their ***** to themselves.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby beachlion » Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:25 pm

Saturday evening is my weekly grocery shopping event. It was quite cold in the afternoon so I wanted to go in a kilt and long socks instead of the denim skirt I was wearing all day. But I could not find my socks so I opted for jeans. It seems the workers were so used to my skirts that I had more puzzled looks than I remember from skirting. So I have to winterize my clothing for sure.
In the end, the wind had died down in such a way that I could have been skirted the way I was before.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Caultron » Sun Oct 22, 2017 9:08 pm

Daryl wrote:Taking it the next possible logical step and thinking of that as me "hiding" some sexual preversion isn't that unreasonable from a certain POV, just not the only possible next logical step. And that's where the provokers expectation that he won't be one lone asshole doing it is important. More than ever nowadays people mostly expect that they *would* be one lone asshole, so keep their ***** to themselves.

Non-straight-arrow sexual and gender preferences are definitely more protected and accepted now than they were in the past.

A lot of that was won by the LGBT alliance, which most of us don't feel a part of, but the benefits spill our way anyway.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby beachlion » Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:17 pm

I had to go out for some shopping, groceries and medical stuff. It was sunny, warm and very windy. The rather stiff denim fabric did not fly up but stuck to my legs with every step. It was a refreshing feeling. Halfway home a young woman was walking towards me. In passing we greeted each other and she did it with a broad approving smile. That made my day.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby JeffB1959 » Sat Oct 28, 2017 1:27 pm

I've probably mentioned this before, but I've found that people will notice what they want to notice while I'm out and about in freestyle mode. On one occasion while in a bookstore, I had a saleslady at the counter compliment me on my handbag. Another time, a couple guys said they liked a pair of high heeled boots I wore. People see what they want, and what they like.
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Darryl » Sun Oct 29, 2017 1:22 am

Well...an interesting day. 40 degrees F around town at noon and I had some errands to run.

Uniform of the Day:
Black long-sleeved scoop-neck sweater dress (knee-length) over black "leather-look" leggings which were over my black support hose. I had a red sleeveless turtleneck under the dress, but ended up pulling on a white long-sleeved turtleneck sweater on top to cut the wind. And I had my 3" heel black ankle boots. And my ubiquitous Tumi over-the-shoulder bag.

I went out to Fazzoli's for their Ultimate Meatball dinner and garlic bread sticks...and since I had forgotten some cooking oil the night before I stopped at the Kroger MarketPlace to pick that up and some Halloween candy. :D

While shopping I noticed one guy do a head turn as he passed me, but of more interest were the ladies, with a fairly common routine...

<Tilt Head>That looks like a dress...and leggings...<UN-tilt Head>...WAIT!...<Tilt Head> Heels? Yes, heels....<UN-tilt Head>

I'd say at least 7 or 8 ladies did this routine, and only one guy reacted that I know of. A much larger percentage of men and women just walked on by. The head tilts were likely needed to see around the side of my shopping cart. Which I was standing tall and proud and pushing...NOT leaning on...although my calves were going "Engineering to Bridge! What's going on up there? Yo! Dude! You're killing us down here!" (They lived. 8) )

Just spreading cognitive dissonance wherever I go. :lol:
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby Daryl » Sun Oct 29, 2017 5:52 am

Darryl wrote:Just spreading cognitive dissonance wherever I go. :lol:


Now that's what I call "man's work"! :mrgreen:
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Re: Do folks notice or not?

Postby JeffB1959 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:56 am

Darryl wrote:Just spreading cognitive dissonance wherever I go. :lol:


Good for you, sir! Keep up the great work! 8)
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