John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

General discussion of skirt and kilt-based fashion for men, and stuff that goes with skirts and kilts.

Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby mugman » Thu Sep 14, 2017 12:35 am

One wonders just how many actually feel like following suit though through seeing one of us skirted or kilted. I believe so far I've only read here about one person, a neighbour, who has been tempted into wearing a mini skirt because his neighbour does. I'm sure that will never be something I will witness myself in a million years. I have an old friend who used to don one of my kilts whenever we went for a hike or something, just, I think, to humour me. Although he always enjoyed the change of dress code he actually said he'd never do it if he was on his own as it made him feel too conspicuous. But two guys in kilts was to him just a laugh.

I fear that most of us will remain lone wolves no matter how much 'by example' we might display in the presence of friends, relations and the public in general. That doesn't bother me too much as I do what I feel like doing anyway. The fact that I never catch sight of anyone else on my travels kilted or skirted, other than a very occasional 'the full works' cross dresser convinces me that our choices won't rub off much, in a noticeable way, on anyone else any time soon.

It would be interesting to learn here just how many of us have been instrumental over the years in changing anyone else's dress sense into skirt or kilt wearing as their everyday choice, or even occasional choice. I believe you have to be born possessing a particular understanding of the clothing logic that drives us. It either clicks with a person without it having to be explained, or not at all.

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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby Caultron » Thu Sep 14, 2017 2:25 am

mugman wrote:...It would be interesting to learn here just how many of us have been instrumental over the years in changing anyone else's dress sense into skirt or kilt wearing as their everyday choice, or even occasional choice...

I've never succeeded In that (to my knowledge) but sometimes when a man asks, "Why are you wearing a kilt?" I respond, "They're really comfortable. You should try one," and sometimes the guy really seems to think about it. Then they might ask, "Where would I buy I one?"

At that point I give them a couple of web sites and then they lose internet. But I really believe if there were a shop here in Phoenix where they could try one on, some of them would.
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby mugman » Thu Sep 14, 2017 5:17 am

The nearest any enquisitive person has come to the question of "why the kilt?" has always connected with the assumption that I have Scottish roots. I then explain that it's purely a choice of comfort and the conversation quickly draws to a close. The last friend I suggested try one laughed and said 'Why on earth would I want to wear a kilt?' Follow that question with any reasoning of improved comfort and you sound like a jessie. If you follow the equality of clothing route with them as an explanation you sound like you're just clutching at straws for an excuse to wear a skirt, as most people, I suspect, couldn't care less at the way men have less choice. I wouldn't be surprised if most actually don't need a large choice as they wear jeans every day.

There are plenty of kilt stores in Scotland. I've spent a couple of weeks there and didn't spot anyone on the street wearing one, apart from bagpipe players busking for tourists. It seems they need a better reason than comfort to sport one, and then many turned out in their various tartans to take part in a cycle race which looked stupid, with kilts dragging against the rear wheels.

No, I see us as a different breed who have delighted in finding the pleasure in using clothing without the stigma of gender correctness getting in the way. Or without any intervention of kilt policing among non-Scottish individuals, and I'm happy with that.

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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 14, 2017 6:03 am

mugman wrote:
No, I see us as a different breed who have delighted in finding the pleasure in using clothing without the stigma of gender correctness getting in the way. Or without any intervention of kilt policing among non-Scottish individuals, and I'm happy with that.

Pete
Yes, a different breed. And if you inquire but lack similar inclinations, I doubt that I can truly explain the appeal.
Last edited by Grok on Thu Sep 14, 2017 6:49 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby moonshadow » Thu Sep 14, 2017 6:41 am

Grok wrote:
mugman wrote:
No, I see us as a different breed who have delighted in finding the pleasure in using clothing without the stigma of gender correctness getting in the way. Or without any intervention of kilt policing among non-Scottish individuals, and I'm happy with that.

Pete
Yes, a different breed. And if you inquire but lack similar inclinations, I doubt that I can truly explain the appeal.


I heard that!

Sometimes I wish M.I.S. would take off simply because it might result in me not being laughed at so much out and about, but yet on the other hand, I do fancy the idea that this style is somewhat of a rarity, and practically unheard of in these parts. Thus presents me in a very unique light. Though most don't understand, the practice does make me feel special to a degree, and personally I do believe....

I am beautiful in the eyes of my creator.... nuff said..

o-CHEERS-LEONARDO-DICAPRIO-570.jpg

Here's to the eccentrics, the unique, the free!
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My clothes do not regender me, I regender my clothes!
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 14, 2017 6:51 am

Indeed, moon shadow...mavericks :!:

But not entirely lone wolves. Because of the Internet, which helps people to find each other.

It is notable that members have occasionally gotten together.
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby moonshadow » Thu Sep 14, 2017 6:58 am

Grok wrote:Indeed, moon shadow...mavericks :!:

But not entirely lone wolves. Because of the Internet, which helps people to find each other. It is notable that members have occasionally gotten together.


Yes, and upon further consideration I understand why I was so well received in my purple attire Tuesday in Monroe County West Virginia (home of the "Mavericks" the high school foot ball team....) Purple is also their school color.

Now I want to go back! :D
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 14, 2017 7:02 am

Purple lovers unite! :idea:
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 14, 2017 7:05 am

:cheers: :cheers:
moonshadow wrote: I do fancy the idea that this style is somewhat of a rarity, and practically unheard of in these parts. Thus presents me in a very unique light. Though most don't understand, the practice does make me feel special to a degree, and personally I do believe....
Special, yes! :D

I had a boyhood secret-I was curious about the clothes that the girls got to wear. (This was back during the 1960s, before females largely switched over to twin pipes). But I kept my mouth shut, kept my curiosity to myself. Thinking back, there must have been a few other boys with a similar interest.
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby mugman » Thu Sep 14, 2017 8:27 am

All I might add is that a forum such as ours is a generous base to touch for understanding, support and ideas. It doesn't matter whether the ideas are appreciated by the world at large or not...if the realisation that what we champion does eventually materialise as sensible then that's very much a useful bonus.

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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby SkirtsDad » Thu Sep 14, 2017 10:08 am

mugman wrote:I fear that most of us will remain lone wolves no matter how much 'by example' we might display in the presence of friends, relations and the public in general. That doesn't bother me too much as I do what I feel like doing anyway. The fact that I never catch sight of anyone else on my travels kilted or skirted, other than a very occasional 'the full works' cross dresser convinces me that our choices won't rub off much, in a noticeable way, on anyone else any time soon."

Try Scotland then! http://www.scotland.org/features/do-sco ... wear-kilts I went to a conference there years ago and there were men in kilts there. Unfortunately I can't comment on the cities as I was in the middle of nowhere staying at a hotel. Locally I've only come across two male skirt wearers... one a young lad in a night club sporting a black leather pleated skirt, and the other I see fairly regularly around the charity shops. The latter usually wears a denim flippy skirt


mugman wrote:"It would be interesting to learn here just how many of us have been instrumental over the years in changing anyone else's dress sense into skirt or kilt wearing as their everyday choice, or even occasional choice. I believe you have to be born possessing a particular understanding of the clothing logic that drives us. It either clicks with a person without it having to be explained, or not at all.

Given the years I've been wearing skirts out, I can't say that people are flocking to follow suit. I would say, through, that by talking to people and gaining their acceptance then people's attitudes have changed, even to the point where people have said that if I get any grief from anyone they will 'sort them out'. So, in that sense, it probably opens the door a little for others to experiment more easily, should they have the desire.
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:25 pm

mugman wrote: I believe you have to be born possessing a particular understanding of the clothing logic that drives us. It either clicks with a person without it having to be explained, or not at all.
Yes, a special breed.
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby Grok » Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:46 pm

SkirtsDad wrote:I can't say that people are flocking to follow suit. I would say, through, that by talking to people and gaining their acceptance then people's attitudes have changed, even to the point where people have said that if I get any grief from anyone they will 'sort them out'. So, in that sense, it probably opens the door a little for others to experiment more easily, should they have the desire.
Progress, if limited-others accepting us mavericks, even if they themselves don't stray from convention.
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby TheSkirtedMan » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:39 pm

As with all aspects of life there are those in favour and those who are not. Others will listen and become supportive. The negative ones always remain as such even when they know their argument is biased and you will not change them.

At the end of the day just be you, be what you want, appear as you want and do what you want so long as no physical harm is done to others.

Nobody is perfect in the eyes of others.

Gender equality/neutrality is a buzz phrase. You can not achieve it if any one person or group is denied yet not for others. The John Lewis decision to drop gender labels for childrens clothes is a step in the right direction. I do not understand the fuss as firstly as is so often said, they are only clothes but secondly, for adult women they have access to mens and womens style clothes but under one gender label, womenswear.
Be yourself because an original is worth more than a copy.
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Re: John Lewis degenderizing kids' clothing labels

Postby moonshadow » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:51 pm

TheSkirtedMan wrote:At the end of the day just be you, be what you want, appear as you want and do what you want so long as no physical harm is done to others.


:cheers:

There it is.... This post is probably one of the best I've read on this site...

As they say over here stateside, "haters gonna hate". Don't mind them.
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